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Prime for prime, Bowe wouldn't have gotten within 100 feet of Tyson.

Tyson's only chance here is catching Riddick mid-range, Bowe's jab would dominate outside and Bowe was immensely superior at in-fighting. Mike has a punchers chance, but little more, Bowe by late stoppage.

The Great John L wrote:Prime for prime, Bowe wouldn't have gotten within 100 feet of Tyson.

Sure he would, he fought, and beat, better.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Tyson's only chance here is catching Riddick mid-range, Bowe's jab would dominate outside and Bowe was immensely superior at in-fighting. Mike has a punchers chance, but little more, Bowe by late stoppage.

Agreed. Bowe also had a helluva chin. The Golota beating he absorbed was chilling.

The Great John L wrote:Prime for prime, Bowe wouldn't have gotten within 100 feet of Tyson.

how would they fight then?

seriously, if bonecrusher could tie him up and go the distance then bowe who wouldnt be intimidated would fight back and probably have the fire power to back up tyson

Prime Tyson slaughters Bowe. Bowe didn't have enough lateral movement to stay away from Tyson. Prime Tyson was great at using his lack of hieght to his advantage.

Yes Bowe was great on the inside, but as Tyson landed coming in, Bowe would hang on more than normal.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

The Great John L wrote:Prime for prime, Bowe wouldn't have gotten within 100 feet of Tyson.

Sure he would, he fought, and beat, better.

Yes, Holyfield. And Bowe spent the rest of his career avoiding anyone who could punch. Besides the trilogy with Holy, he has a pathetic resume for someone who many claim as an ATG.

Michael Moorer beat Holyfield as well, but I wouldn't favor him over Tyson, although MM at least had the guts to step in the ring with big punchers.

The Great John L wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

The Great John L wrote:Prime for prime, Bowe wouldn't have gotten within 100 feet of Tyson.

Sure he would, he fought, and beat, better.

Yes, Holyfield. And Bowe spent the rest of his career avoiding anyone who could punch. Besides the trilogy with Holy, he has a pathetic resume for someone who many claim as an ATG.

Michael Moorer beat Holyfield as well, but I wouldn't favor him over Tyson, although MM at least had the guts to step in the ring with big punchers.

Bowe avoided Lewis; pretty obvious there.
But what other big punchers?
Foreman wasn't exactly going for challenging fights after Moorer.
Ruddock was done.
Mercer could've had his shot at Bowe, but Ferguson screwed that up.
And Golota, psycho though he was, could punch quite hard.

Ruddock was done? Leading up to Holyfield

Marin
Philip Brown
Seldon
Tillery (twice)
Nelson
Bigfoot
Coetzer

I think Ruddock was much more credible than any of them, despite a few losses.

And then the title defenses.

Dokes
Ferguson
Holy
Mathis Jr
Donald
JL Gonzalez

Besides Holy, if these were Klitshko opponents everyone here would be ridiculing these guys. Dokes of ten years earlier would have been an accomplishment, and Donald was quite skilled, but was hardly a puncher that could dent the always exposed Bowe chin.

Ruddock, Mercer, Morrison, Bruno, Lewis were all big punchers available during the same period. Golota could punch, but I'm sure he was merely a miscalculation by Bowe's management who probably regarded him as an over-hyped build up with a weak resume. Of course, Bowe did beat him, so I give him a lot of credit for heart. At least once he was coaxed into the ring.

Tyson was certainly flawed both as a person and a fighter, but he fought virtually everybody coming up and pretty much cleaned out the division

Tyson for me.

I get the bonecrusher hugging analogy, and tru Bowe was great on the inside compared to Tyson, but blocking prime Tyson's punches with your face while you let him in is a recipe for disaster. He couldn't avoid a single punch from Gelato in 2 fights ffs.

The Great John L wrote:Ruddock was done? Leading up to Holyfield

Marin
Philip Brown
Seldon
Tillery (twice)
Nelson
Bigfoot
Coetzer

I think Ruddock was much more credible than any of them, despite a few losses.

And then the title defenses.

Dokes
Ferguson
Holy
Mathis Jr
Donald
JL Gonzalez

Besides Holy, if these were Klitshko opponents everyone here would be ridiculing these guys. Dokes of ten years earlier would have been an accomplishment, and Donald was quite skilled, but was hardly a puncher that could dent the always exposed Bowe chin.

Ruddock, Mercer, Morrison, Bruno, Lewis were all big punchers available during the same period. Golota could punch, but I'm sure he was merely a miscalculation by Bowe's management who probably regarded him as an over-hyped build up with a weak resume. Of course, Bowe did beat him, so I give him a lot of credit for heart. At least once he was coaxed into the ring.

Tyson was certainly flawed both as a person and a fighter, but he fought virtually everybody coming up and pretty much cleaned out the division

Ruddock was done after Lewis. I'm referring to when Bowe became champ.
He should've fought Lewis, and that was about as blatant a duck job as there ever was, but Morrison was quickly KO'd by Bentt after he won his belt, Bruno was KO'd by Lewis and then lined up for Tyson after he'd beaten McCall, and Mercer could've gotten a shot if he'd managed to beat Jesse Ferguson.
And Golota hit quite hard, so Bowe showed he'd fight a big puncher.
Again, agree totally on Lewis.

