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Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 10:55
by dookus
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/boxing/16490231.stm
Anyone think he could do with an easier fight next? He was starting to look a bit on the slide against Ward..
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 11:02
by doctorboxing
No, he doesn't have that many fights left in him and he (as well as I) think he can still do it at the very top level despite falling a long way short of Ward. It would be a decent money fight and a genuine world level bout which carries on Carl's reputation as being one of the very few men who are prepared to fight anyone in any country.
I don't think he could ever beat Ward and he may well struggle with Bute but give me Carl taking the tough fights one after the other over most of the crap one-sided match-ups in boxing anyday.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 11:20
by Ezzard
I read (somewhere) that this is likely to be pushed out by Bute-Hopkins.
Hope not. Two fights with Bute would be perfect for Froch.
Bute is a top class fighter. But he can be hit. I think it's another great match up and win, lose or draw it just adds to the Froch legend.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 13:58
by Bard of Boxrec
Desperately want to see this one. Like the previous poster said, Bute is there to be hit and he would be backed up by Froch. It would be a rude awakening for Bute after all the stiffs he has feasted on. I just don't see a scenario where Bute would be landing without taking some fire in return, and we all saw (Andrade I) how Bute deals with punishment.
I feel like Bute would be forced out of his rhythm and comfort zone in this one and I'm not sure he has a plan B against a tough guy who would keep throwing at him.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 14:58
by stevieb_8006
didnt carl drop him in the Ams?
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 16:17
by tonyevs
Bute may not put in as dominant display over Carl as Ward did - but he too is too skilled for Froch.
There is no chance of Froch outboxing Bute. And even slimmer chance of Carl out-muscling Bute either.
If the fight does come off. I see a wide points win for Bute.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 16:26
by Final round
Great fight and I'm looking forward to it but I can see it being a painful night. Bute has the edge in punch power for me and just seems sharper than Carl.
The way Johnson showed real respect for Bute was a real tell tale sign, he knows what Bute can do.. He was willing to take to give against Froch but mainly stayed on the jab and move against Bute.
Does he have a Froch like chin though? and can Carl catch up with him to test it?!
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 16:37
by tonyevs
Final round wrote:
Does he have a Froch like chin though? and can Carl catch up with him to test it?!
But Carl is not anything like a big puncher at world level. He is a strong and very fit guy for sure .. but isn`t a KO puncher.
Froch has been straightened by punches in most of his Super6 matches .. even dropped by Taylor. So the granite chin may be a little exagerated too..
Bute looks very big. Even if the stats say they are the same .. Bute looks the bigger man.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 16:58
by dbf
I think its a good fight for Froch, Bute isn't as fast as Ward or Dirrell and isn't a massive puncher. I think Ward was somewhat of a reality check for Froch and may have him working on new things, realising he needs to add more to his game. This could mean a slightly more verstatile Froch.
Anything less than this level of fight and I think Froch may struggle to get up for it. He's been fighting the top guys for 2 years straight now and a step down wouldn't keep him motivated.
I'll say it again, because he deserves it for continually going out there fighting the best, Carl Froch you are a legend.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 17:32
by Final round
tonyevs wrote:Final round wrote:
Does he have a Froch like chin though? and can Carl catch up with him to test it?!
But Carl is not anything like a big puncher at world level. He is a strong and very fit guy for sure .. but isn`t a KO puncher.
Froch has been straightened by punches in most of his Super6 matches .. even dropped by Taylor. So the granite chin may be a little exagerated too..
Bute looks very big. Even if the stats say they are the same .. Bute looks the bigger man.
I agree he's not a ko artist, but I wouldn't say Froch has been straightened in any of his fights? Ward caught him with some sweet hooks,Taylor boxed him apart, he traded with Kessler and at no time have I seen Carl stiffen...So for me he has a granite chin.
Bute does look the bigger man and he's a slippery customer.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 17:34
by Final round
dbf wrote:I think its a good fight for Froch, Bute isn't as fast as Ward or Dirrell and isn't a massive puncher. I think Ward was somewhat of a reality check for Froch and may have him working on new things, realising he needs to add more to his game. This could mean a slightly more verstatile Froch.
Anything less than this level of fight and I think Froch may struggle to get up for it. He's been fighting the top guys for 2 years straight now and a step down wouldn't keep him motivated.
I'll say it again, because he deserves it for continually going out there fighting the best, Carl Froch you are a legend.
Bute is a hurtful puncher and he has very quick footwork. A hard night for Carl IMO but he wants it, respect as per usual.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 22:02
by crusader
stevieb_8006 wrote:didnt carl drop him in the Ams?
Never heard that before.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 10 Jan 2012, 23:53
by Crease
Froch vs Bute then huh?
Personally as a big Froch fan, I wouldn't like to see it - because I'm predicting a Bute victory by wide points margin.
I firmly believe that Carl is on the decline, and if anyone disagrees they are deluding themselves...
Ward is a talented fighter, but he's not that good... The reason he looked as impressive as he did, is because Carl has slowed down (not that he was ever that quick) and he looked very sluggish.
