BoxRec

Have been wondering how much gain there was in Margarito`s handwraps for him compared to the Billy Collins junior incident?
In the Collins case the padding from the glove was removed which meant the knuckle was punching through the thickness of the glove leather causing the damage,
Where as in the Margarito case the cast (which would probably only be as hard as the knuckle underneath) was still coverd with the required padding giving the hand and Mosley the same protection.

thaibox uk wrote:Margarito,s handwraps

You are using commas instead of apostrophes.

Horse wrote:

thaibox uk wrote:Margarito,s handwraps

You are using commas instead of apostrophes.

There ya go

thaibox uk wrote:There ya go

It is still not right.

I said I was the greatest not the smartest.

The amount of bullshite some people will spout (comparing this incident to Billy Collins! Lunacy) in defence of their favourite boxers is quite sad, really. There are certain Cotto fans who have lost it completely & would have you think that Margarito had a fecking anvil in his gloves to beat their wonderboy (who was never as great as some misguidedly thought he was anyway).

However, not the case:



& I mention once more: only found before the Mosley fight, not in the Cotto fight. Also: I have smoked baggies of hash larger than that thing.

A Cotto fan kindly to explain how this:



Resulted in this:



Just... No. It's all blown out of proportion. Panama Lewis removed about half-a-glove's worth of padding. He did not put a chewing-gum size strip of "hardened material" into the handwraps of his fighter. If you ask me, the whole incident was not part of a malignant wonderplan but a stupid desperate move done on the spur of the moment (as I've intimated, if I was gonna try to load someone's gloves I'd do it feck of a lot better job than that) once they got in the dressing room & realised for whatever reason that Antonio wasn't up for it that night. Still, I'm glad he got caught & he deserved some form of ban/fine. If it was premeditated, which I'll say again --looking at the actual evidence rather than getting in a high-horse style hysterical lather over your boy getting his arse kicked (hello James McD!)--isn't bloody likely, then it was the worst (as in most incompetent & likely to be ineffectual) attempt at cheating I have ever heard of.

My thought exactly couldn't see any real gain in
doing it. I attend thai and kickboxing shows up
And down the country and see way worst
(very few shows sign off the wraps) with no
Real gain for the fighter.

No-one will ever truly know if the wraps were contaminated, or illegally applied, because no member of Cottos camp oversaw this process. When Miguel asked his Uncle why the day after the Mosley Margarito inspections, his Uncle stated that "Well they didn't check yours either".

He was promptly removed of duties.

It is purely a matter of personal opinion as to whether they were, or weren't.

I'm not Cotto fanboy thanks. I never thought he was an all time great, I enjoyed his seek and destroy style - and thought he was a very good fighter - which he clearly is.

We cannot say for sure whether the gloves were loaded against Cotto, my own personal instinct is that it seems unlikely to have been a one off.

What is clear however, is that Cotto was winning handily, and the moment margarito started to land, Cotto's face seemed to disintegrate very rapidly. Cotto has never been the most robust in terms of facial damage, but in this fight it seemed that very few punches caused an awful lot of damage.

We can all speculate about what effect those additional plaster loaded inserts would have had, but the fact they are deemed illegal would suggest they would confer some sort of advantage. Sometimes in a battle between two closely matched fighters, the slighest margin is enough to tip the fight the other fighters way.

Datsue wrote:The amount of bullshite some people will spout (comparing this incident to Billy Collins! Lunacy) in defence of their favourite boxers is quite sad, really. There are certain Cotto fans who have lost it completely & would have you think that Margarito had a fecking anvil in his gloves to beat their wonderboy (who was never as great as some misguidedly thought he was anyway).

However, not the case:



& I mention once more: only found before the Mosley fight, not in the Cotto fight. Also: I have smoked baggies of hash larger than that thing.

A Cotto fan kindly to explain how this:



Resulted in this:



Just... No. It's all blown out of proportion. Panama Lewis removed about half-a-glove's worth of padding. He did not put a chewing-gum size strip of "hardened material" into the handwraps of his fighter. If you ask me, the whole incident was not part of a malignant wonderplan but a stupid desperate move done on the spur of the moment (as I've intimated, if I was gonna try to load someone's gloves I'd do it feck of a lot better job than that) once they got in the dressing room & realised for whatever reason that Antonio wasn't up for it that night. Still, I'm glad he got caught & he deserved some form of ban/fine. If it was premeditated, which I'll say again --looking at the actual evidence rather than getting in a high-horse style hysterical lather over your boy getting his arse kicked (hello James McD!)--isn't bloody likely, then it was the worst (as in most incompetent & likely to be ineffectual) attempt at cheating I have ever heard of.

That handwrap insert is 9cm long, so it's not chewing gum sized, look at the scale along the bottom.

jamesmcdonnell wrote: That handwrap insert is 9cm long, so it's not chewing gum sized, look at the scale along the bottom.

I apologise.

However, once again: kindly to explain how a --what, three & a half inch? If that?-- thing in amongst your handwraps did this:



Unless it was a three & a half inch long lump of concrete, which Margarito had tied to a baseball bat, there is nothing in it to make the many accusers shout so loud. Cotto was beaten by the better man that night, & people conveniently like to forget that.

Datsue wrote:However, once again: kindly to explain how a --what, three & a half inch? If that?-- thing in amongst your handwraps did this:



Unless it was a three & a half inch long lump of concrete, which Margarito had tied to a baseball bat, there is nothing in it to make the many accusers shout so loud. Cotto was beaten by the better man that night, & people conveniently like to forget that.

Do you think Margarito was cheating for the sake of it?

Are you honestly trying to convince others that there was no advantage to be had by Margarito's team loading his gloves?