Jaywheel wrote:I get the bonecrusher hugging analogy, and tru Bowe was great on the inside compared to Tyson, but blocking prime Tyson's punches with your face while you let him in is a recipe for disaster. He couldn't avoid a single punch from Gelato in 2 fights ffs.

Golota was much better with his jab than Tyson, and that wasn't prime Bowe anyway.

Rover wrote:

Jaywheel wrote:I get the bonecrusher hugging analogy, and tru Bowe was great on the inside compared to Tyson, but blocking prime Tyson's punches with your face while you let him in is a recipe for disaster. He couldn't avoid a single punch from Gelato in 2 fights ffs.

Golota was much better with his jab than Tyson, and that wasn't prime Bowe anyway.

Bowe's prime was even shorter than Tyson's according to his backers. Lasted a whole fight.

Jaywheel wrote:

Rover wrote:

Jaywheel wrote:I get the bonecrusher hugging analogy, and tru Bowe was great on the inside compared to Tyson, but blocking prime Tyson's punches with your face while you let him in is a recipe for disaster. He couldn't avoid a single punch from Gelato in 2 fights ffs.

Golota was much better with his jab than Tyson, and that wasn't prime Bowe anyway.

Bowe's prime was even shorter than Tyson's according to his backers. Lasted a whole fight.

No, it was longer than that, but just listen to his speech from after Holyfield I compared to after Golota II. HBO showed it on the Legendary Nights series. Bowe absolutely was declining by then. I give Holy 100% credit for the second Bowe fight; Bowe was not in the best of condition, but that was Bowe's fault.

The Great John L wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

The Great John L wrote:Prime for prime, Bowe wouldn't have gotten within 100 feet of Tyson.

Sure he would, he fought, and beat, better.

Yes, Holyfield. And Bowe spent the rest of his career avoiding anyone who could punch. Besides the trilogy with Holy, he has a pathetic resume for someone who many claim as an ATG.

Michael Moorer beat Holyfield as well, but I wouldn't favor him over Tyson, although MM at least had the guts to step in the ring with big punchers.

You detest Bowe, speaking about him with anything but derision is outside of your comfort zone. I shouldn't even have bothered responding to you.

Jaywheel wrote:I get the bonecrusher hugging analogy, and tru Bowe was great on the inside compared to Tyson, but blocking prime Tyson's punches with your face while you let him in is a recipe for disaster. He couldn't avoid a single punch from Gelato in 2 fights ffs.

Neither one of these guys is going to avoid many punches. Bowe is just bigger and he has much more versatility in his offense. They both had great chins, Mike's was probably better, and a ton of heart. Bowe's will to win was greater than Mike's. When it came time to dig deep, gotta go with Riddick.

That's the thing. On a one night affair, I think Mike could close the show in 3-4 rds, taking shots coming in to mid-range for sure, but not having his will tested has much as some could think.
I definitely could see Bowe be close to or split a series of fight with Mike.

He could, it's just not the most likely scenario to me when the other guy has the majority of the advantages. Though speed is a good one to have on your side. Guys as tough as Bowe are hard to keep down. Well, I'd assume so, nobody ever did it. Holyfield should have.

Golota should have too. The way he let him off the hook, as he did with Grant, is Durellesque though never facing an Archie.

Jaywheel wrote:Golota should have too. The way he let him off the hook, as he did with Grant, is Durellesque though never facing an Archie.

Golota could have if he went exclusively upstairs, but I prefer not to try and gauge what 100 low blows took out of him. Of course Tyson smashed Ruddock in the sack relentlessly in the rematch, so you never know.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:He could, it's just not the most likely scenario to me when the other guy has the majority of the advantages. Though speed is a good one to have on your side. Guys as tough as Bowe are hard to keep down. Well, I'd assume so, nobody ever did it. Holyfield should have.

If we are talking prime Tyson, then he has the edge on punching power, foot speed, head movement, hand speed and combination punching.

keithmoonhangover wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:He could, it's just not the most likely scenario to me when the other guy has the majority of the advantages. Though speed is a good one to have on your side. Guys as tough as Bowe are hard to keep down. Well, I'd assume so, nobody ever did it. Holyfield should have.

If we are talking prime Tyson, then he has the edge on punching power, foot speed, head movement, hand speed and combination punching.

As I said, Tyson had the edge in speed. He never moved his head against a fighter like Bowe. Combination punching would be Riddick for me, more variety and he could think in there. I'd call their power even.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

keithmoonhangover wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:He could, it's just not the most likely scenario to me when the other guy has the majority of the advantages. Though speed is a good one to have on your side. Guys as tough as Bowe are hard to keep down. Well, I'd assume so, nobody ever did it. Holyfield should have.

If we are talking prime Tyson, then he has the edge on punching power, foot speed, head movement, hand speed and combination punching.

As I said, Tyson had the edge in speed. He never moved his head against a fighter like Bowe. Combination punching would be Riddick for me, more variety and he could think in there. I'd call their power even.

You really are talking bollocks now.

keithmoonhangover wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

keithmoonhangover wrote:
If we are talking prime Tyson, then he has the edge on punching power, foot speed, head movement, hand speed and combination punching.

As I said, Tyson had the edge in speed. He never moved his head against a fighter like Bowe. Combination punching would be Riddick for me, more variety and he could think in there. I'd call their power even.

You really are talking bollocks now.