BoxRec

I am currently trying to devise a 32 man Heavyweight tournament...
But I am unsure of who I should put into the Tournament, and I need the help of BOXREC members to help me decide who to put into the tournament.

Currently, I have already entered my top 8 Heavyweights:
Muhammad Ali, Joe Louis, Rocky Marciano, George Foreman,
Jack Johnson, Jack Dempsey, Joe Frazier, Mike Tyson

(please don't mention these boxer sin your replies, they are already entered)

Could you guys give me a list of 22 other boxers who have fought at heavyweight who you think should enter the tournament...

NOTE: You can only include boxers who have actually fought at Heavyweight.

I am thinking that these 22 boxers should be included:

Larry Holmes, Sonny Liston, Floyd Patterson, Jersey Joe Walcott
Gene Tunney, Ezzard Charles, Archie Moore, Max Schmeling
Lennox Lewis, Evander Holyfield, Max Baer, John L. Sullivan
James J. Braddock, Jim Jeffries, Sam Langford, Roland La Starza,
Primo Carnera, Vitali Klitchsko, Wladimir Klitchsko, James "Buster" Douglas,
Marvin Hart, Leon Spinks

My next 22 in no order:

-Larry Holmes
-Sonny Liston
-Evander Holyfield
-Ezzard Charles
-Jersey Joe Walcott
-Max Schmeling
-Jack Sharkey
-Floyd Patterson
-Ken Norton
-Lennox Lewis
-Max Baer
-Harry Wills
-Joe Jeannette
-Sam McVey
-Ingo Johansson
-Jerry Quarry
-Jim Jefferies
-George Godfrey
-Jimmy Young
-Eddie Machen
-Primo Carnera
-Earnie Shavers

Not to be pedantic or anything, but if you need 32 and you have 8 already, then you need 24, not 22, more.

With Jack Johnson, Jack Dempsey, Joe Louis, Rocky Marciano, Muhammad Ali, Joe Frazier, and George Foreman (chron order) already in, I suggest the following 24 fighters (also chron order) to round out your top 32:

--Peter Jackson
--Jim Corbett
--Jim Jeffries
--Joe Jeannette
--Sam Langford
--Sam McVey
--Harry Wills
--Jess Willard
--Gene Tunney
--Jack Sharkey
--George Godfrey (II)
--Max Schmeling
--Max Baer
--Jersey Joe Walcott
--Ezzard Charles
--Floyd Patterson
--Sonny Liston
--Larry Holmes
--Evander Holyfield
--Riddick Bowe
--Lennox Lewis
--Ike Ibeabuchi
--Vitaly Klitschko
--Wladmimr Klitschko

[Others worthy of consideration (again, chron order): John L. Sullivan, Bob Fitzsimmons, Tom Sharkey, Fred Fulton, Harry Greb, Tommy Gibbons, Luis Angel Firpo, Elmer Violent Ray, Jimmy Bivins, Archie Moore, Ingemar Johansson, Ernie Terrell, Jimmy Ellis, Jerry Quarry, Ken Norton, Jimmy Young, Gerry Cooney, Tim Witherspoon, Pinklon Thomas, Michael Spinks, Buster Douglas, Michael Moorer, Chris Byrd, David Tua.]

dempseyfire wrote:My next 22 in no order:

-Larry Holmes
-Sonny Liston
-Evander Holyfield
-Ezzard Charles
-Jersey Joe Walcott
-Max Schmeling
-Jack Sharkey
-Floyd Patterson
-Ken Norton
-Lennox Lewis
-Max Baer
-Harry Wills
-Joe Jeannette
-Sam McVey
-Ingo Johansson
-Jerry Quarry
-Jim Jefferies
-George Godfrey
-Jimmy Young
-Eddie Machen
-Primo Carnera
-Earnie Shavers

Primo Carnera? Ahead of V. Klitschko?

I'm no fan of the Klitschkos but Primo Carnera?