MachoMan09 wrote:I very nearly googled the length of Wrigley's chewing gum, then. I am going mental.

I am only speculating here, but i bet if anyone researched into the forum members who get the most irate about Margarito, and cross-referenced that list with a list of people saying Cotto would dominate and school and stop Margarito, I bet there would be a considerable crossover between the two lists.

a lot of people, and this is pre-wrapgate, really seemed to hate the fact that as uncultured a fighter as Toni could beat Cotto, contra their predictions.

Horse wrote:

Datsue wrote:However, once again: kindly to explain how a --what, three & a half inch? If that?-- thing in amongst your handwraps did this:



Unless it was a three & a half inch long lump of concrete, which Margarito had tied to a baseball bat, there is nothing in it to make the many accusers shout so loud. Cotto was beaten by the better man that night, & people conveniently like to forget that.

Do you think Margarito was cheating for the sake of it?

Are you honestly trying to convince others that there was no advantage to be had by Margarito's team loading his gloves?

No, just that I doubt that Margarito loaded them for the Cotto fight, that even if he did there is no proof. I am in the main responding to comments (see the pac/khan sparring thread) that Cotto has been ruined because of Margarito's actions. He probably has been, but if anyone thinks that it was solely & purely because of something that might have been (I have already dealt with my opinion on this above) in his gloves then they are barking mad. Kindly see photo & explain how that thing did this:





I posted a picture of what was found in his gloves on another occasion, & am simply positing whether or not it's likely that the thing posted could have wreaked such havoc.

Nothing you or anyone else has said has changed my mind. Unless you're holding back your rhetorical masterstroke. Would kindly like to enlighten me on the subject of how that three & a bit inch long thing fecked Cotto's face up like that, instead of trying to shift the goalposts?

the situation was surely exacerbated by the fact that Cotto's face will swell up if you give him so much as a dirty look. add a rub or two with a slightly coarse kitchen towel to the equation and the claret will be positively gushing.

Datsue wrote:No, just that I doubt that Margarito loaded them for the Cotto fight, that even if he did there is no proof. I am in the main responding to comments (see the pac/khan sparring thread) that Cotto has been ruined because of Margarito's actions. He probably has been, but if anyone thinks that it was solely & purely because of something that might have been (I have already dealt with my opinion on this above) in his gloves then they are barking mad. Kindly see photo & explain how that thing did this:

Margarito is a dangerous enough opponent without cheating, with loaded gloves he is a very dangerous opponent.

I am not sure why you think a hard object inserted in to the wraps wouldn't be likely to damage an opponent's face more than wraps without it.

Datsue wrote:I posted a picture of what was found in his gloves on another occasion, & am simply positing whether or not it's likely that the thing posted could have wreaked such havoc.

Margarito's fists would likely have done a lot of damage to Cotto's face without anything in his gloves. With loaded gloves then I think he would have done even more damage.

Do you disagree?

Horse wrote:

Datsue wrote:No, just that I doubt that Margarito loaded them for the Cotto fight, that even if he did there is no proof. I am in the main responding to comments (see the pac/khan sparring thread) that Cotto has been ruined because of Margarito's actions. He probably has been, but if anyone thinks that it was solely & purely because of something that might have been (I have already dealt with my opinion on this above) in his gloves then they are barking mad. Kindly see photo & explain how that thing did this:

Margarito is a dangerous enough opponent without cheating, with loaded gloves he is a very dangerous opponent.

I am not sure why you think a hard object inserted in to the wraps wouldn't be likely to damage an opponent's face more than wraps without it.

Datsue wrote:I posted a picture of what was found in his gloves on another occasion, & am simply positing whether or not it's likely that the thing posted could have wreaked such havoc.

Margarito's fists would likely have done a lot of damage to Cotto's face without anything in his gloves. With loaded gloves then I think he would have done even more damage.

Do you disagree?

Do you agree that whatever that three & a half inch strip Margarito had in his handwraps was, it could not possibly do this?

Datsue wrote:Do you agree that whatever that three & a half inch strip Margarito had in his handwraps was, it could not possibly do this?

No, I don't.

Counter-puncher wrote:I am only speculating here, but i bet if anyone researched into the forum members who get the most irate about Margarito, and cross-referenced that list with a list of people saying Cotto would dominate and school and stop Margarito, I bet there would be a considerable crossover between the two lists.

a lot of people, and this is pre-wrapgate, really seemed to hate the fact that as uncultured a fighter as Toni could beat Cotto, contra their predictions.

For what it's worth, you can do that on me and see I was a huge Margarito fan and wanted him to beat Cotto. However, I've been one of his strongest critics in the wake of that revelation.

Horse wrote:

Datsue wrote:Do you agree that whatever that three & a half inch strip Margarito had in his handwraps was, it could not possibly do this?

No, I don't.

You agree that having the strip in there did that, or don't?

Datsue wrote:You agree that having the strip in there did that, or don't?

If he had the strip in his gloves in that fight then I think it helped him to damage Cotto's face.

Horse wrote:

Datsue wrote:You agree that having the strip in there did that, or don't?

If he had the strip in his gloves in that fight then I think it helped him to damage Cotto's face.

& d'you think that facial damage was the reason Cotto lost?

When Cotto was asked if Margarito had used illegal wraps against him, Cotto said something along the lines of, "look at my face after that fight and then you can decide".

Margarito started taking over in the fight when he busted up Cotto's nose with a very good punch. Cotto had problems breathing and let it affect him.

I don't know whether Margarito cheated in that fight or not.

Datsue wrote:& d'you think that facial damage was the reason Cotto lost?

It didn't help, Datsue, but that is not my argument.