BoxRec

without giving it much thought i`d say........hmm.......
oscar bonavena, i know he floored smoking joe and lost a close decision when joe was in his prime and i think the only time he was stopped was by ali! he mixed in good company so he`d be in there, not sure how heavy he was.
oh and jerry quarry he`d be in the shakedown.
must admit loads of names are not springing to mind.

Being new to this forum I will stick my neck on the line and say Tommy Morrison,I know some will laugh at that but I honestly believe he was technically a gifted heavyweight,the fact he had a soft chin does go against this statement but I have seen a lot of his fights and he had a very exciting style,more so than the Cooneys,Quarreys,Coopers and...hmm Bothas!!of this world,I think Morrisons handlers undersold him and should have been a bit braver in matching him with more worthwhile opponents,You must also include the Klitschkos and maybe even Ingammaar Johansson?(not sure how heavy he was though)But in my book Morrison would have taken out all other 'White Hopes'

I'd have to say Ingo Johansson, although I'm not sure if he'd meet your definition of "modern," as he fought right around 195 in his prime.

Either of the Klits (although more likely Vitali at this point) has the potential to be the first dominant white HW champ in a long time - but the next few years will tell the tale.

Note that while I consider this kind of thread to be of historical interest, I couldn't care less about the color of the champ - I only care that he's a great boxer and worthy title holder. Lewis was the former, but (at least in the last few years) not the latter. Remember, he only wound up fighting Vitali because the designated gimme opponent, Jirk Johnson, injured himself, and they desperately needed something to rescue the PPV card at that point.

Jerry Quarry was a very good fighter...

headhunter wrote:without giving it much thought i`d say........hmm.......
oscar bonavena, i know he floored smoking joe and lost a close decision when joe was in his prime and i think the only time he was stopped was by ali! he mixed in good company so he`d be in there, not sure how heavy he was.
oh and jerry quarry he`d be in the shakedown.
must admit loads of names are not springing to mind.

Bonavena was, on average, 210.

He was about 5'11" and seemed a similar build to Tyson.

Possibly Gerrie Coetzee? Just throwing another possible name into the mix.


I don't really like these posts though. Seems kinda racist.

I'd have to say the best I saw in the last 40 years was "Irish" Jerry Quarry. He defeated Floyd Patterson, Thad Spencer. undefeated Mac Foster(24-0,24KO) & Ron Lyle(19-0,17KO), Buster Mathis, Ernie Shavers(45-2,44KO).
Next, George Chuvallo. To those who may chuckle, Chuvallo beat such standouts as: Jerry Quarry, Cleveland Williams, Doug Jones, Manuel Ramos, Yvon Durelle. He had an amazing KO record of 68 knockout victories in 74 wins. Never floored.

perrycarter wrote:Possibly Gerrie Coetzee? Just throwing another possible name into the mix.


I do n't really like these posts though. Seems kinda racist.

Gerrie Coetzee?? are you off your dial mate! Hes probably the worst white heavyweight of modern time,Id have loved to see him fight McNeeley,shit ,wahat a contest!!

jimbob wrote:Here's and interesting one. Who do you guys reckon was/is the best white "modern" heavyweight of all time. By modern heavyweight mean guys who fought at 195lb+, so not including heavyweights who wouldn't be heavweights today, like Marciano and suchlike.

That would be Jim Jeffries, a world heavyweight champ who weighed 220 lbs. and had 7 title defenses.

Marciano Frazier wrote:

jimbob wrote:Here's and interesting one. Who do you guys reckon was/is the best white "modern" heavyweight of all time. By modern heavyweight mean guys who fought at 195lb+, so not including heavyweights who wouldn't be heavweights today, like Marciano and suchlike.

That would be Jim Jeffries, a world heavyweight champ who weighed 220 lbs. and had 7 title defenses.

Well if you're going to go back that far you might as well include Jack Dempsey because he knocked out several 220+ contenders ...
Just Like IMO he'd knock out big ol slow Jim Jefferies, Rocky Marciano,Tommy Morrison, Gerrie Coetzee and all the rest of them too..

MAX SCHMELING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Best white heavyweight champ til now. Maybe the K`s will be better one day. time will tell.

BubiScholz wrote:MAX SCHMELING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Best white heavyweight champ til now. Maybe the K`s will be better one day. time will tell.

An upset knockout over Joe Louis (IMO greatest heavyweight champ ever)...that would be pretty hard to top I don't think the klitchkos will ever ,ever do anything like that

Max was probably the greatest European Heavyweight ever (except maybe Lennox Lewis)

...Max was a tremendous fighter But I think he would get knocked out by Dempsey and probably outboxed by Tunney ....

I'd pick Max over Marciano (who I feel was for the most part very protected during his career) as well as James J. Jefferies and just about everyone else entioned here... (except Max Baer who KOed him in real life)

zurdo wrote:

Marciano Frazier wrote:

jimbob wrote:Here's and interesting one. Who do you guys reckon was/is the best white "modern" heavyweight of all time. By modern heavyweight mean guys who fought at 195lb+, so not including heavyweights who wouldn't be heavweights today, like Marciano and suchlike.

That would be Jim Jeffries, a world heavyweight champ who weighed 220 lbs. and had 7 title defenses.

Well if you're going to go back that far you might as well include Jack Dempsey because he knocked out several 220+ contenders ...
Just Like IMO he'd knock out big ol slow Jim Jefferies, Rocky Marciano,Tommy Morrison, Gerrie Coetzee and all the rest of them too..