Crease wrote:I am thinking that these 22 boxers should be included:

Larry Holmes, Sonny Liston, Floyd Patterson, Jersey Joe Walcott
Gene Tunney, Ezzard Charles, Archie Moore, Max Schmeling
Lennox Lewis, Evander Holyfield, Max Baer, John L. Sullivan
James J. Braddock, Jim Jeffries, Sam Langford, Roland La Starza,
Primo Carnera, Vitali Klitchsko, Wladimir Klitchsko, James "Buster" Douglas,
Marvin Hart, Leon Spinks

Buster Douglas,Leon Spinks,Marvin Hart,Primo Carnera,Roland La Starza,Sam Langford??????
Not these guys!!!!!!

hitman09 wrote:

dempseyfire wrote:My next 22 in no order:

-Larry Holmes
-Sonny Liston
-Evander Holyfield
-Ezzard Charles
-Jersey Joe Walcott
-Max Schmeling
-Jack Sharkey
-Floyd Patterson
-Ken Norton
-Lennox Lewis
-Max Baer
-Harry Wills
-Joe Jeannette
-Sam McVey
-Ingo Johansson
-Jerry Quarry
-Jim Jefferies
-George Godfrey
-Jimmy Young
-Eddie Machen
-Primo Carnera
-Earnie Shavers

Primo Carnera? Ahead of V. Klitschko?

I'm no fan of the Klitschkos but Primo Carnera?

Ye but this poster HATES the brothers!

hitman09 wrote:

dempseyfire wrote:My next 22 in no order:

-Larry Holmes
-Sonny Liston
-Evander Holyfield
-Ezzard Charles
-Jersey Joe Walcott
-Max Schmeling
-Jack Sharkey
-Floyd Patterson
-Ken Norton
-Lennox Lewis
-Max Baer
-Harry Wills
-Joe Jeannette
-Sam McVey
-Ingo Johansson
-Jerry Quarry
-Jim Jefferies
-George Godfrey
-Jimmy Young
-Eddie Machen
-Primo Carnera
-Earnie Shavers

Primo Carnera? Ahead of V. Klitschko?

I'm no fan of the Klitschkos but Primo Carnera?

Carnera beat HOFers Sharkey and Loughran plus Uzcudun, Schaeff, Gross, Lasky, and Levinsky. He was also the linear, undisputed champion.

Even though I think Vitali would've beaten him head to head I'll take Primo's victories over Klitschko's drubbings of fat never-weres, none of whom anyone would ever consider a HOFer let alone a great fighter and his WBC trinket-belt.

dempseyfire wrote:

hitman09 wrote:

dempseyfire wrote:My next 22 in no order:

-Larry Holmes
-Sonny Liston
-Evander Holyfield
-Ezzard Charles
-Jersey Joe Walcott
-Max Schmeling
-Jack Sharkey
-Floyd Patterson
-Ken Norton
-Lennox Lewis
-Max Baer
-Harry Wills
-Joe Jeannette
-Sam McVey
-Ingo Johansson
-Jerry Quarry
-Jim Jefferies
-George Godfrey
-Jimmy Young
-Eddie Machen
-Primo Carnera
-Earnie Shavers

Primo Carnera? Ahead of V. Klitschko?

I'm no fan of the Klitschkos but Primo Carnera?

Carnera beat HOFers Sharkey and Loughran plus Uzcudun, Schaeff, Gross, Lasky, and Levinsky. He was also the linear, undisputed champion.

Even though I think Vitali would've beaten him head to head I'll take Primo's victories over Klitschko's drubbings of fat never-weres, none of whom anyone would ever consider a HOFer let alone a great fighter and his WBC trinket-belt.

Wouldn't a tournament be more predicated on match ups as opposed to resume? Vitali's resume is shit but in this mythical world of a 32 man tournament that would take care of itself. I don't see any reason to watch somebody beat the living hell out of carnera.

For my money, Tim witherspoon would be a better participant than either of them. I would really love to see Ali/Witherspoon. I think that would be a great and close fight.

Mr E wrote:Not to be pedantic or anything, but if you need 32 and you have 8 already, then you need 24, not 22, more.

