BoxRec

...Make it this one:

http://vimeo.com/34151319

Kompayak Porpramook vs Adrian Hernandez, from late last year, WBC Light-fly title.

MachoMan09 wrote:I struggle to excited about the strawweight and light flyweight divisions. The only other places you can find people that light are primary schools, eating disorder help group meetings, famine stricken African villages, and AIDS hospices. Featherweight should be the lightest division. The six divisions below that should be scrapped.

Yes, I too thought that Hernandez looked like a cut-price Ricardo Lopez; he shares some of that fighter's offensive technical ability but none of the former master's boxing IQ & defence. Korpramok is obviously a tiny clone of Veeraphol: less power, perhaps, but made of iron & very technically sound. What an engine that boy's got! He should rule for years. The bit where he had Hernandez reeling in the ninth only for the Mexican to come back with about eight uppercuts in a row was amazing. I'm sure you too were out of your seat cheering on these gallant warriors!

I also agree with your assertion that the six divisions above welterweight should be scrapped; the fighters lack technical ability, pace, & the fights are mostly fvcking boring to watch.

I am particularly pleased we are both on the same wavelength, in that your idea of cutting both the useless clinching pudenda that are the Klitschko Bros in half & making four Mexican bantamweights out of the raw material thus saved would be a boon to the human race.

Nice to talk to you, as ever.

MachoMan09 wrote:On average there is never more than about half a decent fighter in each of the skinny divs at any one time. Amalgamate all the badly bred and under-fed into the Featherweights and you might have some matches worth watching.

Yes, I agree heavyweights are pointless lumps, aren't they? I also agree with you that people's fascination with heavyweights might just be something to do with latent homoerotic tendencies. After all, such people obviously value the sight of big bulging muscles over really good fights, with like, two blokes actually able to punch each other more than twice a round. Perhaps you are onto something, too, with your intimation that those who appreciate heavyweight boxing find some sort of sick thrill in watching two big strong men constantly clinching & grabbing a breather every six seconds; perhaps it's something to do with imagining the all-encompassing embrace of so much rippling man around them? You could be onto something there, mate, about those dudes projecting their need to be similarly smothered in tonnes of man-flesh.

Nice to talk to you again.

Datsue wrote:

MachoMan09 wrote:On average there is never more than about half a decent fighter in each of the skinny divs at any one time. Amalgamate all the badly bred and under-fed into the Featherweights and you might have some matches worth watching.

Yes, I agree heavyweights are pointless lumps, aren't they? I also agree with you that people's fascination with heavyweights might just be something to do with latent homoerotic tendencies. After all, such people obviously value the sight of big bulging muscles over really good fights, with like, two blokes actually able to punch each other more than twice a round. Perhaps you are onto something, too, with your intimation that those who appreciate heavyweight boxing find some sort of sick thrill in watching two big strong men constantly clinching & grabbing a breather every six seconds; perhaps it's something to do with imagining the all-encompassing embrace of so much rippling man around them? You could be onto something there, mate, about those dudes projecting their need to be similarly smothered in tonnes of man-flesh.

Nice to talk to you again.

i have no idea how anyone who calls himself a boxing fan could watch this fight and not be spellbound.

MachoMan09 wrote:I struggle to excited about the strawweight and light flyweight divisions. The only other places you can find people that light are primary schools, eating disorder help group meetings, famine stricken African villages, and AIDS hospices. Featherweight should be the lightest division. The six divisions below that should be scrapped.

I dunno if I'd go that far but I'd only have Bantamweight, Flyweight and Straw-weight below Featherweight. I know 3lbs may be a fair bit for fellas of 5ft2 but you know it's too much when there are barely any guys fighting in these divisions in Europe. A lot of guys at these weights also jump up and down in these divisions all the time.

MachoMan09 wrote:Quite. Nice chat. The sport has too many divisions and should be trimmed down. Call the divisions what you will but they should be along the following lines: 125lbs, 135lbs, 145lbs, 155lbs, 170lbs, 185lbs, 205lbs, 250lbs, 250lbs+.