But Dempsey wasn't a "modern" heavyweight going by the rules the guy who started this thread set. He was a 185-lb. fighter, and therefore doesn't fit the standards. Now, if we were just going as light as we like so long as they fought at heavyweight, I'd say Marciano was clearly the best white heavyweight in history. However, since the guy said white fighters who weighed 195 and up, it has to be Jeffries, a dominant world champion who weighed 220.

I think the whole concept of "modern" heavyweight is a bunch of junk... anyway ..If Jack Dempsey fought nowdays and had the beneifit of modern scientific training and nutrition he'd likely weigh well over 200 pounds ..but he would still be as quick and fierce as he ever was ...

This whole obsession with weight IMO is just a way to jock mediocre modern fighters over the all time greats...

zurdo wrote:I think the whole concept of "modern" heavyweight is a bunch of junk... anyway ..If Jack Dempsey fought nowdays and had the beneifit of modern scientific training and nutrition he'd likely weigh well over 200 pounds ..but he would still be as quick and fierce as he ever was ...

This whole obsession with weight IMO is just a way to jock mediocre modern fighters over the all time greats...

Yes, I agree completely. That doesn't matter, though. The guy who started this thread said only heavyweights who weighed 195 and up, which Dempsey did not. Therefore, Jeffries would have to be considered the best. I do think that Marciano and Dempsey were both better than him and were in fact both all-time greats who should not be discounted because of their relatively light weights, but I still have to go by the rules designated at the top of the thread.

Vitaly. When if he beats Sanders, and I think he should, he will be the first in a long time to capture a major title. Not only will he have one of the major three titles, but the lineal title is vacant, so hsi title will be as respected as any one elses.

Should Vitaly go for a unification I think he would a very good chance of succeeding. Byrd and Ruiz, should they still be champs, would loose to Vitaly.

But I am getting ahead of myself here. As is if Vitaly beats Sanders he will have made it further than most white fighters in a long time.

Joe Bugner deserves a mention in all this.

agree tho most people will go mad at the mention of his name due to the nature of his defeat of brit fave old Henry, but Joe defensively was an excellent and underrated boxer, who just couldnt over what people thought of him in the uk. Which was a shame I get the feeling the bloke was much maligned in his career over here.
I dont think he is the best modern white heavy but yeah totally agreehe deserves a considerable mention.

Bugner was just too negative for me.
What about Scott Welch surely he deserves to be mentioned. If it wasn't for the fact he was crap he could have made a big impact.

he wasnt always negative though, agreed he was against Ali but he was pretty technically adept at slipping punches and taking them on arms and gloves, he just knew ali was too good....shouldnt judge him on one fight.

It wasn't just the fight against Ali i was thinking of, i've watched alot of his fights towards the end of his career. It seemed to me that in this phase of his career he was a bit safty first. Admittedly i don't have many of his earlier fights on tape, so i can't judge the early part of his career.
It's not a big critism, i still think he was a decent fighter.

fair enough mate, its just normally people tend think bugner, the cooper fight and his no show against ali, but obviously you have had more exposure than that and yeah I agree he was a defensive oriented fighter so could be too negative for many.
Just seems to me he got the shitty end of the stick over here, He didnt help himself at times tho.

zurdo wrote:I think the whole concept of "modern" heavyweight is a bunch of junk... anyway ..If Jack Dempsey fought nowdays and had the beneifit of modern scientific training and nutrition he'd likely weigh well over 200 pounds ..but he would still be as quick and fierce as he ever was ...

This whole obsession with weight IMO is just a way to jock mediocre modern fighters over the all time greats...

Jack Dempsey?

Yeah, he might have "scientific training" but if he still had the same retarded style, he'd go nowhere. Not to mention he didn't have the greatest of chins either.

Rocky would have stomped the hell out of Dempsey.

Not only that, but people bash Lennox for losing to Rahman, and McCall, look at some of the bums Dempsey lost to.

Tunney only lost to Harry Greb. Dempsey had no chance at beating LHW Tunney.

i agree personally I think Dempsey is the most overated heavweight in the top all time echelon. if that makes any sense at all.

Tantum wrote:

zurdo wrote:I think the whole concept of "modern" heavyweight is a bunch of junk... anyway ..If Jack Dempsey fought nowdays and had the beneifit of modern scientific training and nutrition he'd likely weigh well over 200 pounds ..but he would still be as quick and fierce as he ever was ...

This whole obsession with weight IMO is just a way to jock mediocre modern fighters over the all time greats...

Jack Dempsey?

Yeah, he might have "scientific training" but if he still had the same retarded style, he'd go nowhere. Not to mention he didn't have the greatest of chins either.

Rocky would have stomped the hell out of Dempsey.

Not only that, but people bash Lennox for losing to Rahman, and McCall, look at some of the bums Dempsey lost to.

Tunney only lost to Harry Greb. Dempsey had no chance at beating LHW Tunney.

For a guy with a retarded style and a suspect chin Jack Demsey sure accomplished a lot...


I don't think you can really tell much by looking at grainy jerky old black and whit films ..
Tattum is probably correct in a stomping match the plodding Marciano might very well win But in a boxing he is liable to get busted up ..

Fat Willie Meehan was probably just as good as a lot of the guys that Tantum jocks on this board..

Dempseys early record is somewhat spotty because Unliike Marciano, Dempsey wasn't gicven the coddled prospect treatment..

When he lost to Tunney ,a very great fighter IMO Dempsey was aging and inactive