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Re: Rodrigo Valdes vs. Bennie Briscoe 'III'

Posted: 26 Apr 2013, 07:43
by Rover
Il Duce wrote:November 1977 (Middleweight Rankings)

#1.. Rodrigo Valdes
#2.. Bennie Briscoe
#3.. Ronnie Harris
#4.. Mike Colbert
#5.. Gratien Tonna
#6.. Vito Antuofermo
#7.. Hugo Corro
#8.. Alan Minter
#9.. Shako Mamba
#10. Marvin Hagler

#11. David Love
#12. Edgar Wallace
#13. Ray Seales
#14. Marcello Quinnones
#15. Richard 'Scorpion' Ofosu
#16. George Cooper
#17. Doug Demmings
#18. Willie Monroe
#19. Tony Chiaverini
#20. Kevin Finnegan
Mamba over Hagler...
:lol:

Re: Rodrigo Valdes vs. Bennie Briscoe 'III'

Posted: 26 Apr 2013, 22:27
by Rover
Il Duce wrote:Mr. Rover,,,,

Don't besmerch Shako Mamba.....'The Black Mamba Snake'...was a pretty good boxer.

Carlos Monzon signed to fight him in May 1976, and for 'Mucho Dinero',,,,,,,,,,then pulled out.... :??
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On 'Bad' Bennie Briscoe.

The #2 Middleweight, with a record of 58-14-5 {48 KO's}.

The nearly 35 year-old (34 year, 9 month) 5' 8" Philadelphia Middleweight, always a fan favorite.

But, since losing back-to-back fights (L KO 7 to Rodrigo Valdez on May 25, 1974) and
(L Dec 10 to Emile Griffith on October 9, 1974) 'Bad Bennie' had only won '9' of his '13-Bouts',
by going 9-0-4 {6 KO's} over the past 3-years.

The nearly 35 year-old, was always considered a 'small' Middleweight, and several 'flat' performances
made him a 'questionable' Top-Rated Middleweight.

Campaigning for 15 years (since September 1962) had taken it's toll on Bennie, and despite reports of a
fading Rodrigo Valdez, Bennie was still a decided underdog entering in his '3rd' attempt at a World Middleweight
Championship.
Mamba was no Hagler, and Monzon fought Valdez that June.

Re: Rodrigo Valdes vs. Bennie Briscoe 'III'

Posted: 26 Apr 2013, 23:14
by Rover
Il Duce wrote:"RODRIGO VALDES TAKES MIDDLEWEIGHT TITLE"

Fighting in front of a small crowd of 700, at the Campione' d'Italia, a small casino in Northern Italy
along the Italy and Switzerland border, Colombian - Rodrigo Valdes captured the World (WBA/WBC)
Middleweight Championship by winning a Unanimous 15-Round Decision over American - Bennie Briscoe.

Most regarded the performance of both Rodrigo Valdes and Bennie Briscoe as 'lousy', as there was a
lack of good clean punching, as well as many lapses of dull pauses throughout the middle rounds.

After a dull and non-action in Rounds 1 and 2, Rodrigo Valdes utilized his better boxing slills and technique
to take control in Round 3.

Though Bennie Briscoe moved forward, he was clearly out-boxed by the Colombian, who used his superior reach
and counter-punching skills to build up a solid points lead after 8-Rounds. Though the American moved forward,
he failed to land any effective punches on the Valdes during the early and middle Rounds.

Rounds 9, 10 and 11 were dull, as the action slowed to minor counter-punching, and lapses of non-action.

Bennie Briscoe came to life in Round 12, when he landed a tremendous right hand to Valdes mouth, which
sent the mouthpiece flying as well as drawing blood from the Colombian's mouth.

But whatever Bennie dished out in Round 12, he was less effective after that, as Valdes picked up his pace
in Round 13, and scored with crisp punches to thwart off Briscoe's attack.

The Colombian kept up the pace in Rounds 14 and 15, as Briscoe trudged forward looking for the 'one-punch'
which never came.

* Scorecards
* Referee - Wally Thon........146-144 {6-4-5 in Rounds}
* Judge - Paul Tailayrach.....148-143 {7-2-6 in Rounds}
* Judge - Aime Leschot........149-142 {8-1-6 in Rounds}

Rodrigo Valdes, 'I knew I wasn't going to knock out Bennie because he's as hard as a rock. It took me '2-Rounds' to
warm up, but then I went to work by using my left jab and counter-punching. After the 8th-Round, my corner told me to
pace myself for a few Rounds because I had a big points lead. I took it easy for a few Rounds to rest. But, he did hit
me good in the 12th Round, and I was hurt for a moment, but my head cleared and boxed out of danger.'

