BoxRec

How about Mosley vs Pryor at 140. Who wins and how?

That would have been a great fight. I guess I would say Pryor wins more often than not. Probably late round stoppage.

No way Mosley faced bigger punchers than Pryor and never got knocked out, Pryor ain't doing it either. I think at 140 they would go back and forth with several close rounds. Mosley would win at least 3 of the last 4 due to his excellent bodypunching, allowing him to land his best shots in the last 4 stanzas. Mosley by Split or Majority decision.

gilgamesh wrote:No way Mosley faced bigger punchers than Pryor and never got knocked out, Pryor ain't doing it either. I think at 140 they would go back and forth with several close rounds. Mosley would win at least 3 of the last 4 due to his excellent bodypunching, allowing him to land his best shots in the last 4 stanzas. Mosley by Split or Majority decision.

I was going to argue the same. I don't see how could Pryor would stop Mosley when he has never been stopped. I have never seen him truly hurt. Forrest did some damage but nothing close to being stopped. I don't know how people can come to the conclusion that Pryor would have stopped Mosley. If anything I would favor Mosley to stop Pryor.

Add another to the no way in hell Pryor stops Mosley column. I'd take Shane by clear decision.

Mosley was badly hurt & was fairly close to being stopped by Forrest, though. Not detracting from him at all, just challenging that point.

Not sure who I'd favour. Close bout.

Goodnight, Irene wrote:Mosley was badly hurt & was fairly close to being stopped by Forrest, though. Not detracting from him at all, just challenging that point.

Not sure who I'd favour. Close bout.

It looked like if Floyd stepped it up a notch and took a couple of more chances late, he could've stopped Mosley. Shane looked broken mentallyin that fight. The bigger punchers who wouldn't have stopped Mosley were just that, big punchers. Vargas and Mayorga weren't that accurate but Mosley does have a chin. But Pryor was able to box and was quick and had speed, things that Mosey has shown to have problems with. If Cotto was able to edge him then I can see Pryor doing more than that.

Forrest was a very big Welterweight and Pryor was an average sized Lightweight. As for the Mayweather fight, at 39 if Shane had to make 140 he would get stopped by Malignaggi.

IKSRTFO wrote:

Goodnight, Irene wrote:Mosley was badly hurt & was fairly close to being stopped by Forrest, though. Not detracting from him at all, just challenging that point.

Not sure who I'd favour. Close bout.

It looked like if Floyd stepped it up a notch and took a couple of more chances late, he could've stopped Mosley. Shane looked broken mentallyin that fight. The bigger punchers who wouldn't have stopped Mosley were just that, big punchers. Vargas and Mayorga weren't that accurate but Mosley does have a chin. But Pryor was able to box and was quick and had speed, things that Mosey has shown to have problems with. If Cotto was able to edge him then I can see Pryor doing more than that.

Oh, c'mon. You're not serious? You're bringing up Mayweather &, to a very real extent, Cotto (who never seriously hurt Mosley once)? I mean, hell, if Berbick had stepped it up, maybe he'd have stopped Ali. Maybe Spinks would've in their first fight, too.

Sometimes a fight from a boxers' post-prime period has some degree of relevance, but these were bouts where Mosley was not even near his peak years (approx. 1998-02). I agree that Mayweather possibly looked to have Mosley if he really pushed it that night, but are you telling me you could see him that out of petrol against Mayweather had it been the Mosley who fought De La Hoya in 2000? Not on your life --- & Cotto, by absolutely scraping home, proved he wouldn't have been good enough to cope with the Mosley of five or six years earlier, as well.

Goodnight, Irene wrote:

IKSRTFO wrote:

Goodnight, Irene wrote:Mosley was badly hurt & was fairly close to being stopped by Forrest, though. Not detracting from him at all, just challenging that point.

Not sure who I'd favour. Close bout.

