BoxRec

I posted this on the CS. Just wondering what everyone here thinks of the situation.

There have been a couple important fights at 168 recently. I would like to see what your top 5 looks like.

Mine:

1. Froch
2. Ward
3. Kessler
4. Bute
5. Dirrell

I understand how it would seem odd (and if you are going to bitch to me about it, at least post your own list with explanations) that Froch is ahead of Kessler and Ward, considering he lost to Kessler, and Ward dominated the Viking Warrior. However, I do not think head to head results are the be all end all when it comes to ranking fighters (not to mention Froch-Kessler could have gone either way). Too much emphasis is placed on maintaining a perfect record nowadays, which has led to an abundance of over protected fighters in the contemporary boxing scene. You lose and your ranking or status drops, usually even in the case of a very close, competitive loss. Froch has one of the best recent resumes in boxing with wins over Pascal, Taylor, Dirrell, and AA. As mentioned previously, his lone defeat was also to an excellent fighter, in an excellent fight which could have gone either way. I have Ward ahead of Kessler due to the dominating nature of his win, as well as clear victories over lower top ten/fifteen opponents like Green, Bika, and Miranda.

Bute is at number four because I do not think his level of opposition is commensurate with the fighters above him. Froch and Kessler have competed with better guys, and Ward's win over Kessler is far more significant than anything Bute has done. I believe one of the reasons people have trouble ranking him outside the top two because he has an unbeaten record, while the guys below him in many lists (everyone but Ward) do not. This also helps maintain the illusion that a bout between Bute and the SS winner would to a certain extent be a "super fight." Dirrell takes the fifth spot due to his competitive loss (not a robbery) to Froch and the win over AA.

1. Ward
2. Kessler
3. Froch
4. Bute
5. Dirrell
6. Johnson
7. Abraham
8. Bika
9. Stieglitz
10. Taylor

1,froch
2,bute,
3,ward
4,dirrel
5,kessler

Wow

Kessler below the guy he beat in his last fight .... Froch overtakes him for beating a guy who lost to a guy Froch had beaten ... come on fellas. The current scene forum is slated for silly posts ...

1. Ward
2. Kessler
3. Froch
4. Bute
5. Dirrell

tonyevs wrote:Wow

Kessler below the guy he beat in his last fight .... Froch overtakes him for beating a guy who lost to a guy Froch had beaten ... come on fellas. The current scene forum is slated for silly posts ...

Nothing silly in having Froch over Kessler Tony. This is boxing and not Top Trumps.

You'd be hard pressed to find people backing Kessler for a rematch in neutral conditions, let alone in the UK. Froch looked fresh at the end - wheras Kessler looked like a train wreck and has since retired. He is probably finished for good after that fight wheras Froch has bounced back emphatically.

G0mez wrote:

tonyevs wrote:Wow

Kessler below the guy he beat in his last fight .... Froch overtakes him for beating a guy who lost to a guy Froch had beaten ... come on fellas. The current scene forum is slated for silly posts ...

Nothing silly in having Froch over Kessler Tony. This is boxing and not Top Trumps.

You'd be hard pressed to find people backing Kessler for a rematch in neutral conditions, let alone in the UK. Froch looked fresh at the end - wheras Kessler looked like a train wreck and has since retired. He is probably finished for good after that fight wheras Froch has bounced back emphatically.

I realise your Froch`s top fan and all that. But you are in the minority, if you think Froch won against Kessler.

Of course Kessler has pulled out of the super6 now anyways ... but just because Abraham made Froch look good (and Froch was good) it certainly doesn`t prove without doubt that Carl would now beat Kessler .. infact it doesn`t prove or even convince it one little bit. As you said this isn`t top trumps .. Kessler beat Froch fair and square. Maybe Froch would have got the decision in Nottingham - but that doesn`t prove anything - we are talking fair decisions, not home town ones.

And it doesn`t matter one bit who looks the best after a fight does it ... it surely who has done enough to win. Not a fair comparison I know, but Ali was said to be laid up in bed after his fight with Bugner ... whilst Joe was swimming laps of the hotel pool.

Kessler beat Froch, in a fair and square fashion.
Ward beat Kessler fairly.

So isn`t it common sense in a ranking order to put it Ward, Kessler then Froch??

Ward
Kessler
Froch
Bute
Dirrell

Ward
Bute
Froch
Kessler
Dirrell

tonyevs wrote:
Kessler beat Froch, in a fair and square fashion.
Ward beat Kessler fairly.

So isn`t it common sense in a ranking order to put it Ward, Kessler then Froch??

Tis true - originally it's was a Froch wheel barrow with just me in it. Now it's a trail of bandwagons.

With regards Kessler, I thought Froch blew it. It was in the palm of his hand, but did too many smiles and winks instead of jabs and hooks after round 5 which could have / should have, been the turning point in the fight.

That said, when i watched the showtime version back I thought Carl had a solid argument. But I always go with my initial instinct during the live event.

With regards Ward. Like I've said many a time - he is a dirty mofo. The way he ties up the opponent's left hand, puts his elbow in their face and frog-marches them back is not boxing in any form. Nor is ducking under, them leaping up in range head first.

It's not like it was a clash of styles to blame for the head - Ward would have been thrown out by DQ after the 3rd or 4th deliberate head. The reality is he got away with 8 of the bastards. Not cool.

Showtime even shown his deliberate elbow of Bika in slo motion. He also did the dirty in the previous round at the end and Bika gave a wry smile as the bell went.

I'd challenge anyone to surf for their xmas shopping on Ebay after sustaining both of their eye lids / brow split wide open after head butts... let alone defeat a gold olympian and his pet referee in his hometown.

1. Ward
2. Kessler (I still think he will beat Ward at some point, he was severly rusty in their first fight, and the win flattered ward who is also a dirty bastard)
3. Froch
4. Bute (Ranked number 1 officially but whos he beaten?)
5. De Gale (yeah i said it an olympic gold medalist that likes hammering opponents, id rate him to take pavlik or dirrell if not now certainly by the summer).