Froch has fought a lot of tough fights in his career, and I believe that it may finally be catching up with him.
Does anyone really believe that Ward wouldv'e beaten Froch that convincingly 18-24 months back?
I sure as heck DON'T.
This is a meagre attempt by Bute to gain credibility by finally taking on a past-his=peak Carl Froch and knowing that Carl refuse it.
I sure as hell hope Froch wins (finally silence those Bute fights for good)... But sadly I can't see it.
priume-for-prime Froch would overpower and overwhelm him, but Carl has definitely lost something, that's for sure...
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 11 Jan 2012, 03:21
by Tunney
Ezzard wrote:I read (somewhere) that this is likely to be pushed out by Bute-Hopkins.
Bute has a lot to lose but nothing to gain by fighting Hopkins. He'd be much wiser to choose Froch.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 11 Jan 2012, 05:22
by Ezzard
Hope he does, Tunney.
Crease, he may be in decline. It may be that his observations of not feeling right in the Ward fight is a warning. He may lose to Bute in spectacular fashion (think Hatton-Pac). Bute has an accurate left. But I still think Froch should take the fight. Carl has nothing to prove and should take the best money and biggest name on offer.
I actually think this is a fight Froch can win, or at least look good in defeat. Ward is all about stopping the other guy from working. Bute is not that kind of fighter.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 11 Jan 2012, 05:34
by Counter-puncher
Crease wrote:Froch vs Bute then huh?
Personally as a big Froch fan, I wouldn't like to see it - because I'm predicting a Bute victory by wide points margin.
I firmly believe that Carl is on the decline, and if anyone disagrees they are deluding themselves...
Ward is a talented fighter, but he's not that good... The reason he looked as impressive as he did, is because Carl has slowed down (not that he was ever that quick) and he looked very sluggish.
Froch has fought a lot of tough fights in his career, and I believe that it may finally be catching up with him.
Does anyone really believe that Ward wouldv'e beaten Froch that convincingly 18-24 months back?
I sure as heck DON'T.
totally disagree. the main reason Froch lost, IMO, is that the matchup of his physical talents and Ward's, especially in the areas of foot-and-hand-speed, works greatly to Froch's detriment. that disparity in speed was alweays there and would always (IMO) give Ward the chance to get in and out on Froch without taking too much.
triangular logic doesn't always work blah blah blah but the writing was on the wall when Ward schooled a guy Froch went round-for-round with. on the same basis, his feet were just too good and his movement alone presented an insurmountable problem for the two Europeans.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 11 Jan 2012, 05:56
by Lenny
Counter-puncher wrote:Crease wrote:Froch vs Bute then huh?
Personally as a big Froch fan, I wouldn't like to see it - because I'm predicting a Bute victory by wide points margin.
I firmly believe that Carl is on the decline, and if anyone disagrees they are deluding themselves...
Ward is a talented fighter, but he's not that good... The reason he looked as impressive as he did, is because Carl has slowed down (not that he was ever that quick) and he looked very sluggish.
Froch has fought a lot of tough fights in his career, and I believe that it may finally be catching up with him.
Does anyone really believe that Ward wouldv'e beaten Froch that convincingly 18-24 months back?
I sure as heck DON'T.
totally disagree. the main reason Froch lost, IMO, is that the matchup of his physical talents and Ward's, especially in the areas of foot-and-hand-speed, works greatly to Froch's detriment. that disparity in speed was alweays there and would always (IMO) give Ward the chance to get in and out on Froch without taking too much.
triangular logic doesn't always work blah blah blah but the writing was on the wall when Ward schooled a guy Froch went round-for-round with. on the same basis, his feet were just too good and his movement alone presented an insurmountable problem for the two Europeans.
Unfortunately, isn't there a good chance that Bute will cause him the exact same problems. The only glimmer might be the way Andrade got to him in the end of their first fight, but I think Bute has come on since then.
Not that I don't want to see Froch try of course
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 11 Jan 2012, 06:00
by Counter-puncher
Lenny wrote:Counter-puncher wrote:Crease wrote:Froch vs Bute then huh?
Personally as a big Froch fan, I wouldn't like to see it - because I'm predicting a Bute victory by wide points margin.
I firmly believe that Carl is on the decline, and if anyone disagrees they are deluding themselves...
Ward is a talented fighter, but he's not that good... The reason he looked as impressive as he did, is because Carl has slowed down (not that he was ever that quick) and he looked very sluggish.
Froch has fought a lot of tough fights in his career, and I believe that it may finally be catching up with him.
Does anyone really believe that Ward wouldv'e beaten Froch that convincingly 18-24 months back?
I sure as heck DON'T.
totally disagree. the main reason Froch lost, IMO, is that the matchup of his physical talents and Ward's, especially in the areas of foot-and-hand-speed, works greatly to Froch's detriment. that disparity in speed was alweays there and would always (IMO) give Ward the chance to get in and out on Froch without taking too much.
triangular logic doesn't always work blah blah blah but the writing was on the wall when Ward schooled a guy Froch went round-for-round with. on the same basis, his feet were just too good and his movement alone presented an insurmountable problem for the two Europeans.