It looked like if Floyd stepped it up a notch and took a couple of more chances late, he could've stopped Mosley. Shane looked broken mentallyin that fight. The bigger punchers who wouldn't have stopped Mosley were just that, big punchers. Vargas and Mayorga weren't that accurate but Mosley does have a chin. But Pryor was able to box and was quick and had speed, things that Mosey has shown to have problems with. If Cotto was able to edge him then I can see Pryor doing more than that.

Oh, c'mon. You're not serious? You're bringing up Mayweather &, to a very real extent, Cotto (who never seriously hurt Mosley once)? I mean, hell, if Berbick had stepped it up, maybe he'd have stopped Ali. Maybe Spinks would've in their first fight, too.

Sometimes a fight from a boxers' post-prime period has some degree of relevance, but these were bouts where Mosley was not even near his peak years (approx. 1998-02). I agree that Mayweather possibly looked to have Mosley if he really pushed it that night, but are you telling me you could see him that out of petrol against Mayweather had it been the Mosley who fought De La Hoya in 2000? Not on your life --- & Cotto, by absolutely scraping home, proved he wouldn't have been good enough to cope with the Mosley of five or six years earlier, as well.

I never said Cotto hurt him. Cotto DID outbox him and IMO, Pryor was a better boxer. That's how Floyd got to Mosley, by boxing him. DLH lost because he tried to beat Shane at his own game. While Forest and Wright were bigger fighters, they won mostly by outboxing Shane. I NEVER said Pryor was capable of stopping Mosley but he is fully capable of outboxing Mosley. Pryor was more well rounded and as technical boxing skills go, Mosley is sometimes slightly overated in that respect because of his speed and combination ablilities.

Pryor's only chance would be to outslug him imo. Aaron got outboxed by Gary Hinton. That is the most overrated part of Pryor, that he was some kind of multi faceted boxer/puncher. He could get on his toes and use his jab a bit. Nothing that would beat Mosley over the distance and he wouldn't want it that way.

As much as it pains me to bring up my boy Rafa's defeat, this might resemble that fight in terms of the size being the difference. Mosley was WAY bigger than Pryor and while Shane isn't the smartest fighter in the world by a longshot. He does know how to impose a strength and size advantage in a clinch. We all lose sight of the size difference between some of these modern guys with the day before weigh in and older ones in mythical fights. It's very real here.

I agree that Shane also gets credit for being a boxer when he really isn't. That tends to be the case sometimes with guys that are athletically gifted. Both of these fighters fit that description more than they do any sort of technical boxer. they were two sluggers with fast hands and big balls. The bigger guy wins more often than not.

Goodnight, Irene wrote:Mosley was badly hurt & was fairly close to being stopped by Forrest, though. Not detracting from him at all, just challenging that point.

Not sure who I'd favour. Close bout.

Thats what I think too. Pryor was a much bigger puncher than Vernon Forrest, and he threw a lot more punches. There is certainly a chance that Pryor would stop Mosely.

Pryor had a tremendous workrate and could also win by decision. Pryor was not a lightweight . He was natural Jr welterweight who fought at this weight almost his entire career. He was very strong. He is not going to get pushed around by Mosely.

A lot of different things could happen in this fight; however it's very unlikely that Mosley would win this easily.

Pryor only fought at Jr Welterweight because he got a title shot. He was small for the weight in his day, in Mosley's day Aaron would be microscopic at 140. Those, as you like to say, are facts.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Pryor only fought at Jr Welterweight because he got a title shot. He was small for the weight in his day, in Mosley's day Aaron would be microscopic at 140. Those, as you like to say, are facts.

Very true. Even the LW version of Shane would have about 10 lbs. of straight up muscle mass on Pryor. Pryor's unorthodox style and angles would probably give Mosley more difficulty than anything else, but in an outright slugging match, like this fight would mostly be, Aaron gets pasted all over the ring by Shane. If you come right at Mosley you are asking for trouble. Even the comparitively large Sergio Mora was aware of that, and he wasn't fighting the prime compact speedster Mosley.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Pryor's only chance would be to outslug him imo. Aaron got outboxed by Gary Hinton. That is the most overrated part of Pryor, that he was some kind of multi faceted boxer/puncher. He could get on his toes and use his jab a bit. Nothing that would beat Mosley over the distance and he wouldn't want it that way.

