BoxRec

The thread about N-Dru Galato got me thinking how he left some fighters seriously wobbled or hurt off the hook, only to lose the fight later on.

The 2nd rd againnst Bowe. The 1st rd against Grant are prime examples. Especially Grant, who isn't Holmes in the recuperating dept.

Who else had a tendency of being one punch away from KO victories yet being unable to score them?

The myth of Holmes' miraculous recuperative abilities rears its ugly, mis-shapen head again.

Fact: The only first-class finisher Holmes ever met was Tyson.

That's far from a fact, it's plain wrong.

Holyfield? Shavers?

No, and no.

Goodnight, Irene wrote:Holyfield? Shavers?

No, and no.

Shavers was as good a finisher as Tyson, if he wasn't first class in that department- nobody is. I'd also include Evander, but, unlike Shavers, that is debatable. Norton, Roy Williams & Mercer were also far above average finishers.

The thing is that you are not supposed to get up from a shot like Homes received from Shavers. I dislike Holmes with a passion, but he regrouped against Shavers. Who else did Shavers let off the hook like that?

Mike Weaver was another excellent finisher. I'm not sure why you picked this thread for the comment, but you're wrong on all accounts here.

Jaywheel wrote:The thing is that you are not supposed to get up from a shot like Homes received from Shavers. I dislike Holmes with a passion, but he regrouped against Shavers. Who else did Shavers let off the hook like that?

Ali ate a nuclear right hand at the end of, I believe, the second round. That would have been interesting if there was more time.

Irene detests Shavers to the point that he can't even credit him with finishing prowess.

He faced some good finishers, that is not in question.

He didnt face a specialist until Tyson. Shavers was a first-class puncher, and a third-class everything else. Easily among the more over-rated contenders in HW history.

The rest of his remarkable comebacks, given the putrid level of opposition, do not impress me. Virtually all the best of Holmes' title challengers had two things in common...

1. They were inexperienced, developing guys (often with fewer than twenty bouts)

2. They never got rematches if they did well.

Jaywheel wrote:The thing is that you are not supposed to get up from a shot like Homes received from Shavers. I dislike Holmes with a passion, but he regrouped against Shavers. Who else did Shavers let off the hook like that?

It is there for all to see how tired Shavers was by the sixth.

I've read all that stuff from you every time Shavers is mentioned. Some fair points, him not being an elite finisher is hog wash. If Witherspoon wasn't an elite finisher, he was damn close. I feel like someone hacked your account, truly terrible stuff.

I have nothing in the world personally against Shavers (why would anyone?), but he was the walking definition of one-dimensional.

That is not hate. It is criticism.

Jaywheel wrote:The thing is that you are not supposed to get up from a shot like Homes received from Shavers. I dislike Holmes with a passion, but he regrouped against Shavers. Who else did Shavers let off the hook like that?

I agree that Shavers was an excelent finisher, but he did let Lyle slip away. He was fighting a great fight, but like happened in many of his fights, he ran out of gas. If you haven't seen that fight it's worth watching, especially to dispel any notion that Shavers had no skills besides a massive punch, plus I think he dropped Lyle with a left hook.

You could also argue that he let Young off the hook in the 2nd fight, but Jimmy was as slick as they come and that was excusable. Any other example, like possibly Mercado, was a worn out version of Shavers.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Shavers was as good a finisher as Tyson, if he wasn't first class in that department- nobody is. I'd also include Evander, but, unlike Shavers, that is debatable. Norton, Roy Williams & Mercer were also far above average finishers.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Mike Weaver was another excellent finisher. I'm not sure why you picked this thread for the comment, but you're wrong on all accounts here.

All good examples, as well as Spoon, who you also mentioned. Weaver tends to get overlooked a lot these days, probably because of his somewaht inconsistent record, but he was quite dangerous.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I've read all that stuff from you every time Shavers is mentioned. Some fair points, him not being an elite finisher is hog wash. If Witherspoon wasn't an elite finisher, he was damn close. I feel like someone hacked your account, truly terrible stuff.

I'd say Cooney was a good finisher also

hhaehre wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I've read all that stuff from you every time Shavers is mentioned. Some fair points, him not being an elite finisher is hog wash. If Witherspoon wasn't an elite finisher, he was damn close. I feel like someone hacked your account, truly terrible stuff.

I'd say Cooney was a good finisher also

Agreed. He had is faults, but when he had someone hurt he knew how to close the show.

Jaywheel wrote:The thread about N-Dru Galato got me thinking how he left some fighters seriously wobbled or hurt off the hook, only to lose the fight later on.

The 2nd rd againnst Bowe. The 1st rd against Grant are prime examples.

And the fight against Ruiz as well. Ruiz was down, than the referee credited Golota with another knockdown (not real, but that is not the case)... so with just a bit more effort it would be a TKO for him.

How amazing to bounce back from the brink against Renaldo Snipes

Shavers being on par with Tyson as a finisher is probably your worst ever post, Saad (which, in this forum, still makes you one of the best members we've ever had). Nevertheless, its a clanger.

Take away great handspeed, decent head movement and footwork, a two-handed arsenal, a very good chin, fair stamina, and you no longer have Mike Tyson, you have Earnie Shavers...yet he was somehow on par with Tyson as a finisher!? LOL.

How would you guys rate Frazier and Duran as finishers?

Goodnight, Irene wrote:How amazing to bounce back from the brink against Renaldo Snipes

Shavers being on par with Tyson as a finisher is probably your worst ever post, Saad (which, in this forum, still makes you one of the best members we've ever had). Nevertheless, its a clanger.

Take away great handspeed, decent head movement and footwork, a two-handed arsenal, a very good chin, fair stamina, and you no longer have Mike Tyson, you have Earnie Shavers...yet he was somehow on par with Tyson as a finisher!? LOL.

Sometimes the truth can be painful my friend, you're better off in another thread. Pretty much everything you've said in here is false.

..damn.....i thought i posted this but somehow it vanished...so...once more

..one example of not finishing......charles/walcott 1......ezzard had jersey joe in trouble in the seventh round and probably could have kayoed him but he let up.....her was told by his corner not to take chances with walcott and be conservative....charles often paid too much attention to his corner...

pre-baroudi ezzard was a great finisher.....post-baroudi only in spurts...

How about Yvon Durelle?

I doubt anyone was going to dispose of Moore on that fateful evening.

Durelle certainly was "unsuccessful" in that case. Don't think it was habitual though.

I don't think Charles should be mentioned. It's quite understandable that he would hold back a bit after killing a man.

......daveboy...ezzard is an all-time great and my favorite all-time fighter and one of my personal heroes.....i wasn't denigrating him.....just pointing out how the accidental death of an opponent changed him from a great finisher to an often reluctant one...