BoxRec

Are the rumors right or are they just rumors!?

Yeah, but i think 1990 there were thoughts about Tyson-Foreman. According to rumors Tyson said to Don Kinh:"You can fight that f.....g animal, if you want!" and went away. Another possibility is that Foreman did not want to make a deal with King because he didnt trust him.

The Dark Destroyer wrote:Wasn't Tyson in prison when Foreman was fighting for titles the second time?

He was released in May 95, just after the Schulz fight.

No, King did.

Tyson was not going to step into the ring with Foreman....whether it was by Kings decree (who feared he would undo Mike, and King felt he could never control George the way he thought he could Mike) or by Mikes own genuine documented reluctance/concern/fear of this opponent.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:No, King did.

Yep.

Mind you Foreman came back in 1987 and by the time Tyson-Douglas was around, Team Tyson was set to do a three fight deal in which it would have been: Holyfield, Foreman, and (believe it or not) Francesco Damiani. I can't remember the particular order, but that's generally what was going to happen had he of beaten Douglas in Tokyo. Tyson didn't fear the Italian or Holyfield, because nobody thought Holyfield had the stuff to make heavyweight champ, but he was leary of Foreman. The old lessons that D'Amato taught him stuck with him in his mind, one being to 'Never underestimate a man who had once known greatness, for on any given night he can regain that greatness'. Foreman was essentially Tyson himself, but was now older, wiser, etc. Of them all, Foreman quite possibly could have given Tyson the hardest time of them all.

When Foreman promised Don King he was going to drop Adilson Rodriguez right in front of him at ringside the night of the Tillman-Tyson fight and then splattered him right where he said he would, that essentially ended any chance King was letting Foreman in the ring with his emotionally fragile meal ticket.

foxy01 wrote:I don't know or care whether or not Tyson ducked George, but in any event that pushing the opponent off style Foreman had was all wrong for Mike.

Why?


He would have got clobbered like every other diminutive fighter who tried to get inside Big George.

HomicideHenry wrote:Mind you Foreman came back in 1987 and by the time Tyson-Douglas was around, Team Tyson was set to do a three fight deal in which it would have been: Holyfield, Foreman, and (believe it or not) Francesco Damiani. I can't remember the particular order, but that's generally what was going to happen had he of beaten Douglas in Tokyo. Tyson didn't fear the Italian or Holyfield, because nobody thought Holyfield had the stuff to make heavyweight champ, but he was leary of Foreman. The old lessons that D'Amato taught him stuck with him in his mind, one being to 'Never underestimate a man who had once known greatness, for on any given night he can regain that greatness'. Foreman was essentially Tyson himself, but was now older, wiser, etc. Of them all, Foreman quite possibly could have given Tyson the hardest time of them all.

Tyson always was fearful of Evander in the sense that he had no confidence he could beat him. He knew Holyfield had no fear of him and he knew Evander was the better fighter.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:Mind you Foreman came back in 1987 and by the time Tyson-Douglas was around, Team Tyson was set to do a three fight deal in which it would have been: Holyfield, Foreman, and (believe it or not) Francesco Damiani. I can't remember the particular order, but that's generally what was going to happen had he of beaten Douglas in Tokyo. Tyson didn't fear the Italian or Holyfield, because nobody thought Holyfield had the stuff to make heavyweight champ, but he was leary of Foreman. The old lessons that D'Amato taught him stuck with him in his mind, one being to 'Never underestimate a man who had once known greatness, for on any given night he can regain that greatness'. Foreman was essentially Tyson himself, but was now older, wiser, etc. Of them all, Foreman quite possibly could have given Tyson the hardest time of them all.

Tyson always was fearful of Evander in the sense that he had no confidence he could beat him. He knew Holyfield had no fear of him and he knew Evander was the better fighter.

Tyson didn't have the confidence to fight someone he knew was unafraid of him. That would be a prime Holyfield, the combacking Foreman and in my opinion Riddick Bowe.

