BoxRec

Definitely something brittle in the psychology of fighters from more recent times.

I think you've got all the best names there though, Barry. You might add Tyson...

naseem hamed
ricky hatton
jeff fenech

I believe Curry had been boiling down to make the weight at 147. I do wonder sometimes if this takes a toll on a fighter and perhaps shotens their careers. Paul Williams might suffer from this too...

Curry had a long way to fall and he fell hard. The zip and crispness seemed to go out of his punches. Then again perhaps he looked so formidable at 147 because he was going in as the bigger man?

McCallum really finished him though.

I don't think Taylor was finished after Chavez. He was poorly managed and should never have been put in with Norris. That was just ridiculous and they messed up his career and his health.

Taylor had everything to be a great and in the ring I believe he was. I think Taylor-Whittaker would have been a legitimate 50-50 fight prime for prime.

I'd also back Taylor against Moseley and Mayweather.

BarryWashington wrote:couldn't seem to recover.

i'll name four boxers and you tell me who accomplished the most before their first loss (and a loss that seemed to be the end of their prime)

michael nunn
alfonso zamora
donald curry
meldrick taylor

You've certainly got some excellent fighters in this list, but I'm not sure exactly what the point is here, because with the possible exception of Zamora they all accomplished quite a bit after their first loss, and since they all mived up in weight you would expect them to have more difficult fights. As I said, with the possible exception of Zamora, none of their primes ended with their first loss, and that's seldom the case for any fighter. Sometimes that first loss merely exposes something about a fighter that future opponents can exploit.

As fas as who accomplished the most before their first loss, that's a tough call but I'd give a slight edge to Nun, who had quite run leading up to that late round loss to Toney.

Nunn looked amazing and was considered to be the sport's next sueprstar. I was shocked when Toney beat him.

Ezzard wrote:Nunn looked amazing and was considered to be the sport's next sueprstar. I was shocked when Toney beat him.

i walked to the ring with nunn that night
john odonell stadium davenport iowa
nunn was winning big.he got complacent and over confident.
got caught and it was over.


never seen a man cry so much over a loss.it destroyed him mentally
like i have never seen before or since.it may explain his drug usage later in life.

Wow great story, mate.

Watched it again recently. Toney was getting to him more and more and just walked through Nunn's shots.

BUT I don't think Toney ever looked in such good shape ever again. His body always looked soft after that.

MEISINGER wrote:

Ezzard wrote:Nunn looked amazing and was considered to be the sport's next sueprstar. I was shocked when Toney beat him.

i walked to the ring with nunn that night
john odonell stadium davenport iowa
nunn was winning big.he got complacent and over confident.
got caught and it was over.


never seen a man cry so much over a loss.it destroyed him mentally
like i have never seen before or since.it may explain his drug usage later in life.

Anything else you can share about the experience?

Must have been pretty amazing.

Ezzard wrote:Wow great story, mate.

Watched it again recently. Toney was getting to him more and more and just walked through Nunn's shots.

BUT I don't think Toney ever looked in such good shape ever again. His body always looked soft after that.

I watched it recently and I had Nunn up but he wasn't dominating. Toney was starting to land some nice shots and then the cracker!!

Ruby Goldstein
Cruisin along real good. Lots of hype. They threw him in with Ace Hudkins and he was kayoed.
Never quite got it back on track. Never won the title that seemed inevitable.

Ezzard wrote:

MEISINGER wrote:

Ezzard wrote:Nunn looked amazing and was considered to be the sport's next sueprstar. I was shocked when Toney beat him.

i walked to the ring with nunn that night
john odonell stadium davenport iowa
nunn was winning big.he got complacent and over confident.
got caught and it was over.


never seen a man cry so much over a loss.it destroyed him mentally
like i have never seen before or since.it may explain his drug usage later in life.

Anything else you can share about the experience?

Must have been pretty amazing.

as amateurs we both trained at the same gym in moline ill.
michael was about 6 years older than me.
the first time i met him i was 11 michael was nationally ranked amateur


he asked me to wrap his hands for some sparring.i had no idea how to even wrap.
he explained it to me.
after he was done sparring he asked me to hold the mitts.
he explained each and every step to me as he hit the mitts.

for the rest of the summer michael took me under his wing and showed me
everything a good amateur should know.proper breathing technics,road work,
shadow boxing,heavy bag,speed bag,etc.etc.

he showed me boxing was a chain of life.the older guys teaching the newer guys.
he said he was shown the same way when he started off.
great guy.thought the world of him.


he worked the corner for me on my amateur debut in silvis ill.

as time went along i eventually sparred with michael as an amateur
when he was preparing for the olympic trials and throughout the first half
of his pro career when ever he was in the davenport iowa area.


i helped him in training and sparring for his defense to toney

as time went by i spoke with him less and less.a phone call here and there
was about all it came down to when he developed a serious drug problem.
several times i thought some one should intervene on his behalf.
but like any other guy that looked up to someone as a hero i looked the other way.

i still wonder what could of been had he had proper guidance as an adult.
someone who would of watched after him the way he watched after me
when i was just a kid.
the michael i knew was not a drug dealer - drug addict.he was a kind
good hearted individual who would help out the only white kid in a gym.
treat him like a kid brother and pass knowledge of the sport like it was an
honor and not a chore.
a true friend a brother in every sense of the word.

thanks for sharing

Fantastic story, MEISINGER, cheers for that!

I love this forum.

Yeah, I get it now. Ruby didnt have that great a resume. The hype I think was the flashes of talent he showed early on.

I remember reading the Goldstein autobiography. He had a hard time after that loss confidence wise. lost a little faith in his beard too I think.

I find Taylor somewhat over-rated, being honest. He is as much mythology as he was a great fighter. The statement about he & Whitaker being 50-50 is just what I'm talking about in my opening sentence. Whitaker was in another class entirely.

Anyway, I'd mention Felix Trinidad, but I thought he recovered quite well from losing to De LaHoya

Definitely caved after his first official defeat, in any event. No telling yourself you won in the mirror after that fight

How about Larry Holmes D

To a lesser extent, some Tito victims: Reid and Vargas.

McCrory gave McCallum a real hard time.

BarryWashington wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:McCrory gave McCallum a real hard time.

yes he did but the end result is what mattered. it seemed like after curry knocked mccrory that milton couldnt get another significant win afterwards (though the dewitt one was decent).

How you fight means more to me than the result. Giving Mike hell at 54 was better than most any win he could have had there. But I get where you're coming from in the thread.

It is an accomplishment to me. I rate losses when grading fighters.

jermain taylor had an impressive resume before getting knockout by pavlik. He had great wins over Hopkins, ouma, and spinks. He also got a draw with a great fighter in Winky. It was all downhill from the knockout

Jeff Lacy LOL

Roy Jones (if you take away his first loss which was a DQ for tupping Griffin whilst he was on his knee's) world champ from middle all the way up to heavy bar cruiser.

Lots of talk about Taylor, but its about the wrong one! Jermain Taylor is the perfect pick for this thread. He had a great run and then after the Pavlik loss, the dream was over and the nightmare began.