Steve Collins - The Celtic Warrior - Irish Legend!

[bigdarkhorse]

Steve is coming to Galpharm Stadium, Huddersfield for a celebration dinner of his ring career which will also feature former undisputed welterweight champ John H Stracey.

If you could ask Steve Collins a question regarding his career what would it be?

See http://www.seeitnowsports.com for full event details...

Im interested in his time under Freddie Roach considering what Freddie has gone on to achieve as a trainer. Steve will also be watching the pacman v margarito scrap at the Grovsvenor Casino also in Huddersfield.

[gizmo1]

One of our posters (Kingfinn) is adamant that Collins is British. He argued long and hard on one thread that Collins is British because all Irish people (whether from the North or South) are automatically British. It would be good to know whether The Celtic Warrior considers himself British.

[J]

One of our posters (Kingfinn) is adamant that Collins is British. He argued long and hard on one thread that Collins is British because all Irish people (whether from the North or South) are automatically British. It would be good to know whether The Celtic Warrior considers himself British.

ffsake.

[bigdarkhorse]

I would prefer to keep the questions related to his ring match-ups etc

[Bricks]

Would be interesting to know what Collins thinks would have happened if he met Calzaghe in his prime, and how he rates Calzaghe who reigned over a weaker division with the guys he (Collins) had to compete with such as a peak Eubanks, Benn, Mclellan, Mccallum, Jones jnr etc

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

One of our posters (Kingfinn) is adamant that Collins is British. He argued long and hard on one thread that Collins is British because all Irish people (whether from the North or South) are automatically British. It would be good to know whether The Celtic Warrior considers himself British.

ffsake.

X 2 - We don't need this shite in every thread do we?

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

Would be interesting to know what Collins thinks would have happened if he met Calzaghe in his prime, and how he rates Calzaghe who reigned over a weaker division with the guys he (Collins) had to compete with such as a peak Eubanks, Benn, Mclellan, Mccallum, Jones jnr etc

I like what you post usually Mugabi I have to respectfully disagree with the point you made that Collins fought and beat Eubank and Benn at their 'peak' I would say that a weight drained Eubank who completed his daft 'world tour' and Benn who was massively shot would have beaten Collins without too much difficulty in their primes.

Collins was a fighter in the right place at the right time. He didn't distinuish himself as champion - didn't he defend against Cornelius Carr?

Collins was what he was - a good, tough, middleweight contender who would have never been champion a decade earlier.

[mickey1975]

Benn didnt even train for the Collins rematch.He did the weight in the sauna.He took the fight for the cash,he knew he was done,and he told that to a friend of mine.

[Craig14]

I think Steve Collins was well overated, He beat both Chris Eubank and Nigel Benn after there primes and apart from that only beat good domestic fighters Chris Pyatt,Corneilius Carr and Neville Brown. Hardly the stuff of legends.

[orbtastic]

He was clearly a level above quality domestic operators but some way shy of top world class as evidenced in his gritty but ultimately, not quite good enough performances against McCallum, Johnson & Kalambay.

I never really liked him but he made the most of what he had and completely [mentally] screwed with Eubank in the first fight but Eubank let the KO victory slip through his fingers. Eubank also never really had an answer to his come-forward windmilling at times, which was odd given how much he liked to sit back and counterpunch. I remember him in the corner, out of breath saying to Davies "he keeps coming..."

[Ketchel]

He was clearly a level above quality domestic operators but some way shy of top world class as evidenced in his gritty but ultimately, not quite good enough performances against McCallum, Johnson & Kalambay.

I never really liked him but he made the most of what he had and completely [mentally] screwed with Eubank in the first fight but Eubank let the KO victory slip through his fingers. Eubank also never really had an answer to his come-forward windmilling at times, which was odd given how much he liked to sit back and counterpunch. I remember him in the corner, out of breath saying to Davies "he keeps coming..."

While Collins fell short against the top guys, the McCallum fight falling early in his career, I don't think Benn or Eubank would have beaten McCallum or Johnson either. Remember how McCallum schooled Michael Watson? Collins' performance against the Bodysnatcher was better.

Collins should be given his due for going out to this States and learning his trade away from home, fighting some of the best guys in the divison then coming to Britain using his experience to unfaze the likes of Benn and Eubank. People should remember that Collins beat a better version of Eubank than Calzaghe did and did it easier.