There wouldn't be much happening in the 250lbs+ division

jameswilson wrote:I know 3lbs may be a fair bit for fellas of 5ft2 but you know it's too much when there are barely any guys fighting in these divisions in Europe. A lot of guys at these weights also jump up and down in these divisions all the time.

there are some pretty large population centres outside Europe, you know. some of them take boxing really seriously. just because no europeans actually weigh 8stone any more, there's plenty of Thais, Japanese, Phillipinos, Mexicans, who would probably beat your liver in if you told them how irrelevant they are just because no Europeans ply their trade in the lower weightclasses. to say the weightclasses are basically irrelevant because europeans don't compete down there is the kind of blinkered attitude i would expect from a bloody yank, shame on you sir.

look, we like boxing, right? we like to see punches thrown. preferably lots of punches, better yet, with some variety. you know, double uppercut/ hook to the body, and not falling in to clinch afterwards but- shock- throw another combination. and another. and another. and another.

stick to watching Wlad K and Felix Sturm, though, if Europeanness is your main criteria for finding an interesting fight.

J-C wrote:

MachoMan09 wrote:Quite. Nice chat. The sport has too many divisions and should be trimmed down. Call the divisions what you will but they should be along the following lines: 125lbs, 135lbs, 145lbs, 155lbs, 170lbs, 185lbs, 205lbs, 250lbs, 250lbs+.

There wouldn't be much happening in the 250lbs+ division

au contraire, there would be an awful lot of hugging.

Counter-puncher wrote:

J-C wrote:

MachoMan09 wrote:Quite. Nice chat. The sport has too many divisions and should be trimmed down. Call the divisions what you will but they should be along the following lines: 125lbs, 135lbs, 145lbs, 155lbs, 170lbs, 185lbs, 205lbs, 250lbs, 250lbs+.

There wouldn't be much happening in the 250lbs+ division

au contraire, there would be an awful lot of hugging.

True but it would have to be Valuev vs Fury every other month. The Klits, Lewis, Bowe, Golota, Price, Helenius and all the other behemoths were/are south of 250lbs

J-C wrote:

Counter-puncher wrote:

J-C wrote: There wouldn't be much happening in the 250lbs+ division

au contraire, there would be an awful lot of hugging.

True but it would have to be Valuev vs Fury every other month. The Klits, Lewis, Bowe, Golota, Price, Helenius and all the other behemoths were/are south of 250lbs

at least Valuev and Fury are European, though. apparently that means something.

Great Fight, give me this any day to the Kilts and the other Heavy Weights, No Holding No Messing about JUST

Klit vs Bum of the week is still in my view more interesting than watching anything south of bantamweight .

I think the reason its not so poplular here is the names and languages , its a lack of understanding the culture and the people rather than the boxing , if theres a fight between a guy called Wajit Wanahope and Krimji Thandahee (random made up names ) at light heavy ill be unlikely to watch it as they havent caught my imagination ,they havent become names here , just that in Lighter weights thats all the more common

Klit vs Bum of the week is still in my view more interesting than watching anything south of bantamweight .



personally i really enjoy watching people beat the crap out of each other, preferably with a bit of skill added in. their names and sizes are a bit of an irrelevance in the context of two blokes hammering seven bells out of each other till one of them falls over.

Counter-puncher wrote:

jameswilson wrote:I know 3lbs may be a fair bit for fellas of 5ft2 but you know it's too much when there are barely any guys fighting in these divisions in Europe. A lot of guys at these weights also jump up and down in these divisions all the time.

there are some pretty large population centres outside Europe, you know. some of them take boxing really seriously. just because no europeans actually weigh 8stone any more, there's plenty of Thais, Japanese, Phillipinos, Mexicans, who would probably beat your liver in if you told them how irrelevant they are just because no Europeans ply their trade in the lower weightclasses. to say the weightclasses are basically irrelevant because europeans don't compete down there is the kind of blinkered attitude i would expect from a bloody yank, shame on you sir.

look, we like boxing, right? we like to see punches thrown. preferably lots of punches, better yet, with some variety. you know, double uppercut/ hook to the body, and not falling in to clinch afterwards but- shock- throw another combination. and another. and another. and another.

stick to watching Wlad K and Felix Sturm, though, if Europeanness is your main criteria for finding an interesting fight.

Yeah I do spew my love for the Klitschko's all over the forum don't I. Shall we make something else up that I didn't say.

Ill try and word it differently. I think having 3lbs between divisions is way too small a gap, even at the heights that these guys are going to be at this weight. Yeah using the Europe thing was probably irreverent of me but we have a diverse range of races living within Europe and yet despite this we struggle like hell to get 15 or 20 guys into the EBU ratings at these low divisions. But I stand by my other 2 points about a lot of fighters jumping up and down the divisions with regularity which leads me to believe that the 3lbs difference between weight divisions is too small. Nonito Donaire is one that immediately springs to mind, I think he has fought at 3 different weight divisions in the last 3 or 4 years. Vic Darchinyan is similar.

