BoxRec

Loads of books call the 1980s welter/middle scene a 'golden age' of boxing.

There is a video called 'four-way rivalry' which showcases Duran, Hearns, Leonard, Hagler fighting amongts each other.

Where the hell is Benitez here?

He was the smoothest, slickest boxer of them all, more so than Sugar Ray Leonard.

Even Leonard said, "no one, and I mean no one, makes me miss like that". The fight with Leonard was an epic, a show of pure boxing ability.

But don't think he couldn't punch. Wilfred could knock out just about anyone with a single punch, and he did this many times. In the commentators opinion, Leonard was the harder puncher, but I don't think so.

OK, he didn't have a particularly good chin, but chins are a physical disadvantage and therefore it's like height and weight, it's irrelevent.

Along with his huge power, he had speed and skill, a master boxer. He beat Duran even. Perfect stance.

His record has eight losses but like most records it's irrelevent. He's up there with all of them.

Who he fought, who he beat, how many he lost. All irrelevent. The only way to determine is to look at him. You'll be quite impressed.

Terap, calm down. Chill.

No I'm not the same Lopman as that. I'm the one that said Louis was a devastating hitter with tremendous power but who slapped(or 'hit with the open glove') sometimes like Ali also did.

Well it just goes to show you how great Benitez was that he could do pretty well even though he was not in good condition.

In the fight Leonard butted Benitez, opening up a gigantic cut high on his forehead.
Benitez' pickup cornermen did not say boo about this and Benitez continued fighting with this huge disadvantage.
You can imagine how Angelo Dundee would have screamed if his fighter Leonard had been injured so severely like this by a non-boxing and illegal "blow."

The cut was caused by an accidental clash of heads, they both leaned forward at the same time if you watch the slow motion.

Actually terap I agree there might have been a fix, he throwed a surprisignly low amount of jabs and if he jabbed more he may have won it.

So what, it may have been fixed and they were not in good condition. But have you seen the fight? It was a masterful display of world-class defensive and technical ability. Seriously, I think it was a good fight.

I get the feeling you haven't seen the fight. It was a good display, no doubt.

"The referee stopped the fight with four seconds left which was garbage in a championship fight."
It was 6 seconds as far as I remember, but yeah that's right.

Are you the same Lopman who started a thread here saying that Joe Louis wasn't such a great puncher?

Give me a break terap, I've seen him fight and I know he's capable. I know you hate Leonard but I'm not talking about Leonard I'm talking about Wilfred.
I've seen his fights with Randy Shields and Maurice Hope and he was great in those too, knocking Hope out with a single right, which proves my point is correct, unless this is another fix and Hope shaking on the ground was a fake..

Terap, you are undoubtedly the most knowledgable past-boxing expert here, but please stop jumping the gun. I respect you.

At 17, Benitez trained seriously for his fight against a prime Antonio Cervantes, outboxing him and winning his first belt with a 15 round decision.

He fought a draw with Harold Weston with only 12 days of training, and won a split decision against Bruce Curry with one week of preparation (although he was knocked down 3 times in this fight)

His preparation for his defense against Leonard is thought to be anywhere between 2 and 9 days.

But even if you dismiss these facts and choose to believe every possible conspiracy theory on his career, there's no way you can deny his extraordinary ring skills, less the impressive defensive tactics he showed on three different weight classes, which I think was the point Lopman was trying to make in the beggining.

And just for the record:

Lopman wrote: No I'm not the same Lopman as that.

Will the real Lopman please step forward?
And please explain to this forum your relationship to the sinister and elusive character known as Neil "The Bounty" Hunter

terap wrote:Hope was a shot and RETIRED fighter before he decided to unretire and come to the US and pick up some dollars fighting Benitez.

In his training for the fight his mouth was cut badly. But the fight went on anyway.
Since Hope was knocked down already in an earlier round of that fight, how in the world could he "knocked out with one punch" in a later round.

ANSWER: He couldn't.

Tell us about Benitez' fights with Bruce Curry.

Terap, as I've said I respect you, you know more than anyone. But you are starting to get really whiny and annoying.

You HAVE NOT read all I've said. I would kindly ask you to answer everything I've said.

And by the way, terap. You do not have to be right about everything, no one knows everything.

Hope started THAT ROUND THE ONE HE WAS KOD IN, NOT groggy.

He had been staggered earlier, but he had recovered. He was not groggy coming in to the 12th.