As much as it pains me to bring up my boy Rafa's defeat, this might resemble that fight in terms of the size being the difference. Mosley was WAY bigger than Pryor and while Shane isn't the smartest fighter in the world by a longshot. He does know how to impose a strength and size advantage in a clinch. We all lose sight of the size difference between some of these modern guys with the day before weigh in and older ones in mythical fights. It's very real here.

I agree that Shane also gets credit for being a boxer when he really isn't. That tends to be the case sometimes with guys that are athletically gifted. Both of these fighters fit that description more than they do any sort of technical boxer. they were two sluggers with fast hands and big balls. The bigger guy wins more often than not.

This is a great post.

Ezzard wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Pryor's only chance would be to outslug him imo. Aaron got outboxed by Gary Hinton. That is the most overrated part of Pryor, that he was some kind of multi faceted boxer/puncher. He could get on his toes and use his jab a bit. Nothing that would beat Mosley over the distance and he wouldn't want it that way.

As much as it pains me to bring up my boy Rafa's defeat, this might resemble that fight in terms of the size being the difference. Mosley was WAY bigger than Pryor and while Shane isn't the smartest fighter in the world by a longshot. He does know how to impose a strength and size advantage in a clinch. We all lose sight of the size difference between some of these modern guys with the day before weigh in and older ones in mythical fights. It's very real here.

I agree that Shane also gets credit for being a boxer when he really isn't. That tends to be the case sometimes with guys that are athletically gifted. Both of these fighters fit that description more than they do any sort of technical boxer. they were two sluggers with fast hands and big balls. The bigger guy wins more often than not.

This is a great post.

Thank you, I loved Aaron growing up. I even cheered for him against Alexis. But he has developed many more skills since he retired than I saw on display in the ring.

Very exciting fighter. Always put on a show.

What I appreciated is how you understand the way the guys of today need to be compared with guys a division or 2 up. I also totally agree that many people seem to confuse speed with skill.

Ezzard wrote:Very exciting fighter. Always put on a show.

What I appreciated is how you understand the way the guys of today need to be compared with guys a division or 2 up. I also totally agree that many people seem to confuse speed with skill.

It just proves to be a tough conversation to have if you propose Castillo vs Cuevas. Which would have been an incredible war. But the weight classes and perceptions with them are what they are. Duran's dimensions were no bigger than Barrera's.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Pryor only fought at Jr Welterweight because he got a title shot. He was small for the weight in his day, in Mosley's day Aaron would be microscopic at 140. Those, as you like to say, are facts.

No they are not.

Pryor was a Jr Welterweight from his professional debut. He was not small for a Jr Welterweight for his day. He not only would have been the hardest puncher that Mosley ever fought, he also would be by far the most busy puncher he ever fought.

Yes if Mosely weighed in under todays rules, he probably could weigh several pounds higher by the time the fight started, as could Pryor. He also would not be at his best if he did that because that would not be in his best physical condition if he did that. He would be bigger on the scale but he would not be in his best physical condition.

If you compare a young Mosley and Pryor, Pryor looks like the stockier man.

Ambling Alp wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Pryor only fought at Jr Welterweight because he got a title shot. He was small for the weight in his day, in Mosley's day Aaron would be microscopic at 140. Those, as you like to say, are facts.

No they are not.

Pryor was a Jr Welterweight from his professional debut. He was not small for a Jr Welterweight for his day. He not only would have been the hardest puncher that Mosley ever fought, he also would be by far the most busy puncher he ever fought.

Yes if Mosely weighed in under todays rules, he probably could weigh several pounds higher by the time the fight started, as could Pryor. He also would not be at his best if he did that because that would not be in his best physical condition if he did that. He would be bigger on the scale but he would not be in his best physical condition.

If you compare a young Mosley and Pryor, Pryor looks like the stockier man.

