BoxRec

Goodnight, Irene wrote:Which of these change in outcome, and which stay the same?

Holyfield-Foreman Foreman
De La Hoya-Chavez (140) I don't think this is in the bag for Chavez...I lean to Oscar...I may be alone.
Hatton-Tszyu Tzyu
Lewis-Tyson Lewis
Pryor-Cervantes Cervantes...in a walk away
Jeffries-Johnson I can't/won't call this one
Tunney-Dempsey Dempsey
Calzaghe-Hopkins (lets say at 168, Hopkins 2001 vs. Calzaghe 07) A surprising (to some) unsatisfying draw.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:This will surprise you, but I think Dempsey would have beat Tunney and I'd take Hopkins over Calzaghe. While I wouldn't call any of them a certainty, I'd favor the same winners in the other match ups.

Edit: Actually I like Tyson over Lennox. Lewis had a ton of anxiety facing the watered down version for a little more than a round, Mike thrived on apprehension in his prime.

Ezzard wrote:Holyfield (too durable for me, he'd take George)
DLH (too big for Chavez in real terms)
Tszyu - I think it's close but his right would be more of an issue.
Lewis (but I see why some pick Tyson, could go either way)
Cervantes
Johnson
Dempsey (very close though)
Calzaghe/Hopkins (it would always be a close fight with the loser claiming he won)

Goodnight, Irene wrote:Pretty sure Frazier was AT LEAST as durable as Holyfield.

Goodnight, Irene wrote:And Foreman was certainly a lot more formidable pre-Zaire.

Goodnight, Irene wrote:He couldnt handle Bowes artillery, and like with Bowe, Holyfield would struggle to hurt Foreman. It would be punch-for-punch and Foreman would wreck him when the inevitable war broke out.

yancey wrote:I've always thought 1973-74 was the prime version of Foreman.

He may have become better technically a little later, but did he not lose a bit of the killer mindset after the nightmare in Zaire?

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

Goodnight, Irene wrote:He couldnt handle Bowes artillery, and like with Bowe, Holyfield would struggle to hurt Foreman. It would be punch-for-punch and Foreman would wreck him when the inevitable war broke out.

This part strikes me as silly. You want to give Foreman credit, and rightfully so, for having a 15 month layoff. But now you're going to say Evander couldn't handle Bowe's artillery? Why? Because he was stopped once when he was sick as a dog? George didn't have the all around skill set of Bowe. He was more powerful, but not as versatile.

Evander hurt Bowe many times in their fights, he would hurt George too and when Foreman inevitably began to fade, Evander would finish him.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:That Bowe uppercut was after many, many blows when Holyfield was tired himself. George would be long gassed before Evander hit that wall. Not that it took him off his feet anyway. And Stylistically Bowe was a much tighter in fighter than George was, I don't think he hits Holyfield as easily with his bombs. Evander was adequate avoiding punches at the distance George liked to fight at and Evander was one of the more accurate heavyweights since Joe Louis. The main thing for me is the countering of Holyfield, he wouldn't miss George with that hook, and it hurt everyone he landed it on. Well, everyone except for, ironically- George Foreman.

As for the war mentality, there would certainly be exchanges but I have no doubt that Holyfield could stick to a gameplan and use side to side movement and box more than slug. He had no respect for Riddick and thought he could take his heart. He had more respect than that for a 40+ year old Foreman, no reason to believe he wouldn't be more wary against a young one.