BoxRec

http://www.espn.co.uk/boxing/sport/story/185897.html#

Because, accordingly to Allegedly, Froch is a coward if he doesn't skip trying and avenge his first defeat in a massive fight against a world class competitor and instead opt to step up in weight unneccessarily to fight an unproven kid whose record consists of one great domestic scrap and a load of filler....

Way to go that man!

A "decent matchup"?? It's a rematch between 2 evenly matched, arguably top 20, pound for pounders who gave us one of the best world title fights in recent years and which is pretty much nailed on to be an all out war as equally as exciting as their 1st bout!

It doesn't matter how many times i read the trash warren comes out with, i never fail to find the mans audacity utterly jaw-dropping. Does he really believe what he writes? Or does he really think his readers are that stupid?

I like Nathan, he's decent, but please sort out business in your own division before calling out naturally smaller fighters, however good they are.

Let's be honest, Froch is in most people's P4P top 10. In terms of British boxing he's "the man". Why should he move up in weight to accomodate Cleverly? When you're "the man" people come to you. It's not as if Cleverly's belt is worth anything, it's a paper mache belt pure and simple.

Froch is apparantly in line for £2m for fighting Kessler. If he wins he's probably in line for £1m plus against Ward, which is similar to what W@rren is allegedly offering for a Cleverly fight. Personally if I were Froch I'd do my best to take W@rren's £1m. It's easy money. Froch would go through Clev like a hot knife through butter. However, I think w@rren also knows that, which is why the fight would have to be on Boxn@tion not Sky - something Sky wouldn't allow in a million years. W@rren gets to keep trashing Froch safely in the knowledge one of his few remaining cash cows will continue fighting the Hawk's of the world.

Don't get me wrong, this isn't a bash Cleverly post, I really like him and want to see him do well, it's just his promoter talks of Froch, Hopkins, Shumenov and delivers Karpency, Hawk and Krasnique. We all know W@rren's full of utter shite, but a lot of casual fans probably read his Sun column and believe what's written

I think the time has come where nathan should consider ringing him up and saying "ffs put a lid on it please, your making us both look like fools...etc". He's doing the lad no favours with this nonsense, it's gona put A LOT of people off his fighter. It's like hes at that stage where he just couldn't care less what people think.

Didn't know Frank was branching out into absurdist comedy. Truly Hilarious.

Froch would spank the living daylights out of cleverly. I almost hope Frank gets his wish, but at a catchweight.

Why should Froch move up, Cleverly needs to come down in weight if anything.

If Froch is going to move up, why waste his time with Cleverly, he's not even nearly the best at 175.

If Warren wants Nathan to fight Froch then Nathan will have to come down to say 12st 2lbs.
If not , forget it!

Its more of the same old bollocks from the bitterest promoter on the planet.

His number one priority isn't any fighter, its the TV channel. I've had a theory for a while about it.... if you are the owner of the world's only boxing channel AND you get past the tricky first year / two year period where losses will inevitably be sustained, might you end up pretty much putting the managerial and contractual side of the business onto the back burner, because you've got a more important card up your sleeve than contracts with individual boxers ? Kick the thankless task of developing fighters into touch, and just cherry pick good fights for your channel. The channel's survival and success is what matters. Why invest 2-3 years and hundreds of thousands into developing unbeaten fighters, which is a tricky business at the best of times. Leave that to the others, they'll still need TV coverage. Its just a thought.

Anyway, I hope Cleverley leaves Warren when his contract is up and strolls over to join Eddie

Because he'll be giving away a fair bit of weight. Carl doesn't walk round at much more than 175.

The Dark Destroyer wrote:

binipop wrote:Because he'll be giving away a fair bit of weight. Carl doesn't walk round at much more than 175.

So what? He wouldn't be the first boxer to give up a lot of weight would he, if it's as easy as people are making out why would it matter?

