BoxRec

Posted: **25 Jan 2010, 15:35**

in this thread give your list of fighters and their avoided opponents.
one can also give excuses and reasons why the fights did not happen.
i start , and may edit my list in the future :
floyd mayweather :
miguel cotto
paul williams
antonio margaritto

shane mosley :
floyd mayweather
paul williams

manny pacquiao :
shane mosley

juan manuel marquez :
naseem hamed (marquez was hamed's mandatory but chose not to get his shot)

roy jones :
steve collins
frankie liles
gerald mcclellan
julian jackson

bernard hopkins :
chad dawson
reggie johnson
julian jackson
mike mccallum

george foreman :
lennox lewis

riddick bowe :
lennox lewis

ray leonard :
marvin hagler (rematch)

michael spinks :
tony tucker

did one of the below duck anyone :
vitali klitschko , lennox lewis , wladimir klitschko , nikolay valuev
mike tyson , evander holyfield , oliver mccall , david tua ,
sultan ibragimov , ruslan chagaev , chris byrd
john ruiz , michael moorer , hassim rahman

Posted: **25 Jan 2010, 16:30**

manage a troix wrote:hi all , i want to show you how corrupt ESB is.
a poster there made a thread about ducks , and his thread was closed (as opposed to deleted , but still)
i bring you the original thread's first post here , with a modification or two , regarding the above and the link below which brings you to the closed thread , enjoy and discuss :

in this thread give your list of fighters and their avoided opponents.
one can also give excuses and reasons why the fights did not happen.
i start , and may edit my list in the future :
floyd mayweather :
manny pacquiao
miguel cotto
paul williams
antonio margaritto

shane mosley :
floyd mayweather
paul williams

manny pacquiao :
shane mosley

juan manuel marquez :
naseem hamed (marquez was hamed's mandatory but chose not to get his shot)

roy jones :
steve collins
frankie liles
gerald mcclellan
julian jackson

bernard hopkins :
chad dawson
reggie johnson
julian jackson
mike mccallum

george foreman :
tony tucker
lennox lewis

larry holmes :
george foreman

riddick bowe :
lennox lewis

did one of the below duck anyone :
vitali klitschko , lennox lewis , wladimir klitschko , nikolay valuev
mike tyson , evander holyfield , oliver mccall , david tua ,
sultan ibragimov , ruslan chagaev , chris byrd
john ruiz , michael moorer , hassim rahman

ah , and btw :
http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/...d.php?t=202069

You know......I would have to disagree with you on most of these.

I tend to lead more towards Foreman ducking Holmes than the latter.

Posted: **31 Jan 2010, 15:39**

The End wrote:
You know......I would have to disagree with you on most of these.

I tend to lead more towards Foreman ducking Holmes than the latter.

about what except , foreman ducking holmes (you could be right) do you disagree ?

Posted: **31 Jan 2010, 16:10**

After Jimmy Young gave Ali a boxing lesson to end all boxing lessons--and then was robbed in the travesty of a decision,

Ali would not fight him again.

Posted: **31 Jan 2010, 17:19**

Gerry Cooney wouldn't give Jimmy Young a re-match after getting a lucky shot in and breakimg his face in the process.

Posted: **31 Jan 2010, 20:05**

Jimmy Young gave Ali a boxing lesson to end all boxing lessons.

Harold Johnson and Gene Fullmer delighted in calling attention to the endless ways Young made an ass out of Ali continuously for FIFTEEN rounds when we talked about that fight.

After schooling Ali, Young then beat Ron Lyle and Foreman

and Ali would not give Young a rematch.

Posted: **31 Jan 2010, 23:19**

I'm not positive, but didn't Foreman fail to give Frazier a rematch?

I know, I know, GI and others will say a rematch would have been a pointless exercise, but I'm thinking there was a rematch clause.

Could be wrong about the rematch clause, but I remember Cosell and Durham in the ring in Jamaica talking about a rematch.

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 13:13**

yancey wrote:I'm not positive, but didn't Foreman fail to give Frazier a rematch?

I know, I know, GI and others will say a rematch would have been a pointless exercise, but I'm thinking there was a rematch clause.

Could be wrong about the rematch clause, but I remember Cosell and Durham in the ring in Jamaica talking about a rematch.

maybe you meant rubber-match ? because foreman killed frazier again in their rematch . remember : frazier was a mere cruiserweight , not even a big one , while foreman was a very big heavyweight for his time.
anyway : ali's choices of richard dunn and alfredo evangelista really support the claim that he did avoid a jimmy young rematch , this is without knowing a lot about that time , i admit.

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 13:32**

I think if Jimmy could have kept his head inside the ring, Young might have been champ.

It was not a fight that the fans wanted to see again. Young must have regreted his antics as they must have been the reason he did not ascend to the championship on that day.