Lets try and stick to reasoned debate rather than taking each others posts to the absolute extreme shall we? We've both been on here long enough to (hopefully) know I'm not a racist.

Some of the ignorance and blinkered opinions on this thread are pretty shocking, although a perfect example of our culture/times. I'd rather watch Ian Nappa five times over than Wlad, and I'd seriously argue that he was far more technically gifted and skilled.

I'm not having a dig at the bigger guys but you can easily count on one hand the number of top level heavyweight fights that combine skill, excitment and unpredictability in a ten year period. One of my main gripes with Sky's international boxing coverage is that they do almost nothing to expose their viewers to new fighters of genuine ability. They just recycle the big names time and again. There are superb fights out there but unless it takes place in the US or Germany we never see a sight of it.

The point about scraping lower weight classes as they are too near in weight is a load of bile as well. It's not how many pounds per say a fighter puts on that has an adverse effect on them, it's the percentage of increase of their own body weight! Adding three pounds to jump up to light fly is a hell of a lot is your a ruddy 105 straw-weight!

If it doesn't happen in your back yard, or if it isn't screened into your front room fronted by a simpering, hand rubbing, leering cheer-leader of a presenter clawing his sickly little hands all over his robotic, glass-jawed, risk averse, 'terrified of getting hit' idol then some of you clowns can't even bring yourselves to give it the credit it deserves

lopez vs salido 2 without doubt

fizzjambo wrote:The point about scraping lower weight classes as they are too near in weight is a load of bile as well. It's not how many pounds per say a fighter puts on that has an adverse effect on them, it's the percentage of increase of their own body weight! Adding three pounds to jump up to light fly is a hell of a lot is your a ruddy 105 straw-weight!

If your bringing up the percentage bodyweight thing up then your maths must not be that good then? The number of fighters who jump from flyweight to super-flyweight and back down at title level I think is very high, there's a 3lb difference between these weight classes. 3lbs is about 2 and 2/3 percent of 112. At middlweight and supermiddleweight there's a 7lb difference. 7lb is just over 4% of these fighers weight on the day of a weigh in.

At championship level as I say, you see a hell of a lot more guys at these weights traversing very quickly up and down these divisions, which you do not see at the upper limits. All of the super middleweight (for example) champions at the mo have been at that weight for a number of years. Likewise with most of the middleweights and light heavies. Yeah there's a few who have moved up in weight, but they hardly ever jump back down. At flyweight and the divisions around them the guys have usually moved up or down in weight in the last 2 or 3 years. So I wholeheartedly disagree that it is 'ruddy hard' for these guys to put on or lose 3 lbs, because they are all doing it at the championship level with regularity.

MachoMan09 wrote:Some of you are missing the point. Originally I was just messing about with Datsue but my thoughts on merging weight classes are serious. The primary reason that the lower weight divisions don't attract a great deal of interest is because they are so diluted. Cut the divisions down and things would buck up.

As to the 250lbs+ division being quiet. So what? The only reason for having that is to avoid discrimination claims from fatties and freaks. The blue riband division would still be heavyweight and the vast majority of them would be in shape.

I'm more interested in avoiding discrimination claims from people who can actually box a bit. i also think you're very optimistic in your last assumption. however diluting the lower classes somewhat, i could agree with. something like 110lbs, 115, 120, and 125, would be fine with me, leave the rest of the weights as they are, and stick the superheavies on WWE shows.

The little guys deserve more praise and recognition I think.

If we did cut the weight classes then it would be likely there would have been no Manny Pacquiao - started 8 pounds below minimumweight.

Counter-puncher wrote:Klit vs Bum of the week is still in my view more interesting than watching anything south of bantamweight .



personally i really enjoy watching people beat the crap out of each other, preferably with a bit of skill added in. their names and sizes are a bit of an irrelevance in the context of two blokes hammering seven bells out of each other till one of them falls over.

X 10,0000.