Unfortunately, isn't there a good chance that Bute will cause him the exact same problems.
very similar, I'd say. Bute's good footwork and smooth ability to punch/move/punch has always made me think he'd give Froch stylistic problems.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 11 Jan 2012, 08:54
by stujones
Give Eddie Hearn the credit if this comes off, not many fighters who come off a one sided defeat get straight back into another world title fight.... let alone, possibly, two guarenteed title fights.
Froch - I'll fight anyone attitude is fantastic, its a mystery that he isn't a cross-over star yet. He's been managed very well to get two immediate title fights after both his losses... definately TV bosses (whether in the UK or US) have belief in his ability and appeal.
Interesting fight, we'll certainly find out more about Bute.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 11 Jan 2012, 08:55
by Bard of Boxrec
Bute is a totally different proposition to Ward. The Canadian is certainly no defensive genius which goes in Froch's favour. Froch can land some leather on this guy and back him up. We'll see how good Bute is when he is pressured for 12 rounds.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 11 Jan 2012, 08:58
by Counter-puncher
true, Riddick, Bute's also more willing to let his shots go in combinations/ not make a grab-hug after every punch a la Ward. question is whether those combinations will back up and dominate Froch or give him more chances to counter. bit of both i reckon, all in all i lean strongly to Bute here.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 11 Jan 2012, 09:00
by stujones
Riddick Blowe wrote:Bute is a totally different proposition to Ward. The Canadian is certainly no defensive genius which goes in Froch's favour. Froch can land some leather on this guy and back him up. We'll see how good Bute is when he is pressured for 12 rounds.
Yep, we'll find out about Bute's metal and his ability. During the super 6, people have been saying that Bute is the quickest Super Middle out there.... but has he been made to look quick by his opposition being quite slow (or very slow) themselves - the likes of Johnson, Mendy, Brinkley, Miranda etc are slow handed these days.
Froch, as we all know, isn't Roy Jones.... thats been shown - but he is quicker than those guys. So it is in an interesting fight.
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 11 Jan 2012, 09:01
by jamesmcdonnell
Lenny wrote:Counter-puncher wrote:Crease wrote:Froch vs Bute then huh?
Personally as a big Froch fan, I wouldn't like to see it - because I'm predicting a Bute victory by wide points margin.
I firmly believe that Carl is on the decline, and if anyone disagrees they are deluding themselves...
Ward is a talented fighter, but he's not that good... The reason he looked as impressive as he did, is because Carl has slowed down (not that he was ever that quick) and he looked very sluggish.
Froch has fought a lot of tough fights in his career, and I believe that it may finally be catching up with him.
Does anyone really believe that Ward wouldv'e beaten Froch that convincingly 18-24 months back?
I sure as heck DON'T.
I think Ward would have beaten Froch into a cocked hat at any time - he's just on a different level to froch in terms of technique and talent.
I don't think Froch is in decline, he has looked poor at times because of the level of opposition he is facing. Believe what you want, but where's the evidence? He looked absolutely fine against Abraham, turned in a career best performance - but that's because Avraham is predictable, slow, and static, perfect for someone like Carl.
I think Bute has the style to beat Froch, he's got good movement, and can punch whilst moving, and he has quick hands that put together punches well.
I see another defeat for Froch.
totally disagree. the main reason Froch lost, IMO, is that the matchup of his physical talents and Ward's, especially in the areas of foot-and-hand-speed, works greatly to Froch's detriment. that disparity in speed was alweays there and would always (IMO) give Ward the chance to get in and out on Froch without taking too much.
triangular logic doesn't always work blah blah blah but the writing was on the wall when Ward schooled a guy Froch went round-for-round with. on the same basis, his feet were just too good and his movement alone presented an insurmountable problem for the two Europeans.
Unfortunately, isn't there a good chance that Bute will cause him the exact same problems. The only glimmer might be the way Andrade got to him in the end of their first fight, but I think Bute has come on since then.
Not that I don't want to see Froch try of course
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 11 Jan 2012, 09:03
by Counter-puncher
stujones wrote:
Yep, we'll find out about Bute's metal and his ability. During the super 6, people have been saying that Bute is the quickest Super Middle out there....
i don't believe he's quicker than either Ward or Dirrell, but he's not *that* far off
Re: Froch apparently close to signing for Bute next
Posted: 11 Jan 2012, 09:11
by jamesmcdonnell
Counter-puncher wrote:true, Riddick, Bute's also more willing to let his shots go in combinations/ not make a grab-hug after every punch a la Ward. question is whether those combinations will back up and dominate Froch or give him more chances to counter. bit of both i reckon, all in all i lean strongly to Bute here.
Me too - he is more aggressive than ward, and like you say, whilst this will present carl with opportunities, it will also mean he gets hit more.
Bute is pretty slick, he doesn't offer much target, and he moves and punches constantly, he's not than easy to hit.