With Jack Johnson, Jack Dempsey, Joe Louis, Rocky Marciano, Muhammad Ali, Joe Frazier, and George Foreman (chron order) already in, I suggest the following 24 fighters (also chron order) to round out your top 32:

--Peter Jackson
--Jim Corbett
--Jim Jeffries
--Joe Jeannette
--Sam Langford
--Sam McVey
--Harry Wills
--Jess Willard
--Gene Tunney
--Jack Sharkey
--George Godfrey (II)
--Max Schmeling
--Max Baer
--Jersey Joe Walcott
--Ezzard Charles
--Floyd Patterson
--Sonny Liston
--Larry Holmes
--Evander Holyfield
--Riddick Bowe
--Lennox Lewis
--Ike Ibeabuchi
--Vitaly Klitschko
--Wladmimr Klitschko

[Others worthy of consideration (again, chron order): John L. Sullivan, Bob Fitzsimmons, Tom Sharkey, Fred Fulton, Harry Greb, Tommy Gibbons, Luis Angel Firpo, Elmer Violent Ray, Jimmy Bivins, Archie Moore, Ingemar Johansson, Ernie Terrell, Jimmy Ellis, Jerry Quarry, Ken Norton, Jimmy Young, Gerry Cooney, Tim Witherspoon, Pinklon Thomas, Michael Spinks, Buster Douglas, Michael Moorer, David Tua.]

Ike who?

^^^Otherwise known as the most over-rated fighter of all-time.

Muhammad Ali, Joe Louis, Rocky Marciano, George Foreman,
Jack Johnson, Jack Dempsey, Joe Frazier, Mike Tyson

Larry Holmes
Lennox Lewis
Sonny Liston
Evander Holyfield
Floyd Patterson
Jersey Joe Walcott
Ken Norton
Max Schmeling
Jerry Quarry
Riddick Bowe
W. Klitschko
V. Klitschko
Ezzard Charles
Gene Tunney
Archie Moore
Ernie Shavers
Michael Moorer
Ron Lyle
Max Baer
David Tua
Gerry Cooney
John L. Sullivan
Mike Weaver

I took liberties with Tua, Shavers, and Weaver for entertainment value.

Yep, you need 24 more heavyweights, so in no particular order:

Floyd Patterson
Harry Wills
Evander Holyfield
Max Schmeling
Larry Holmes
Jersey Joe Walcott
Lennox Lewis
Sonny Liston
Max Baer
Ken Norton
Riddick Bowe
Vitali Klitschko
Wladimir Klitschko
James J Jeffries
Ezzard Charles
Jack Sharkey
Joe Jeanette
Sam McVea
Ingemar Johansson
Jerry Quarry
Primo Carnera
Earnie Shavers
Eddie Machen
Gene Tunney
Sam Langford

Good luck with the tournament!

jezzamundo wrote:Yep, you need 24 more heavyweights, so in no particular order:

Floyd Patterson
Harry Wills
Evander Holyfield
Max Schmeling
Larry Holmes
Jersey Joe Walcott
Lennox Lewis
Sonny Liston
Max Baer
Ken Norton
Riddick Bowe
Vitali Klitschko
Wladimir Klitschko
James J Jeffries
Ezzard Charles
Jack Sharkey
Joe Jeanette
Sam McVea
Ingemar Johansson
Jerry Quarry
Primo Carnera
Earnie Shavers
Eddie Machen
Gene Tunney
Sam Langford

Good luck with the tournament!

This is a solid list, I'd ditch Carnera for Spoon as mentioned earlier & I prefer Jimmy Young to Machen.

Tough to split Young & Machen. Excellent fighters, the pair of 'em.

Will the results be published here?

Hmm. Ike Ibeabuchi was and remains a psycho criminal scumbag, no question, but you guys are kidding yourselves if you don't believe that he had unbelievable potential. He didn't fully develop but I submit that the Ibeabuchi who got thrown into the slammer would have bounced guys like Carnera and Shavers, who are getting some play here, around the ring like basketballs (for as long as they lasted).

I might agree with Carnera...but Shavers? how bout Lyle ? Quarry? Liston? He bounce them around like basketballs aswell?

Panzerfaust wrote:I might agree with Carnera...but Shavers? how bout Lyle ? Quarry? Liston? He bounce them around like basketballs aswell?