[jamesmcdonnell]

He was clearly a level above quality domestic operators but some way shy of top world class as evidenced in his gritty but ultimately, not quite good enough performances against McCallum, Johnson & Kalambay.

I never really liked him but he made the most of what he had and completely [mentally] screwed with Eubank in the first fight but Eubank let the KO victory slip through his fingers. Eubank also never really had an answer to his come-forward windmilling at times, which was odd given how much he liked to sit back and counterpunch. I remember him in the corner, out of breath saying to Davies "he keeps coming..."

While Collins fell short against the top guys, the McCallum fight falling early in his career, I don't think Benn or Eubank would have beaten McCallum or Johnson either. Remember how McCallum schooled Michael Watson? Collins' performance against the Bodysnatcher was better.

Collins should be given his due for going out to this States and learning his trade away from home, fighting some of the best guys in the divison then coming to Britain using his experience to unfaze the likes of Benn and Eubank. People should remember that Collins beat a better version of Eubank than Calzaghe did and did it easier.

McCallum was the real deal alright. The only guy to beat him clearly in his prime was James Toney, before he eat his way through the divisions.

Benn would have been taken apart by McCallum brutally, Eubank, probably lost on points in a fairly dreary fight, McCallum was better in 3every department. Opps and Kalambay, always forget that one!

[orbtastic]

Yeah, that's right - I was going to mention the one-sided beatdown that Watson got, which ended in him being brutally KO'd, and that was against a significantly older McCallum, which many thought was perhaps ripe for the taking by Watson.

I think Collins studied/worked fairly hard under the Petronelli brothers whilst an electrician in Boston, right?

Agree that Benn and Eubank would have also lost to Johnson, Kalambay and McCallum - "Peak for peak", obviously. I'm a huge Benn fan but Mike is all wrong for him, he gets brutalised here.

While there's no doubt that Calzaghe definitely got a rub of the green in facing a late notice Eubank who had to boil down ridiculously to make 168, Calzaghe won far more clearly on the cards, despite the last minute surge from him which saw Joe stunned just before the bell.

[Counter-puncher]

While Collins fell short against the top guys, the McCallum fight falling early in his career, I don't think Benn or Eubank would have beaten McCallum or Johnson either. Remember how McCallum schooled Michael Watson? Collins' performance against the Bodysnatcher was better.

.

good point, and one i have long racked my brains over. i consider Watson to be fundamentally a better fighter than Collins and yet as you say whereas Watson took a frightful hammering from MM, a much greener Collins (16 fights or so?) took 5 rounds off MM and had him looking just a bit uncomfortable

my only explanation being that Collins' chin was obviously excellent, and his stamina equally so, and the 'just keeps coming' effect got to MM a bit

i seem to recall reading an anecdote from one of MM's current charges along the lines of hitting Collins so repeatedly without much visible effect was a psychological drainer. i'll try and find the quote.

[orbtastic]

Watson also played completely into Mike's hands by going all out - Insane tactics. He somehow got it into his head he was going to knock him out. I can't remember the exact quote from him in his book but you only have to look at him in that 11th round, waving McCallum on as he's teeing off on Watson upstairs and downstairs to see his mindset.

[yiddo14]

He was clearly a level above quality domestic operators but some way shy of top world class as evidenced in his gritty but ultimately, not quite good enough performances against McCallum, Johnson & Kalambay.

I never really liked him but he made the most of what he had and completely [mentally] screwed with Eubank in the first fight but Eubank let the KO victory slip through his fingers. Eubank also never really had an answer to his come-forward windmilling at times, which was odd given how much he liked to sit back and counterpunch. I remember him in the corner, out of breath saying to Davies "he keeps coming..."

While Collins fell short against the top guys, the McCallum fight falling early in his career, I don't think Benn or Eubank would have beaten McCallum or Johnson either. Remember how McCallum schooled Michael Watson? Collins' performance against the Bodysnatcher was better.

Collins should be given his due for going out to this States and learning his trade away from home, fighting some of the best guys in the divison then coming to Britain using his experience to unfaze the likes of Benn and Eubank. People should remember that Collins beat a better version of Eubank than Calzaghe did and did it easier.

Collins-Eubank 1 was a lot closer than Calzaghe-Eubank. He beat a better version though agreed, although not the best version.
Collins-Benn was a joke. I remember thinking that when I was a kid watching it! Benn left a huge piece of himself in the ring with the G-Man.