Tyson fought a version of Holyfield that was nearly killed twice by Bowe and was dead man walking. Foreman would have clubbed Tyson out, and I think Riddick Bowe at his best would have murdered Tyson, especially on the inside. Bowe was one of the most underrated inside fighters for a big man. He was brilliant on the inside. The fight that Holyfield beat Bowe was when Evander boxed for the most part. Bowe fvcked up shorter guys on the inside. The problem with Bowe was that while he took huge punches well, it caused damage to his brain far out of proportion to what one would think. In other words, he got punch drunk quicker than any world class fighter I can remember that didn't take beatings. Today he sounds awful, like Meldrick Taylor, but Taylor took beatings to get to where his is cognitively. Bowe didn't. Everyone is different I suppose.

Esquire wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:Mind you Foreman came back in 1987 and by the time Tyson-Douglas was around, Team Tyson was set to do a three fight deal in which it would have been: Holyfield, Foreman, and (believe it or not) Francesco Damiani. I can't remember the particular order, but that's generally what was going to happen had he of beaten Douglas in Tokyo. Tyson didn't fear the Italian or Holyfield, because nobody thought Holyfield had the stuff to make heavyweight champ, but he was leary of Foreman. The old lessons that D'Amato taught him stuck with him in his mind, one being to 'Never underestimate a man who had once known greatness, for on any given night he can regain that greatness'. Foreman was essentially Tyson himself, but was now older, wiser, etc. Of them all, Foreman quite possibly could have given Tyson the hardest time of them all.

Tyson always was fearful of Evander in the sense that he had no confidence he could beat him. He knew Holyfield had no fear of him and he knew Evander was the better fighter.

Tyson didn't have the confidence to fight someone he knew was unafraid of him. That would be a prime Holyfield, the combacking Foreman and in my opinion Riddick Bowe.

Tyson fought a version of Holyfield that was nearly killed twice by Bowe and was dead man walking. Foreman would have clubbed Tyson out, and I think Riddick Bowe at his best would have murdered Tyson, especially on the inside. Bowe was one of the most underrated inside fighters for a big man. He was brilliant on the inside. The fight that Holyfield beat Bowe was when Evander boxed for the most part. Bowe fvcked up shorter guys on the inside. The problem with Bowe was that while he took huge punches well, it caused damage to his brain far out of proportion to what one would think. In other words, he got punch drunk quicker than any world class fighter I can remember that didn't take beatings. Today he sounds awful, like Meldrick Taylor, but Taylor took beatings to get to where his is cognitively. Bowe didn't. Everyone is different I suppose.

Agreed that Bowe would wreck Mike. He took a ton of punishment from Holyfield & Golota.

Tyson didn't have the confidence to fight someone he knew was unafraid of him. That would be a prime Holyfield, the combacking Foreman and in my opinion Riddick Bowe.

Tyson fought a version of Holyfield that was nearly killed twice by Bowe and was dead man walking. Foreman would have clubbed Tyson out, and I think Riddick Bowe at his best would have murdered Tyson, especially on the inside. Bowe was one of the most underrated inside fighters for a big man. He was brilliant on the inside. The fight that Holyfield beat Bowe was when Evander boxed for the most part. Bowe fvcked up shorter guys on the inside. The problem with Bowe was that while he took huge punches well, it caused damage to his brain far out of proportion to what one would think. In other words, he got punch drunk quicker than any world class fighter I can remember that didn't take beatings. Today he sounds awful, like Meldrick Taylor, but Taylor took beatings to get to where his is cognitively. Bowe didn't. Everyone is different I suppose.[/quote]

Agreed that Bowe would wreck Mike. He took a ton of punishment from Holyfield & Golota.[/quote]

Yes, Bowe did take punishment. But when I say "beatings" I mean one-sided beatdowns and knockouts whereby the crowd is just praying that the fighter just gets off the ground eventually to live, if not fight, another day. Bowe's taking of punishment usually came in give and take exchanges. His taking of punishment was "subtle" but cleary damaging. The Bowe that fought Golota was already shot. The world just didn't know it yet. Bowe fell of a cliff in that regard.