Come on; to make it a contest you have to leave Ike out of this because he would have bounced them all around like basketballs. Hell, he beat Tua and Byrd, who are these guys????

Panzerfaust wrote:I might agree with Carnera...but Shavers? how bout Lyle ? Quarry? Liston? He bounce them around like basketballs aswell?

Geez, I hate to find myself in the position of defending a dirtbag like Ibeabuchi but he was a darn good fighter.

Anyway, you didn't just put Sonny Liston in the same class as Earnie Shavers did you?

Personally, I rate Shavers below Lyle and Quarry and 10 miles below Liston. But to answer you question, I'd make Ibeabuchi a big underdog against Liston, pick 'em v. Quarry, a favorite over Lyle, and a big favorite over Shavers and Carnera.

Mr E wrote:Hmm. Ike Ibeabuchi was and remains a psycho criminal scumbag, no question, but you guys are kidding yourselves if you don't believe that he had unbelievable potential. He didn't fully develop but I submit that the Ibeabuchi who got thrown into the slammer would have bounced guys like Carnera and Shavers, who are getting some play here, around the ring like basketballs (for as long as they lasted).

The most over-rated nobody of all-time = Ike Ibeabuchi.

You are kidding yourself if you think he was even a fraction as good as his legions will have you believe. Achieved nothing, accomplished nothing. Boxing is literally choked at the gills with similar fighters through history who receive not one jot of attention.

It's been ten years. Let's move on.

"...But to answer you question, I'd make Ibeabuchi a big underdog against Liston, pick 'em v. Quarry, a favorite over Lyle, and a big favorite over Shavers and Carnera." - E

LMAO. & the, "legend" continues. I expect Byrd & Tua must rank in your top ten or fifteen all-time HW's, given Ibeabuchi's status.

There are tons of heavyweights who if they'd gone to jail at certain pts in their careers they could've reached mythical status too. I'm not very impressed by Ike's performance vs Tua . .he struggled to outbox Tua in a very close fight and basically had to outwork him whereas Rahman, Byrd and Lewis easily outboxed Tua (hell, Oquendo easily outboxed him before getting KTFO) and he caught a green Byrd with a great shot in a fight that was basically even (HBO's bias against Byrd was ridiculous, there is no way Ike was ahead at the time of the stoppage 3-1 . .I had it 2-1-1 Byrd )

Okay...so you already have, in alphabetical order:

Muhammad Ali
Jack Dempsey
George Foreman
Joe Frazier
Jack Johnson
Joe Louis
Rocky Marciano
Mike Tyson

Off the top of my head, I would add, also in alphabetical order:

Max Baer
Riddick Bowe
Tommy Burns
Primo Carnera
James Corbett
Ezzard Charles
Bob Fitzsimmons
Larry Holmes
Evander Holyfield
Peter Jackson
James Jeffries
Vitali Klitschko
Wladimir Klitschko
Sam Langford
Lennox Lewis
Sonny Liston
Floyd Patterson
Max Schmeling
John Sullivan
Gene Tunney
Joe Walcott
Sam McVea
Jess Willard
Harry Wills

dempseyfire wrote:There are tons of heavyweights who if they'd gone to jail at certain pts in their careers they could've reached mythical status too. I'm not very impressed by Ike's performance vs Tua . .he struggled to outbox Tua in a very close fight and basically had to outwork him whereas Rahman, Byrd and Lewis easily outboxed Tua (hell, Oquendo easily outboxed him before getting KTFO) and he caught a green Byrd with a great shot in a fight that was basically even (HBO's bias against Byrd was ridiculous, there is no way Ike was ahead at the time of the stoppage 3-1 . .I had it 2-1-1 Byrd )

Tua/Ike was the most overrated fight ever. I missed it live for whatever reason and then bought the DVD and was shocked at how uneventful it was. Not that it sucked, just not even close to what people make it out to be.

I hated Lennox, but he would have taken Ike to school in a big way.

I fell into the same trap with a DVD of Ibeabuchi-Tua. Was hugely disappointed following the hype. Ibeabuchi looked pretty good (never was what people say of him, or even close, though) but the fight itself was made out to be something it wasn't even a shadow of.