BoxRec

Who is the P4P Greatest Fighter of ALL Time??

I have put a list together of a few fighters that come to mind...

What do you think?

If I've missed someone off the list let me know and if you think someone is not deserving to be on there let me know too...
Share your opinion!

After Robinson, Armstrong and Harry Greb (in any order) is there really anyone else in top 3?

Langford isn't far.

Jaywheel wrote:Langford isn't far.

That's my vote, I need an other option. I also believe Charles is in that territory.

Marciano & Dempsey aren't in in my top 50.

Why do i never get tired of all this...?

Ezzard wrote:Why do i never get tired of all this...?

A man that shares a name with you belongs on the list.

Greb has a fair claim as being #1 in my humble opinion

scallum wrote:Greb has a fair claim as being #1 in my humble opinion

without seeing any film of greb i can not rate him

IF this were the "list toppers" (and I'm not sayin it is) Duran's name once entered would drop one of these from the fray.

Greb not being here is a bit interesting...even if we can't judge his work by film.

But I would probably argue that we can only rate those who have some sort of visual record.

Otherwise Maxie Rosenbloom might have legitimacy in this list.

Probably should NOT be another HW on the list other than Ali....hmm ok Charles.....considering he was really a LHW.


ok....Louis I suppose.

BoxBuzz wrote:Probably should NOT be another HW on the list other than Ali....hmm ok Charles.....considering he was really a LHW.


ok....Louis I suppose.

I think they were both greater than Ali, Charles without debate.

Someone chose Ali? Maybe if you we were talking about P4P biggest mouths. Anyways, I chose Robinson.

BoxBuzz wrote:IF this were the "list toppers" (and I'm not sayin it is) Duran's name once entered would drop one of these from the fray.

Greb not being here is a bit interesting...even if we can't judge his work by film.

But I would probably argue that we can only rate those who have some sort of visual record.

Otherwise Maxie Rosenbloom might have legitimacy in this list.

Buzz you didn't even know who Rosenbloom was before the sim.

My top 5

1) Harry Greb

2) Sam Langford

3) Sugar Ray Robinson

4) Ezzard Charles

5) Henry Armstrong

That's the same five I have albeit in a little different order. I don't really see how anyone else can break in past those five.

Do you guys think it is ignorant of Bert Sugar to have Langford 16th on his top 100?

Yes, that's ridiculous. Though I've honestly never been very impressed with Sugar's rating skills. He's an entertaining figure but I've always found him too unyielding to any modern fighters. That makes the Langford placement even more peculiar. Like I said, I can't see a top 5 without Sam.

I think Dempsey has the top 5.

In a top ten you could any of the below and I’d take it seriously…

Archie Moore
Gene Tunney
Roberto Duran
Benny Leonard
Joe Gans
Willie Pep
Sandy Saddler
Eder Jofre
Jimmy Wilde
Mickey Walker

You could make a case for many, many others too.

Ezzard wrote:I think Dempsey has the top 5.

In a top ten you could any of the below and I’d take it seriously…

Archie Moore
Gene Tunney
Roberto Duran
Benny Leonard
Joe Gans
Willie Pep
Sandy Saddler
Eder Jofre
Jimmy Wilde
Mickey Walker

You could make a case for many, many others too.

I think top 10 is too high for Wilde & Jofre. Agree with the others. Gavilan is a guy I think gets underrated on these lists.

Can't say I can say who is # Pound for Pound. I always thought that the first 10 fighters elected into the Boxrec Hall of Fame is a pretty good list for the top 10

The rest of the list consists of:
Ali
Armstrong
Charles
Greb
Louis
Marciano
Monzon
Moore
Pep
Robinson

I wouldn't have Marciano in there and probably not Pep. Still not a bad list.

Believe it or not, Langford didn't make it. (Voters could vote for up to 25 fighters and less than 75% had Langford on their ballot!)
Interesting how his stock has gone up in the last few years. He certainly should be in the top 10.

I think you could these guys in almost any order. Of course there are always going to be guys just outside of the top 10 you could argue for.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Yes, that's ridiculous. Though I've honestly never been very impressed with Sugar's rating skills. He's an entertaining figure but I've always found him too unyielding to any modern fighters. That makes the Langford placement even more peculiar. Like I said, I can't see a top 5 without Sam.

There are definitely some peculiar placements in his 'Top 100'. I agree that Sugar did not pencil in enough modern fighters but I can, to some degree, understand why he does so. A lot of subjectivity goes into these lists and I personally would not have a heavyweight in the top 5, mainly because heavyweights typically have less flexibility than people of other weight classes. What I mean is that a heavyweight is typically confined to one weight class, whereas others can go up and down which presents more challenges. Just my opinion. Langford was no doubt great though.

It's incredibly subjective, but, as i've said on here before, I think there are pretty clearly defined tiers. Like Alp's post, I'd agree with almost every word except for marciano belonging in the top 10, I have a hard time imagining him in the top 50. To me that is beyond subjectivity.

I completely agree on Heavyweights, not so much that they're just one class than the fact that they are largely less skilled fighters and tend to fight in a division lacking in the depth you'll find in the lower classes. They've also always made more money and had the luxury of fighting less frequently and taking on less top opposition. I don't have an issue with Ali or Louis in the top 10, the top 5 is a bridge too far for either one of them. No other career Heavyweight deserves consideration for that positioning.

Conventional wisdom has Robinson best of all times. The top five listed here with Greb,Charles,Armstrong and langford is solid too. I'm leaning towards maybe putting Bennie Leonard in over Langford though. It aint something I'm gonna go to the mattreses about though because I'm not super familiar with Langfords career. Lookin at his record,he got beat often by Harry Wills but that might be a past his prime size thing. I like Charles in there largely based on his performances at middle. Beating guys like Charley Burley who could also be talked about as a top ten guy.

Expug wrote:Conventional wisdom has Robinson best of all times. The top five listed here with Greb,Charles,Armstrong and langford is solid too. I'm leaning towards maybe putting Bennie Leonard in over Langford though. It aint something I'm gonna go to the mattreses about though because I'm not super familiar with Langfords career. Lookin at his record,he got beat often by Harry Wills but that might be a past his prime size thing. I like Charles in there largely based on his performances at middle. Beating guys like Charley Burley who could also be talked about as a top ten guy.

He was way past his prime when he fought Wills and was obviously undersized. One thing that isn't subjective is that Langford beat ATG fighters from Lightweight to heavyweight, nobody else has and nobody else ever will.

Most of Sam's losses to Harry were well past his prime, but I'd argue Sam was still at the very twilight of his prime in 1915, or at least that not far from his peak. Wills should get credit for those initial victories of Sam when no other heavyweight was able to beat him (and I don't think it negates from Sam, since Sam was a natural super-middle/small light HW and Wills was a great heavyweight)