Londonirish wrote:Great Fight, give me this any day to the Kilts and the other Heavy Weights, No Holding No Messing about JUST

Counter-puncher wrote:Klit vs Bum of the week is still in my view more interesting than watching anything south of bantamweight .



personally i really enjoy watching people beat the crap out of each other, preferably with a bit of skill added in. their names and sizes are a bit of an irrelevance in the context of two blokes hammering seven bells out of each other till one of them falls over.

How wrong can you be there , no good just highlighting part of what i said to try to make your point sound more correct when the rest of what i had said explained why .

Will you be watching Renran Tesorio vs Michael Desmarinas this weekend ?????

Nah didnt think so .

Dont tell me the names dont mean jack , of course they do , i have no idea who they are so wouldnt bother watching unless it just happened to be shown prior to a big fight , it may be a cracking fight but if i dont know the fighters im not gonna watch it purely due them being some fast little light flyweights and unbeaten to boot , For the same reason i wont seek out to watch the heavyweight bout between Anthony Fowler and Raymond Tuli .

Its not about what weight they are and being ignorant in not acknowledging the little guys , its the fact that the lower weights are dominated by asian sounding names in the main , names who dont speak english , cant come across to appeal to us for us to begin to learn anything about them unless they are mega stars like pacman .

If we dont recognise their names then the division wont generally hold much interest to the main bulk of the UK , even among BIG boxing fans , the heavyweights for example may not be as skilled and not as quick , but we know who they are , they are promoted for us to know them and the bulk of the better ones are either european or American in general so we can associate with them easier .

Its not Ignorance , or Brits feeling any sort of Homo eroticism towards big men , its just simple common logic , its the whole reason why the Big men are where the money is , if it wasnt about recognising names and getting it across to the public then the heavyweight division wouldnt garner much interest or money and the little men would be kings , but thats not the way it is , simple as that ,its not my view its the majority view .

Its all about Promotion , and its a tough sell to get people interested in a name like thnadihoopalaitososa , most wont be able to say it and he unlikely speaks english , so you promote the guy in an area where his name CAN be sold , which isnt the UK

A Big 6 foot 9 lad whos got a name the same as a previous well known champion , speaks english , is instantly recognisable etc etc is a far easier sell ,
If suddenly a fighter called Holyfield Anger (similar sounding name to Tyson Fury ) becomes an unbeaten prospect in the Straweight division , speaks English (ie from Uk ,USA or Australia) has a bit of adrien Broner typer personality etc etc , then we would become interested in him as his name would become relevant .

Er, Damian, that's your opinion, he's got his. Some people, including me, simply do not give a shit about the dudes' names, ethnicity, nationality, & personalities. We do not care that you cannot pronounce their surname, nor that you do not know which bit of their name is the surname. That you care about all that shit (as you have spent many posts explaining at great, tedious length) does not change the fact we just enjoy watching the actual fights.

Just the fights. The lads in these divisions have good skills & put on really hard fights. You get wars all the time. That's enough for us.

Your list of excuses for not watching is irrelevant. I'm not going to tune in to watch two fat carthorses smother each other with their spare tyres, you're not going to watch epic fights with pace, skill & dramatic shifts of fortune. Okay. But can you not see that as a fan of boxing, what you're saying is that the fights don't matter & that rather there's some other promotional/identification issue that you look for before you'll watch a sporting contest? & that hurdle has to be cleared before you'll watch a fight?

If you cannot see that your attitude on this is maybe a tiny smidgen arse-backwards, & probably deserved C-P's polite but humorous response, I really don't know what else to say. I knew Macho was doing his impression of someone's choleric Gran, hence my tongue-in-cheek responses in kind to him. I'd've thought that was fvcking obvious.

PS: "the majority view". I am sure the thousands packing the Saitama Super Arena or the Korakuen Stadium to watch Akira Yaegashi fight are totally, totally down with the "majority view."

PPS:

it may be a cracking fight but if i dont know the fighters im not gonna watch it

Well, that is just fvcking blindingly stupid, then, isn't it? Because you're not going to watch a whole lot of fights if you avoid watching fights where you "don't know the fighters".

to all your posts in this thread Datsue.

My favourite fight of all time was Morales-Barrera 1 at 122lbs

damianhucker1 wrote:
Its not about what weight they are and being ignorant in not acknowledging the little guys , its the fact that the lower weights are dominated by asian sounding names in the main , names who dont speak english , cant come across to appeal to us for us to begin to learn anything about them unless they are mega stars like pacman .

.

but i don't want to learn anything about them. I just want to watch them beat each other near-senseless.