Bowe won't make the Hall of Fame but he should based upon his epic trilogy with Holyfield alone. Winning two out of three with both wins being clear cut no brainers does it for me. When Bowe attacked Jorge Gonzalez at the press conference and blasted him out like he was a girl showed me that Bowe had real balls and was unafraid of anyone. Gonzalez was considered a crazy man and a giant at the time. Bowe nearly killed him.

Now here's where every Brit, Canadian and Jamaican forum member will chime in and state he ducked Lennox Lewis. At their best I thought Bowe was better. His best didn't last all that long however.

Esquire wrote:Tyson didn't have the confidence to fight someone he knew was unafraid of him. That would be a prime Holyfield, the combacking Foreman and in my opinion Riddick Bowe.

Tyson fought a version of Holyfield that was nearly killed twice by Bowe and was dead man walking. Foreman would have clubbed Tyson out, and I think Riddick Bowe at his best would have murdered Tyson, especially on the inside. Bowe was one of the most underrated inside fighters for a big man. He was brilliant on the inside. The fight that Holyfield beat Bowe was when Evander boxed for the most part. Bowe fvcked up shorter guys on the inside. The problem with Bowe was that while he took huge punches well, it caused damage to his brain far out of proportion to what one would think. In other words, he got punch drunk quicker than any world class fighter I can remember that didn't take beatings. Today he sounds awful, like Meldrick Taylor, but Taylor took beatings to get to where his is cognitively. Bowe didn't. Everyone is different I suppose.

Agreed that Bowe would wreck Mike. He took a ton of punishment from Holyfield & Golota.[/quote]

Yes, Bowe did take punishment. But when I say "beatings" I mean one-sided beatdowns and knockouts whereby the crowd is just praying that the fighter just gets off the ground eventually to live, if not fight, another day. Bowe's taking of punishment usually came in give and take exchanges. His taking of punishment was "subtle" but cleary damaging. The Bowe that fought Golota was already shot. The world just didn't know it yet. Bowe fell of a cliff in that regard.

Bowe won't make the Hall of Fame but he should based upon his epic trilogy with Holyfield alone. Winning two out of three with both wins being clear cut no brainers does it for me. When Bowe attacked Jorge Gonzalez at the press conference and blasted him out like he was a girl showed me that Bowe had real balls and was unafraid of anyone. Gonzalez was considered a crazy man and a giant at the time. Bowe nearly killed him.

Now here's where every Brit, Canadian and Jamaican forum member will chime in and state he ducked Lennox Lewis. At their best I thought Bowe was better. His best didn't last all that long however.[/quote]
Yes, Bowe ducked Lewis. He was already past his best by the time of the Gonzales fight, and Gonzales turned out to be a rather pedestrian pro.

Dart340 wrote:When Foreman promised Don King he was going to drop Adilson Rodriguez right in front of him at ringside the night of the Tillman-Tyson fight and then splattered him right where he said he would, that essentially ended any chance King was letting Foreman in the ring with his emotionally fragile meal ticket.

And Tyson was fighting on the card so got to see that also.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:Mind you Foreman came back in 1987 and by the time Tyson-Douglas was around, Team Tyson was set to do a three fight deal in which it would have been: Holyfield, Foreman, and (believe it or not) Francesco Damiani. I can't remember the particular order, but that's generally what was going to happen had he of beaten Douglas in Tokyo. Tyson didn't fear the Italian or Holyfield, because nobody thought Holyfield had the stuff to make heavyweight champ, but he was leary of Foreman. The old lessons that D'Amato taught him stuck with him in his mind, one being to 'Never underestimate a man who had once known greatness, for on any given night he can regain that greatness'. Foreman was essentially Tyson himself, but was now older, wiser, etc. Of them all, Foreman quite possibly could have given Tyson the hardest time of them all.

Tyson always was fearful of Evander in the sense that he had no confidence he could beat him. He knew Holyfield had no fear of him and he knew Evander was the better fighter.

