BoxRec

Duran
Hagler
Frazier
Marciano
Louis
Tyson

1) Louis
2) Frazier
3) Duran
4) Tyson
5) Marciano
6) Hagler

bennie wrote:1) Louis
2) Frazier
3) Duran
4) Tyson
5) Marciano
6) Hagler

I meant to rate each one separately as a finisher.

For me,

Louis = 10
Tyson = 9.5
Frazier = 8+
Marciano = 8+
Duran ?
Hagler ?

"Finishing" to means when you have your opponent hurt and showing definite signs of being ready to go, to efficiently capitalize on the situation and take them out right then and there.

Frazier and Marciano, possibly also Duran, to me were attrition types who were not necessarily explosive finishers.

I'm sure Jersey Joe Walcott and Bob Foster might disagree with me a bit on Rocky and Joe.

Duran - 7
Hagler - 7
Frazier - 9
Marciano - 8
Louis - 10
Tyson - 9

I have to say that SRL was a superb finisher.

Dont you think 9.5 for Tyson is a touch generous?

I think Marciano was as good of a finisher as anyone mentioned here. All of these guys were good.

Marciano 9
Louis 9
Tyson 8.5
Hagler 8
Frazier 8
Duran 7.5

Goodnight, Irene wrote:Dont you think 9.5 for Tyson is a touch generous?

Yes, maybe so.

Probably overly influenced by some of those quick one rounders.

yancey wrote:Duran
Hagler
Frazier
Marciano
Louis
Tyson

Duran- 8
Hagler- 9
Frazier- 8
Marciano- 9
Louis- 12
Tyson- 9

I would probably give Hagler an 8.5 or 9 too, were it not for his majorly dropping the ball against Duran and Leonard.

He was an outstanding finisher at nearly all other times, put it that way.

Goodnight, Irene wrote:I would probably give Hagler an 8.5 or 9 too, were it not for his majorly dropping the ball against Duran and Leonard.

He was an outstanding finisher at nearly all other times, put it that way.

He froze against Duran, I can't expect him to stop a fleeing Leonard at the end of his career. I almost gave him a 10, he wasn't a massive puncher but he was a deadly finisher.

He choked pretty badly against Duran, in a sign of things to come (the Leonard disaster). Ive got to deduct from him for Leonard, though. A great fighter --- and finisher --- should have done far better than Hagler managed when Leonard faded (more than once in the later rounds), and any decay of Hagler being aged is more than offset by Leonard's more difficult circumstances.

Hagler, as you say, was not a really, genuinely heavy hitter, which only further cements his finishing pedigree. He could be, and almost always was, great at it.

And yet...a one-out-of-three strike rate against his very best contemporaries (and that, against the totally chinless To...just kidding, Saad D) leaves vague, nagging doubts about him in mythical match-ups with the legends.

Holding not stopping fighters like Duran & Leonard against him is flimsy at best.

in the earl 80's when a Leonard Hagler fight was first mooted everyone picked Hagler by KO/stoppage and rightly so. They also picked the same result for 1987 but hadn't realised how much Hagler had slipped and how foolish he'd be by not getting all over Leonard from the outset

bollox wrote:in the earl 80's when a Leonard Hagler fight was first mooted everyone picked Hagler by KO/stoppage and rightly so. They also picked the same result for 1987 but hadn't realised how much Hagler had slipped and how foolish he'd be by not getting all over Leonard from the outset

I picked Leonard by decision in 87.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

bollox wrote:in the earl 80's when a Leonard Hagler fight was first mooted everyone picked Hagler by KO/stoppage and rightly so. They also picked the same result for 1987 but hadn't realised how much Hagler had slipped and how foolish he'd be by not getting all over Leonard from the outset

I picked Leonard by decision in 87.

the vast majority of *experts* picked Hagler by stoppage

bollox wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

bollox wrote:in the earl 80's when a Leonard Hagler fight was first mooted everyone picked Hagler by KO/stoppage and rightly so. They also picked the same result for 1987 but hadn't realised how much Hagler had slipped and how foolish he'd be by not getting all over Leonard from the outset

I picked Leonard by decision in 87.

the vast majority of *experts* picked Hagler by stoppage

Yup, you said everyone did. I see you amended it to experts, no problem there- I am one.

What made you think Leonard was going to win? Despite all the advantages Leonard had / had been given, the thinking was that a good steamrolling by the mid rounds was inevitable

I myself was hoping leonard would get squashed like a pesky mosquito

bollox wrote:What made you think Leonard was going to win? Despite all the advantages Leonard had / had been given, the thinking was that a good steamrolling by the mid rounds was inevitable

I myself was hoping leonard would get squashed like a pesky mosquito

Hagler's speed had been diminishing for quite some time and I figured Leonard would get the benefit of every close round. Ray is my most hated fighter in history, but he wouldn't have signed if he didn't like his chances. If it would have been 15, he wouldn't have made it.

I'm not sure that Leonard was the most hated fighter in history but he certinly was the smarmiest :x

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Holding not stopping fighters like Duran & Leonard against him is flimsy at best.

Think Duran or Leonard would have heard the final bell against Monzon?

Goodnight, Irene wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Holding not stopping fighters like Duran & Leonard against him is flimsy at best.

Think Duran or Leonard would have heard the final bell against Monzon?

Absolutely

Fair chance of that, but neither's hand would be held up at fights end.

Duran would be shipped back along the Panama Canal in pieces.

Yep....but Monzon took pleasure in beating up folks....so I've never been convinced he pined for the KO....but if a KO presented itself...he was not shy to finish up and go home. I think he'd take particular pleasure in picking apart either of these MW pretenders. It would be far more destructive than either of the encounters these guys had with "civilized" Marvin Hagler.

But either of them would be pretty broken up by the 12th...and close to non existent by 15.

Goodnight, Irene wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Holding not stopping fighters like Duran & Leonard against him is flimsy at best.

Think Duran or Leonard would have heard the final bell against Monzon?

why not, if an ancient Emile Griffith could manage it?