Yes they are, you obviously need to brush up on your Aaron Pryor history. It's very well documented. 140 offered him the opportunity to not cut weight, which isn't a bad thing. But he was undersized for sure. I'm shocked that you don't know this.

Could you imagine how Pryor would have looked if he fought Vernon Forrest? He would have look like a midget next to him. Mosley is bigger than Pryor. It would have been an all out war in which size would have made a difference. Mosley would win more than he loses to Pryor.

Idisagree wrote:Could you imagine how Pryor would have looked if he fought Vernon Forrest? He would have look like a midget next to him. Mosley is bigger than Pryor. It would have been an all out war in which size would have made a difference. Mosley would win more than he loses to Pryor.

Size isn't everything, but i agree it would make a huge difference here. Saying Pryor was stockier than Shane is pure comedy. Aaron was about the same size as JMM, slightly bigger.

Pryor was Jr Welterweight from his career debut on. He had one fight in his entire career under the lightweight limit. His last 8 title defenses he weighed at least 139. There was always talk about him moving up to welterweight because he had trouble making 140. He was a bit on the short side for his weight class (slightly shorter than Duran, about the same as Carmen Basilio) but he certainly was not small.

The pre-steroid Shane Mosley started out as a lightweight and was one for most of his first 6 years. He would have been at his best at 140 in the late 1990s, when he moved from lightweight to welterweight before he started using steriods and getting bigger.
He was much smaller man than he is today.

If he tried to get down to 140 many years after that, he would not have been in much shape to fight after having to lose so much weight.

Mosley is taller but Pryor was naturally stockier. Maybe Mosley could have used his speed and height advantage to win. However, he would have had one helluva a fight against a relentless opponent.

Have you ever been wrong in your life? Just wondering if it's possible for you to acknowledge it. Because you're way off base in here. I love the way you ignore the difference between the extra day for the weigh ins like it means nothing.

Pryor was small for the weight class. You can go on and on for as long as you want but it will never change that fact. Mosley would have been the biggest 140lb fighter in the world by a large margin.

Duran wasn't any bigger than MAB. You have a real issue looking past the numbers next to the fighter on their boxrec page and looking at what was really there.

Edit: And Pryor didn't hit nearly as hard as Forrest, that's insanity.

Have I have ever been wrong? Of course. I know you get frustrated when someone does not agree with you and uses reasoning, which leaves you counter with clever things like I do actually think things through before offerring an opinion.

The extra day weight in? Well I did talk about it before before but I will again. It does not give the guy that normally more over the weight limit an advantage.

If you were a trainer, you would rather have a guy (fighter A) who naturally weighed a few pound over 140 and only had to lose a few pounds to make weight. If you have fighter B is say naturally 10 pounds heavier, then he has to overtrain /or or starve himself to get down to 140 for the weight in, and then may balloon back up to 150 by the time the fight starts.
Fighter B is not going to be at his best physical condition by fight time. It is not good to stave the body down to an unnatural weight. This is not exactly rocket science. So even if the HBO announcer say that so and so actually weight 5 more pounds than the other guy, it's not a five pound advantage.

As for Mosley specifically, when exactly do you think he would have been so much bigger than Pryor? What year are we talking about? Mosley was lightweight for his early career. He really skipped over the Jr welterweight class The Mosley that fought Del Hoya at 147 probably would not have been able to make 140. If so, he would have been very drained even with a day before the fight.

Pryor was not small for the Jr welterweight class even if you say that it is a fact that he was. I have shown why he wasn't. All you come back with is yes he was.

Duran was the same size as Barrera? Ok, whatever. I was merely pointing out a couple of guys (Duran and Basilio) that were about the same height as Pryor who were successful in weight classes that were higher than 140.

It's insanity to think Pryorhit harder than than Forrest? huh? I will just say that Pryor hit harder. Not worth arguing about. Pryor also threw many more punches than Forest. Unlike Forrest, Pryor probably would not let Mosley off the hook if he hurt him.