Benitez knocked him out with ONE SINGLE RIGHT HAND PUNCH that came out of nowhere and knocked him unconscious, shaking on the ground.

Sure, he had a few hooks landed on him in the 12th round, but he was still walking and NOT FALLING ALL OVER THE PLACE.

terap, please stop unjustifiably ACCUSING me of being wrong.

Before you reply, please read my whole last post and answer every line.

Anyway, it's a FACT that you are implying is wrong. He had huge power and could KO with one punch.

Terap, when I joined here you were very nice and courteous and even complimentary. We were both happy to help eah other.

I think you may be having a bad day. Well please don't take it out on others.

Just calm down and don't jump the gun. You seem to want to argue.

At 17, Benitez trained seriously for his fight against a prime Antonio Cervantes, outboxing him and winning his first belt with a 15 round decision.

He fought a draw with Harold Weston with only 12 days of training, and won a split decision against Bruce Curry with one week of preparation (although he was knocked down 3 times in this fight)

His preparation for his defense against Leonard is thought to be anywhere between 2 and 9 days.

But even if you dismiss these facts and choose to believe every possible conspiracy theory on his career, there's no way you can deny his extraordinary ring skills, less the impressive defensive tactics he showed on three different weight classes, which I think was the point Lopman was trying to make in the beggining.

Thank you for that Broncano.

You want to know about his fights with Curry? OK, I cannot comment, because I haven't seen the fights.

But at least I admit that.

terap wrote:Benitez was lacking in punching power.

That is obvious.

Benitez fought unconnected fighter but very good puncher Bruce Curry in NY and was knocked down twice in one round. He most likely would have been knocked down a third time in that round and as a result would have lost to Curry on a TKO---but for the obvious protection of the referee in the rest of that round.

BOX REC SAYS:
"1977-11-18 New York, NY, USA
Benitez is knocked down three times, but because fight is scored on rounds he ekes out a controversial decision. "

The decision was a farce, and it was obvious Curry was robbed because he had no political connections and was fighting the politically connected Benitez.

Curry beat the sh*t out of Benitez in that fight and showed he was by far the superior fighter of the two.

The return match? Garbage.

In order to get Benitez the win he needed the following was done:

They had Curry fight in JAPAN on January 26, 1978--against Minoru Sugiya.

CURRY'S RETURN MATCH WITH BENITEZ took place NINE DAYS LATER !!!!!!!! in New York------on February 4, 1978.

WHICH meant Curry had to fly from Japan to the US in between the two fights and HAD NO TIME TO TRAIN after his fight in Japan before fighting Benitez in NY.

That was so obviously contrived to make sure Curry could not be at his best that it was a big joke at the time.

Unconnected fighter whose OWN MANAGERS were clearly not working in his best interests versus connected, protected fighter.

Bruce Curry was a far better fighter than Benitez ever was.

What would Curry have accomplished in his career if he had managers working in his interests----instead of working in the best interests of his opponents?

This man is a living legend...he has completely changed my outlook on certain boxers...cheers terap.

terap wrote:Benitez was lacking in punching power.

That is obvious.

Terap this is very annoying. I carefully explain why this is NOT true and you reply 'this is obvious' as if you are about to explain why.

But you don't explain why it's "obvious" he's lacking in punching power. And you are avoiding EVERYTHING I say. Why the hell are you making statements as if to sigh and say, 'why me'?

I'm curious as to why he's lacking in punching-power.

Benitez fought unconnected fighter but very good puncher Bruce Curry in NY and was knocked down twice in one round. He most likely would have been knocked down a third time in that round and as a result would have lost to Curry on a TKO---but for the obvious protection of the referee in the rest of that round.

BOX REC SAYS:
"1977-11-18 New York, NY, USA
Benitez is knocked down three times, but because fight is scored on rounds he ekes out a controversial decision. "

The decision was a farce, and it was obvious Curry was robbed because he had no political connections and was fighting the politically connected Benitez.

Curry beat the sh*t out of Benitez in that fight and showed he was by far the superior fighter of the two.

The return match? Garbage.

In order to get Benitez the win he needed the following was done:

They had Curry fight in JAPAN on January 26, 1978--against Minoru Sugiya.

CURRY'S RETURN MATCH WITH BENITEZ took place NINE DAYS LATER !!!!!!!! in New York------on February 4, 1978.

WHICH meant Curry had to fly from Japan to the US in between the two fights and HAD NO TIME TO TRAIN after his fight in Japan before fighting Benitez in NY.