For me its why should he move up to fight cleverly when really he got nothing to offer at the min. Carl as got two better fights lined up so why would he consider moving up. Its the same as Chad Dawson vs Andre Ward Dawson was the one who called ward out so he dropped to super middle so why cant cleverly if he wants it so bad?

Personally i don't think it would be easy at all for Froch up at 175, he isn't a devastating puncher at SMW and would be less so at LH. Clev has a good chin, good speed and a high workrate which would give Carl alot of problems. I think Carl would win a tough fight but don't see why he should take it. Picking up WBO at LH won't add to highly impressive resume and i don't think he could take the other top LH's. Kessler & Bute, then maybe Groves or Degale depending on how battle worn he is after that.

binipop wrote:Personally i don't think it would be easy at all for Froch up at 175, he isn't a devastating puncher at SMW and would be less so at LH. Clev has a good chin, good speed and a high workrate which would give Carl alot of problems. I think Carl would win a tough fight but don't see why he should take it. Picking up WBO at LH won't add to highly impressive resume and i don't think he could take the other top LH's. Kessler & Bute, then maybe Groves or Degale depending on how battle worn he is after that.

Agreed,

Especially as Clev knocked Tommy Karpency over the top rope in the opening round to score by knockout, whilst Froch laboured to points wins over that unbeaten IBF champion Bute and that Mack last month.

I think Froch will hide away on that little channel called sky fighting nobodies, instead of being exposed in front of a huge audience of dozens, against Clev on his promoters channel.

So what? He wouldn't be the first boxer to give up a lot of weight would he, if it's as easy as people are making out why would it matter?[/quote]
For me its why should he move up to fight cleverly when really he got nothing to offer at the min. Carl as got two better fights lined up so why would he consider moving up. Its the same as Chad Dawson vs Andre Ward Dawson was the one who called ward out so he dropped to super middle so why cant cleverly if he wants it so bad?[/quote]

I agree he's got bigger and better fights at 168, I just don't see if he was to fight Clev why those two think it'd need to be a catchweight, and why is giving up weight an issue? He's a boxer, boxers give up weight all the time, and Carl is more than good enough to beat Clev at 175, why give people a excuse with a catchweight?[/quote]
I agree it should not be at catchweight my point is if cleverly wants to fight froch go down to super middle then.

Newport Daz wrote:Let's be honest, Froch is in most people's P4P top 10. In terms of British boxing he's "the man". Why should he move up in weight to accomodate Cleverly? When you're "the man" people come to you. It's not as if Cleverly's belt is worth anything, it's a paper mache belt pure and simple.

Froch is apparantly in line for £2m for fighting Kessler. If he wins he's probably in line for £1m plus against Ward, which is similar to what W@rren is allegedly offering for a Cleverly fight. Personally if I were Froch I'd do my best to take W@rren's £1m. It's easy money. Froch would go through Clev like a hot knife through butter. However, I think w@rren also knows that, which is why the fight would have to be on Boxn@tion not Sky - something Sky wouldn't allow in a million years. W@rren gets to keep trashing Froch safely in the knowledge one of his few remaining cash cows will continue fighting the Hawk's of the world.

Don't get me wrong, this isn't a bash Cleverly post, I really like him and want to see him do well, it's just his promoter talks of Froch, Hopkins, Shumenov and delivers Karpency, Hawk and Krasnique. We all know W@rren's full of utter shite, but a lot of casual fans probably read his Sun column and believe what's written

Well written that man Agree 100%

Because he is the one who needs this fight - not Froch.

Carl has no shortage of big, credible fights at 168, he has no reason to go chasing Cleverley who, in world terms, is a nobody. If Cleverley really wants to tempt Carl up to 175 he needs to make himself a somebody by beating one of the big names in that division.

Until he does that he's never going to call the tune.

Why on earth would a career super middle weight gain seven pounds for less money?

Gomez

I'm not for one second comparing the level of opposition between the 2, and yes i'm aware that that needs to be taken into account but it's not the sole criteria for predicting the outcome of a fight. If it's at at LH i think it's a tough fight for Carl, albeit one he would win by 3 or 4 rounds. At SMW he wins more convincingly.