All I know is at the time Holyfield was still an enigma to the rest of the boxing world, prior to Douglas. Sure he had the 'heavyweight fight of the 80s' with Dynamite Dokes, but outside of that everyone thought he was simply too small. This fear or lack of confidence you speak of, stems from the amateurs; even then I don't believe it to of been genuine fear or lack of confidence, for Evander was a light heavyweight at the time and Tyson was a full blown heavyweight. The only animosity there was that Tyson failed to get into the Olympics, while Holyfield did.

The answer is NO.

HomicideHenry wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:Mind you Foreman came back in 1987 and by the time Tyson-Douglas was around, Team Tyson was set to do a three fight deal in which it would have been: Holyfield, Foreman, and (believe it or not) Francesco Damiani. I can't remember the particular order, but that's generally what was going to happen had he of beaten Douglas in Tokyo. Tyson didn't fear the Italian or Holyfield, because nobody thought Holyfield had the stuff to make heavyweight champ, but he was leary of Foreman. The old lessons that D'Amato taught him stuck with him in his mind, one being to 'Never underestimate a man who had once known greatness, for on any given night he can regain that greatness'. Foreman was essentially Tyson himself, but was now older, wiser, etc. Of them all, Foreman quite possibly could have given Tyson the hardest time of them all.

Tyson always was fearful of Evander in the sense that he had no confidence he could beat him. He knew Holyfield had no fear of him and he knew Evander was the better fighter.

All I know is at the time Holyfield was still an enigma to the rest of the boxing world, prior to Douglas. Sure he had the 'heavyweight fight of the 80s' with Dynamite Dokes, but outside of that everyone thought he was simply too small. This fear or lack of confidence you speak of, stems from the amateurs; even then I don't believe it to of been genuine fear or lack of confidence, for Evander was a light heavyweight at the time and Tyson was a full blown heavyweight. The only animosity there was that Tyson failed to get into the Olympics, while Holyfield did.

Mike never thought he was as good as Holyfield, he was right. Everyone didn't think he was too small, I knew he would kick Mike's ass.

I think Tyson would have landed a lot on Foreman. Think Tyson would have taken it. Though with George there is always the chance he could lay anyone out anytime

I think Tyson would've outworked Foreman with combinations and had him busted up and swollen pretty badly. For the most part 90's George couldn't put punches in combination much and it's not likely he takes out Mike with one punch, though I could see him shaking up Mike towards the very end of the bout. I think Mike would hang tough and stay upright to take a lopsided decision over Big George.

I posted this before:

http://coxscorner.tripod.com/foreman_tyson_fl.html

I will leave it to others to embrace or reject the author's account.

I think Foreman wins but except for the money which is important there is no upside for Tyson. If he wins he beat up an old man. If he loses he got beat up by an old man.

keithmoonhangover wrote:The answer is NO.

Until the hangover dissipates, vision clarifies and the facts of the matter begin to dawn upon anyone willing to open mindedly take a good look at both the documented history, and the facts as they played out in real time.

BoxBuzz wrote:

keithmoonhangover wrote:The answer is NO.

Until the hangover dissipates, vision clarifies and the facts of the matter begin to dawn upon anyone willing to open mindedly take a good look at both the documented history, and the facts as they played out in real time.

BoxBuzz wrote:

keithmoonhangover wrote:The answer is NO.

Until the hangover dissipates, vision clarifies and the facts of the matter begin to dawn upon anyone willing to open mindedly take a good look at both the documented history, and the facts as they played out in real time.

I have clarity on the whole issue thank you very much. If your opinion differs, then so be it. The 'fact' is that Tyson would have become a laughing stock if he'd fought Foreman before prison.

gilgamesh wrote:I think Tyson would've outworked Foreman with combinations and had him busted up and swollen pretty badly. For the most part 90's George couldn't put punches in combination much and it's not likely he takes out Mike with one punch, though I could see him shaking up Mike towards the very end of the bout. I think Mike would hang tough and stay upright to take a lopsided decision over Big George.