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 13:59**

manage a troix wrote:
yancey wrote:I'm not positive, but didn't Foreman fail to give Frazier a rematch?

I know, I know, GI and others will say a rematch would have been a pointless exercise, but I'm thinking there was a rematch clause.

Could be wrong about the rematch clause, but I remember Cosell and Durham in the ring in Jamaica talking about a rematch.
maybe you meant rubber-match ? because foreman killed frazier again in their rematch . remember : frazier was a mere cruiserweight , not even a big one , while foreman was a very big heavyweight for his time.
anyway : ali's choices of richard dunn and alfredo evangelista really support the claim that he did avoid a jimmy young rematch , this is without knowing a lot about that time , i admit.

The fight with Richard Dunn was already scheduled and a mere moth away. After that he fought Norton and Shavers with Evangelista in between. Not too bad for a thirty five year old champ.

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 14:03**

ThatOne wrote:
manage a troix wrote:
yancey wrote:I'm not positive, but didn't Foreman fail to give Frazier a rematch?

I know, I know, GI and others will say a rematch would have been a pointless exercise, but I'm thinking there was a rematch clause.

Could be wrong about the rematch clause, but I remember Cosell and Durham in the ring in Jamaica talking about a rematch.
maybe you meant rubber-match ? because foreman killed frazier again in their rematch . remember : frazier was a mere cruiserweight , not even a big one , while foreman was a very big heavyweight for his time.
anyway : ali's choices of richard dunn and alfredo evangelista really support the claim that he did avoid a jimmy young rematch , this is without knowing a lot about that time , i admit.

The fight with Richard Dunn was already scheduled and a mere moth away. After that he fought Norton and Shavers with Evangelista in between. Not too bad for a thirty five year old champ.

thirty five was never very old in the hw division , and still why didn't he rematch young ?

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 14:07**

1) Thirty five years old has always been old for a boxer, even a heavyweight, and especially a heavyweight who relied on hand speed, foot speed, and reflexes, which are the first to go with age. I'd have to look hard but most champs were considerably younger than that.

2) Why should he rematch Young? He was the champ and Young was the challenger and the challenger lost; notwithstanding the account of the revisionists.

3) There was no market for another fiasco like that fight.

4) The public wanted the Ali-Norton rubber match and that is what they got.

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 14:48**

ThatOne wrote:1)
Why should he rematch Young? He was the champ and Young was the challenger and the challenger lost; notwithstanding the account of the revisionists.

Young "lost" only in the mind of the most rabid, blinded Ali shill.

After he gave Ali a boxing lesson to end all boxing lessons, Jimmy Young beat Ron Lyle and then Foreman.

And Ali still wouldn't fight him.

WHY?

Because Ali knew Young was his complete master.

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 15:35**

granberry wrote:
ThatOne wrote:1)
Why should he rematch Young? He was the champ and Young was the challenger and the challenger lost; notwithstanding the account of the revisionists.

Young "lost" only in the mind of the most rabid, blinded Ali shill.

After he gave Ali a boxing lesson to end all boxing lessons, Jimmy Young beat Ron Lyle and then Foreman.

And Ali still wouldn't fight him.

WHY?

Because Ali knew Young was his complete master.

For the most part, Young was a passive figure against Ali. On six occasions he ducked outside of the ropes and stayed there like a man looking out a window. It was not accidental. He was not slipping a punch. It was unconscionable behavior for a man who wants the heavyweight championship of the world. According to Maryland ring rules, Young should have been censured for this action; it is called a "stand-up knockdown."

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/ ... /index.htm

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 15:36**

How do you like them apples, granberry, errrrrrrr francis?

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 15:37**

I fail to see how mayweather ducked pacquiao. That one is definitely the other way and a lot of these are just strange. When did Foreman duck Tony Tucker? I don't recall any public clamoring for that bout or any mention from anybody wanting to see it.

Roy Jones ducked Julian Jackson? That's a really good one. Love to hear an explanation there.

Leonard ducked the hell out of a Hearns rematch, and a Duran rematch, and a Benitez rematch, and a hagler rematch.

Edit: And LMAO at marquez ducking Hamed. Wow

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 15:57**

A rabid Ali shill like TheOne knows nothing about boxing,

so the best he can do is quote from the ultimate shill organ for Ali, Sports Illustrated.

Jimmy Young exposed the fact that Ali didn't have a clue how to fight a couunterpucher.

Jimmy Young gave Ali a fifteen round boxing lesson that was more than embarassing.

The decision was a travesty.

Young then beat Ron Lyle and then beat Foreman.

But Ali wouldn't dare get into the ring with Young again.

There is nothing that the rabid Ali shills can do about that horrendously embarassing exposure of Ali's limitations.

Nothing except hate Jimmy Young with a passion.