With regards to your last sentence i did say in my original post that i don't see why should Carl should take the fight. Though I think Cleverly is a world class fighter (not elite level like Carl) he isn't being given the chance to prove it with the promoter he has. Whenever i see him on Bunceys show being interviewed he seems as weary and frustrated by the situation as everyone else, at the end of 2010(!) he spoke of unifying the belts in 2011 and retiring in 6 fights time, a comment that now looks utterly laughable. It's about time he got a move on and proved at LH, and against the guys in HIS division, whether he's got it or not.

The Dark Destroyer wrote:

jonp wrote:Why on earth would a career super middle weight gain seven pounds for less money?

Less money? A million would be a career high pay day at this point.

Isnt he getting more for kessler?

The Dark Destroyer wrote:

clintonmcphilbin wrote: I agree it should not be at catchweight my point is if cleverly wants to fight froch go down to super middle then.

Why on earth would a career lightheavyweight drop seven pounds in weight?

Because he wants the fight. Chad dawson did it.

I think boxing is too tough a sport to just give away advantages to unbeaten fighters especialy when the fight will give you no more kudos and has an element of risk to it.
Its not as if Froch is calling for the fight and then denouncing cleverly for not taking it.
You cant call someone out and then want the advantages as well.
If david haye called out cleverly and then hayes promoter afterwards said how bad it would be if cleverly didnt step up and take the fight most people would just think haye was making himself look stupid.

Froch v Cleverly simply isn't a relevant fight at this stage.

Froch has much bigger fish to fry at super-middle. And in any event Clev needs to make a name for himself on the world stage in his own weight division before Warren even dreams about a possible fight between the pair.

But then again, this is all obvious to everyone, including Fwank Warren.

So allegedly is caneing Carl Froch a three time World Champion and a Lonsdale belt holder because he wont fight Nathan Cleverly and all that.... PLLLLLLLEASSSSSSSSSEEE, Froch does not need to fight Nathan Cleverly at all whether it be at Super-Middle or up at Light Heavyweight or even at a catchweight of 170lbs etc Froch is in the position where he is not only a world champion, but a world champion in a talent rich division and can through the help of Sky Sports and "Handsome" Eddie Hearn at Matchroom Sports to fight the best guys at Super-Middle and stated who he would like to get in with at Super Middle who are Lucian Bute, Andre Ward and Mikkel Kessler, although Adonis Stephenson who is his IBF mandatory would also be a tasty fight as well and these fights would generate far much more interest than fighting Cleverly who is starting to look like a Warren cashcow in my eyes as much as I like him.

binipop wrote:Personally i don't think it would be easy at all for Froch up at 175, he isn't a devastating puncher at SMW and would be less so at LH. Clev has a good chin, good speed and a high workrate which would give Carl alot of problems. I think Carl would win a tough fight but don't see why he should take it. Picking up WBO at LH won't add to highly impressive resume and i don't think he could take the other top LH's. Kessler & Bute, then maybe Groves or Degale depending on how battle worn he is after that.

More comedy....hilarious.

Smashed Jermaine Taylor with a barrage of shots to win with seconds to spare, beat Bute to a pulp in a handful of rounds.

Yeah, sure, he's not a devastating puncher!!

Maybe not with one shot, but he can hurt anyone at 168.

I've no doubt Carl COULD if he wanted to, add enough muscle to be strong at 175, and size is the only tangible Cleverly has, but Carl has everything else in his favour.

Cleverly has an awful defence, no proven power at elite level, and no proven ability to fight through adversity as yet at world level.

As soon as this topic was posted and the first response made, the article had achieved it's objective.

JLP wrote:As soon as this topic was posted and the first response made, the article had achieved it's objective.

What, holding up the 'author' to sustained ridicule and, by extension, the chap he promotes?

This one is so unjustifiable it's embarrassing.

How do you swerve somebody that isn't ahead of you?