[Counter-puncher]

Watson also played completely into Mike's hands by going all out - Insane tactics. He somehow got it into his head he was going to knock him out. I can't remember the exact quote from him in his book but you only have to look at him in that 11th round, waving McCallum on as he's teeing off on Watson upstairs and downstairs to see his mindset.

aye, mind you Collins fought pretty damn aggressively against Mike too. biggest difference being he waited till Mike was tired to do it from rds 7 onwards.

RE Watson's aggression, pretty sure he tried to start out boxing. realised, pretty quickly, he wasn't going to outbox him, so went on the attack. it was actually possibly the only way he could have survived the first 6 rounds- he was getting picked painfully apart trying to box, conversely and paradoxically he at least slowed MM's attack down a bit when he went onto the front foot. if that makes sense.

[nobby_nobbins]

I would like to ask the Celtic Warrior why he backed down from a fight with Calzaghe just because of a blister on his toe and then retired.

[Counter-puncher]

^^^ playing to the cardiff crowd as celeverly as that, he wasn't stupid, no

Matt- re the watson fight. obvously i have watched it over and over again. rds1-4, McCallum misses almost nothing. Its fcking eery how accurate he is and how well he anticipates Watson's movements etiehr offensive or defensive.

[orbtastic]

^^^ playing to the cardiff crowd as celeverly as that, he wasn't stupid, no

Matt- re the watson fight. obvously i have watched it over and over again. rds1-4, McCallum misses almost nothing. Its fcking eery how accurate he is and how well he anticipates Watson's movements etiehr offensive or defensive.

Yeah, and some rounds he starts off with a left hook to the body. It's almost poetry to watch at times.

[nobby_nobbins]

When Collins did the dinner show in Cardiff, Calzaghe was obviously brought up during the Q&A session and a member of the audience asked Collins why the fight never materialised and he said something along the lines of 'I'm Irish, not stupid'.

I think that answered my question!

[Counter-puncher]

^^^ playing to the cardiff crowd as celeverly as that, he wasn't stupid, no

Matt- re the watson fight. obvously i have watched it over and over again. rds1-4, McCallum misses almost nothing. Its fcking eery how accurate he is and how well he anticipates Watson's movements etiehr offensive or defensive.

Yeah, and some rounds he starts off with a left hook to the body. It's almost poetry to watch at times.

makes me let out all kinds of appreciative grunts and noises and 'shot, son's and sex-type groans.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Watson also played completely into Mike's hands by going all out - Insane tactics. He somehow got it into his head he was going to knock him out. I can't remember the exact quote from him in his book but you only have to look at him in that 11th round, waving McCallum on as he's teeing off on Watson upstairs and downstairs to see his mindset.

According to Watson's book, an injury to his Ankle I think it was, meant that he had to abandon his tactics of trying to box McCallum at range instead of rushing him head one.

Personally - I don't think he could have outboxed McCallum at range - I think he would have lost hands down, however, he probably wouldn't have been brutalised like he was.

Of course, you have to take boxers excuses with a ladle of salt, whilst there may have been an injury, a fighter will naturally highlight that as the cause for their defeat, rather than the fact their opponent was the better man - it's human nature.

[jamesmcdonnell]

^^^ playing to the cardiff crowd as celeverly as that, he wasn't stupid, no

Matt- re the watson fight. obvously i have watched it over and over again. rds1-4, McCallum misses almost nothing. Its fcking eery how accurate he is and how well he anticipates Watson's movements etiehr offensive or defensive.

Yeah, and some rounds he starts off with a left hook to the body. It's almost poetry to watch at times.

Not almost - IT IS poetry.

McCallum is achingly underrated - he never really got the fights to shine against the biggest names, like Leonard, Hagler and Hearns. I'd have picked him over Hearns, due to Thomas' shaky beard and McCallum's own cast iron one, and the fact that Hearns was always open to be tagged when throwing his own shots.

Hagler - well that would have been an extremely interesting fight, given that Hagler had real problems with Duran, who was also a sneaky counterpunching type, and a naturally smaller man, well, let's just say a tough nights work.

Think Leonard would have been too quick and too savvy, but no great humbling not being up to beating Leonard now is there.

[Counter-puncher]

Personally - I don't think he could have outboxed McCallum at range -

.

oh, indeed, not with 4 arms he couldn't outbox Mike. apart from owt else, his feet were too heavy and he moved too stiffly, and MM was able to just slide in an out of range with his neat under-rated footwork. mmmmm uuurgh I'm getting all steamed up again.