BoxRec

How does it go?

Seriously?

Ali any way he pleases.

Goodnight, Irene wrote:Seriously?

Ali any way he pleases.

Are you being serious?

Ringo ain't no Brian London.

The fight goes the distance, since in this matchup I stipulate there is a referee that makes Ali go to a neutral corner and stay there until the 8 count.

btw, I've always thought that post-ban Ali probably learned to hit harder than the '67 version.

yancey wrote:btw, I've always thought that post-ban Ali probably learned to hit harder than the '67 version.

I doubt Cleveland Williams would have agreed with you.

"learned to hit harder? . . . huh???

dempseyfire wrote:"learned to hit harder? . . . huh???

This is an impossible concept???

keithmoonhangover wrote:

yancey wrote:btw, I've always thought that post-ban Ali probably learned to hit harder than the '67 version.

I doubt Cleveland Williams would have agreed with you.

I KNEW someone was going to bring up Cleveland Williams.

Heck, a mild breeze could have knocked over Williams, considering the shape he was in circa 1966.

How 'bout that devastating punching performance Ali delivered against crippled-up, china-chinned Floyd Patterson in '65?? Hmmmnnn?

Or those two "powerful" punching performances against Sir Henry Cooper in '63 and '66?

You know, the Henry Cooper that Patterson laid out flat later in '66?

Hmmmnnnn?

Cheers.

yancey wrote:How does it go?

Ali wins at least 11 rounds against Bonavena for a clear-cut UD.

HAHA good one buddy

yancey wrote:

keithmoonhangover wrote:

yancey wrote:btw, I've always thought that post-ban Ali probably learned to hit harder than the '67 version.

I doubt Cleveland Williams would have agreed with you.

I KNEW someone was going to bring up Cleveland Williams.

Heck, a mild breeze could have knocked over Williams, considering the shape he was in circa 1966.

How 'bout that devastating punching performance Ali delivered against crippled-up, china-chinned Floyd Patterson in '65?? Hmmmnnn?

Or those two "powerful" punching performances against Sir Henry Cooper in '63 and '66?

You know, the Henry Cooper that Patterson laid out flat later in '66?

Hmmmnnnn?

Cheers.

Might just want to take a look at Williams record in this time period where you think he was a walking cadaver. What happened to him is a fact, how it affected his performance is harder to quantify....no doubt it didn't improve his game. But he didn't seem to be a corpse either.

And cmon.....Ringo was an interesting "contender". But champion during this period? I don't think he was a serious threat other than by fluke.

BoxBuzz wrote:And cmon.....Ringo was an interesting "contender". But champion during this period? I don't think he was a serious threat other than by fluke.

Who was calling Ringo a "champion"?

my point being.....he couldn't have seriously competed with the best......he was a tier below.

Goodnight, Irene wrote:Seriously?

Ali any way he pleases.

I think Ringo always gives Ali problems. Bonavena was better than Chuvalo and Ali had his hands full with Chuvalo 1966.

BoxBuzz wrote:

yancey wrote:

keithmoonhangover wrote: I doubt Cleveland Williams would have agreed with you.

I KNEW someone was going to bring up Cleveland Williams.

Heck, a mild breeze could have knocked over Williams, considering the shape he was in circa 1966.

How 'bout that devastating punching performance Ali delivered against crippled-up, china-chinned Floyd Patterson in '65?? Hmmmnnn?

Or those two "powerful" punching performances against Sir Henry Cooper in '63 and '66?

You know, the Henry Cooper that Patterson laid out flat later in '66?

Hmmmnnnn?

Cheers.

Might just want to take a look at Williams record in this time period where you think he was a walking cadaver. What happened to him is a fact, how it affected his performance is harder to quantify....no doubt it didn't improve his game. But he didn't seem to be a corpse either.

Have you looked at his record during this period? He fought four pretty poor quality fighters and despite having previously been a wrecking ball he failed to KO arguably the two chinniest of the four. After Ali it was a year and half before he fought and was never able to defeat a decent fighter again. I think its very safe to say Williams was far past his best when Ali fought him.

yancey wrote:

dempseyfire wrote:"learned to hit harder? . . . huh???

This is an impossible concept???

Yes. The guy had been boxing since he was a young teenager. He didn't suddenly "learn" anything new at 28 years old in exile about punching.

Stop trying to inflate the post-exile ALi so the Frazier W looks better. It's extremely transparent.

I dont think its impossible to suggest Ali started sitting down on his punches more after his exile when he was unable to dance as much.

I dont think its impossible to suggest Ali started sitting down on his punches more after his exile when he was unable to dance as much.

klompton wrote:I dont think its impossible to suggest Ali started sitting down on his punches more after his exile when he was unable to dance as much.

He sat down on his punches before the ban. Watch his KO's of Williams and Folley.

Theres a big difference between sitting down on your punches, and blowing out two fighters with little to nothing left.

klompton wrote:Theres a big difference between sitting down on your punches, and blowing out two fighters with little to nothing left.

No. It's two different things. Ali sat down on his punches, so he could create more power. The opposition is another matter altogether.

How a fighter fights an opponent is dictated entirely on what that opponent brings to the table. You cannot seperate the two, even to support your flimsy argument.

klompton wrote:I dont think its impossible to suggest Ali started sitting down on his punches more after his exile when he was unable to dance as much.

Before the ban with younger legs he had the option to either dance or stand more flat-footed generating more power. All the layoff did was decrease his options as he couldn't move for as long as he could earlier. It's not like he fought his entire career a la the first round of Liston I. Most of the Terrell fight for example he's more stationary firing hard shots to Ernie's "peek a boo" defense.