The hatred Ali shills have for Jimmy Young is all-consuming,

because they know in their hearts that Jimmy Young exposed their hero as far less than what the news media trumped him up to be.

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 16:03**

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I fail to see how mayweather ducked pacquiao. That one is definitely the other way

maybe you're right here

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: and a lot of these are just strange. When did Foreman duck Tony Tucker? I don't recall any public clamoring for that bout or any mention from anybody wanting to see it.

maybe you're right again , a combination of spinks ducked tucker and foreman ducked schulz

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: Roy Jones ducked Julian Jackson? That's a really good one. Love to hear an explanation there.

jones avoided every prime in shape or close to it opponent in his rise to stardom. jackson was such and a title holder in that time.
a fact is he was dethroned by mcclellan after a tough fight with tate and jones kept his distance from him , mcclellan , toney , collins , reggie johnson , etc in that time.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: Leonard ducked the hell out of a Hearns rematch,

maybe you're right here , but a rematch did occur in an even worse time for leonard.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: and a Duran rematch

it happened , and leonard stopped him then , No mas , remember ?

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: and a Benitez rematch,

what for ? leonard stopped him the first time and benitez would have shown even less resistance in such a rematch , had it occurred .

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: and a hagler rematch.

here ur definitely right.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote: Edit: And LMAO at marquez ducking Hamed. Wow

http://boxrec.com/media/index.php?title=Human:4462
juan moneyel marquez

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 16:05**

You like apples, granberry, errrrr francis?

Ali was a shell of himself. His reflexes were gone. His hand speed was gone. His foot speed was gone... He weighed more for that fight than for any fight in his career except his last fight with Trevor Berbick. He was thirty four years old, and had been through three wars with Frazier as well as wars with Foreman and Norton. And still Young ran like a scared rabbit all night.

How do you like them apples, francis?

I know more about boxing than you know about heterosexual intercourse, francis. Take that for what you will.

LOL

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 16:16**

granberry wrote:

Jimmy Young gave Ali a fifteen round boxing lesson that was more than embarassing.

There is nothing that the rabid Ali shills can do about that horrendously embarassing exposure of Ali's limitations.

I think you mean "embarrassing" francis.

Maybe Anton will lock this thread so you can avoid further embarrassment.

Posted: **01 Feb 2010, 17:35**

manage a troix wrote:
SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I fail to see how mayweather ducked pacquiao. That one is definitely the other way
maybe you're right here
SaadOffTheDeck wrote: and a lot of these are just strange. When did Foreman duck Tony Tucker? I don't recall any public clamoring for that bout or any mention from anybody wanting to see it.
maybe you're right again , a combination of spinks ducked tucker and foreman ducked schulz
SaadOffTheDeck wrote: Roy Jones ducked Julian Jackson? That's a really good one. Love to hear an explanation there.
jones avoided every prime in shape or close to it opponent in his rise to stardom. jackson was such and a title holder in that time.
a fact is he was dethroned by mcclellan after a tough fight with tate and jones kept his distance from him , mcclellan , toney , collins , reggie johnson , etc in that time.
SaadOffTheDeck wrote: Leonard ducked the hell out of a Hearns rematch,
maybe you're right here , but a rematch did occur in an even worse time for leonard.
SaadOffTheDeck wrote: and a Duran rematch
it happened , and leonard stopped him then , No mas , remember ?
SaadOffTheDeck wrote: and a Benitez rematch,
what for ? leonard stopped him the first time and benitez would have shown even less resistance in such a rematch , had it occurred .
SaadOffTheDeck wrote: and a hagler rematch.
here ur definitely right.
SaadOffTheDeck wrote: Edit: And LMAO at marquez ducking Hamed. Wow
http://boxrec.com/media/index.php?title=Human:4462
juan moneyel marquez

I'm not a Jones apologist, but you're suggesting he ducked a guy while Roy was just a prospect. That doesn't make any sense. By the time Roy fought Hopkins, Julian was finished as a viable opponent. You also should drop Reggie Johnson & Toney from the list, they got schooled. Why no Michalczewski?

Worse time for leonard? The only reason Ray fought Hearns again is because Tommy was floored by Kinchen and they thought he was shot. An immediate rematch would have been far worse for Leonard.

I was referring to a rubber match after No mas, Leonard got his rematch. Duran should have got his.

Benitez deserved a rematch for several reasons.

1. In that day and age, champions got rematches more often than not.
2. It was a close fight
3. leonard headbutted him early and blood was pouring in his eye for the majority of the fight.

A lot of people make the mistake of labeling a fight not happening as "ducking". I didn't read the link as I am working, but if it suggests that Marquez ducked Hamed it's utter rubbish. This thread is the first time I've ever seen it mentioned any other way than Naseem ducking Marquez. I thought that was understood. JMM was the #1 contender for years.

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