That was so obviously contrived to make sure Curry could not be at his best that it was a big joke at the time.

Unconnected fighter whose OWN MANAGERS were clearly not working in his best interests versus connected, protected fighter.

Bruce Curry was a far better fighter than Benitez ever was.

What would Curry have accomplished in his career if he had managers working in his interests----instead of working in the best interests of his opponents?

Terap, we may have our disagreements.

I disagree with you ignoring every significant part of what I say, and you disagree with me praising Benitez.

But I still respect you as the most knowledgable guy here.

Tyson is right, I agree you are the best conspiracy theorist here and you seem to have an event, fact or very contraversial fight to bash practically every famous or legendary fighter.

You have come to hate Willie Pep, Muhammed Ali, Sugar Ray Leonard and you can back the reason up very impressively(although I think Pep is a legend).

What kind of stuff can you dig out on Lennox Lewis?

You've managed to show up Muhammed Ali and Willie Pep, so how hard can it be to show up a guy 1/10th of what they were?

terap wrote:Don't try your smear word of "hate" with me, Lopman.

I have pointed out that Sandy Saddler knocked out Willie Pep in three fights out of four.

That is the record.

That is not "hate'"

That is the bare facts from the record book.

Keep your attempts at smear words for someone dumb enough to allow you to try that womanish tactic.

Again terap, you are continuously swaying the subject to what suits you.

But for the record, I wasn't insulting you. I heard your comments and they sounded angry so I got the wrong idea. You could have said 'actually I don't hate them, etc.'. I would have done this. But instead you did what you love to do.

Then I asked a question, what do you have on Lewis?

And before that I had made many significant comments. You simply barged right through them and picked out something you could capitalise on to make me look bad. The most insignificant part.

And please don't argue, if you say anything, please make it relevent e.g. a reply to everything I said regarding the boxing side of this argument.

Terap, I'm finished with this argument. It's getting heated and you are not going to answer anything or say anything in reply to anything significant. Instead you will continue handpicking things and ignoring everything relevent.

Please grow up terap. I've been overly nice for too many posts. Seriously, read what I'm saying. PLEASE GROW UP.

If anyone's reading this, anyone other than terap should see how he is being totally unfair.

You are ignoring EVERYTHING I SAY EXCEPT THE PART YOU CAN PATHETICALLY TURN AGAINST ME.

I explain why you are wrong. What do you do? You say the same thing again! You pick out little things from my post and turn it into something bad.

Then you make up some stupid out-of-nowhere comment.

When you post a topic, you get comments.
If you don't like that, then post your thread and block comments from others.

I need you to answer ONE QUESTION for me, even if you dodged all the others. What is your problem? If you have some problem you shouldn't take it out n others.

I'm sure this isn't the first argument you've had.

Lopman, YOU changed the subject to Lewis.

This, like practically everything you've said is pathetic.

I did not SQUARELY accuse you of changing the subject. Just goes to show how well you turn words into something that gets me. If I ask you an off-topic question which I think you would know, it's not to insult you.

But if you say some off-topic accusation, then that is an unfair, below-the-belt blow and you should be corrected for that.

I said simply that when you bash me, you should not pick out things to be used against me. Instead you should answer everything I've said and be reasonable.

You've made half a dozen inaccurate comments which I've pointed out. You are not always right and i'm glad of that. If you were always right you'd be even more obnoxious(if that's possible).

REQUEST
If anyone other than terap is reading this, could they please analyze the whole thread and maybe judge who's wrong or right? I think there would be overwhelming support for me, unless everyone's gone absolutely crazy.

I swear terap if there was a poll on what people think of you you would be surprised at the results.

You have a talent and ability terap. You can piss people off tremendously by turning little things they say into something you can use against them and ignoring everything they say except what suits you.

I say, please stop doing this(which you SHOULD) for 3 threads and still you do the exact same thing.

Actually I think I'm really wasting my time, talking to you is like talking to a brick wall that can talk but cannot listen.

I'm not going to enter into this battle...it's too much fun to watch from the outside.(well, it WAS anyway, for the first few posts.)

However..(as professor irwin corey would say)....this is what I thought when i saw the benitiez /leonard fight. Hey the only reason to stop this is to give Leonard a knockout"...which I assumed was the betting line.Leonard just winning the decision apparently wasn't enough.

Also..i was puzzled (still am when I look at it) at how Benitez didn't even make a token protest over his being stopped...when he obviuosly was no danger and could have finished on his feet.