Carlos Monzon, 'After the Bell ending the fight, I went right over to Rodrigo's corner to congratulate him. He boxed
boxed well and fought a smart fight. I knew he won.'

Bennie Briscoe, 'I don't know what the Judges were looking at. They were lousy. I pressed the action for the whole
fight, and I landed the best punch in the fight (Right-hand in the 12th Round). He won the last 3-Rounds, but that's
about all I would give to him.'

George Benton (Bennie Briscoe's - Trainer), 'It was a close fight, but I'm not sure what the Judges were looking at.
I can't believe that Judge (Aime Leschot) only gave Bennie 'one-round' (12th Round). We'll ask for a rematch of course.'

Arnold Weiss (Bennie Briscoe's - Manager), 'If it wasn't for Bennie making the fight, there would be none. The only
thing Rodrigo Valdes did was jab and move backwards. He was not the aggressor in this fight. I'm not sure if Rodrigo
will give Bennie a rematch, not after the tough time Bennie just gave him.'





http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q= ... IuVZ12r67g
It says quite a bit about Valdez that he was the only man ever to have stopped Briscoe.

Re: Rodrigo Valdes vs. Bennie Briscoe 'III'

Posted: 27 Apr 2013, 12:23
by Rover
Il Duce wrote:Rodrigo Valdez first entered the Top 10 ratings back in March 1967.

Following a {W Dec 10} over Eugenio Espinoza on March 5, 1967.

20 year, 2 month old - Colombian - Rodrigo Valdez improved to 15-1-1 {8 KO's} and
entered at the #8 Light Welterweight World Rating position, when he defeated the
#7 Light Welterweight veteran 28 year-old Ecuadorian - Eugenio Espinoza {51-6-4}

Rodrigo 'Rocky' Valdes - 5' 9 1/2"

Description from Colombian Sports Report -

20 year-old Rodrigo Valdes is a smart counter-puncher, who is built for the Light Welterweight
Divsion with his tall and solidly built body. A smooth boxer in the Ring, Rodrigo has a long reach
and utilizes that to out-box his opponents with a stiff jab, and right-hand counter-punches.

What Rodrigo lacks in hand-speed, he makes up with his superior reach and smart counter-punching
skills. A good puncher, who delivers hard punches when his opponent is in trouble. A very tactical
boxer, who likes to work at a steady-rate.

Rodrigo Valdez 'Rating Position'

1967 ....... #4 Light Welterweight
1968 ....... #5 Light Welterweight
1969 ....... #6 Welterweight
1970 ....... #8 Light-Middleweight
1971 ....... #5 Middleweight
1972 ....... #4 Middleweight
1973 ....... #2 Middleweight
1974 ....... #1 Middleweight
1975 ....... #1 Middleweight
1976 ....... #2 Middleweight
1977 ....... ** Middleweight Champion
1978 ....... #7 Middleweight
----------------------------------------------------------------
Bouts that were supposed to take place'

* August 1968 ....... Paul 'Takeshi' Fuji' .... {WBA Light Welterweight Championship}
* August 1970 ....... Jose Napoles ........... {For the World Welterweight Championship}
* July 1971 ........... Carmelo Bossi .......... {World Light-Middleweight Championship}
* October 1971 ...... Jose Napoles ........... {10-Round 'Non-title' bout at Light-Middleweight}
* August 1972 ....... Koichi Wajima .......... {WBC/WBA Light-Middleweight Championship}
* March 1975 ......... Ray Seales ............. {WBC Middleweight Championship Title Defense}
* November 1975 ... Carlos Monzon ......... {For the Middleweight WBC/WBA Unification Bout}
* March 1976 ......... Mike Rossman .......... {WBC Middleweight Championship Title Defense}
* February 1978 ..... Marvin Hagler .......... {WBC/WBA Middleweight Championship Title Defense}
* February 1979 ..... Alan Minter...............{10-Round Middleweight bout}
What happened that caused the postponement of the Monzon fight and the nonoccurrence of the Hagler one?

Re: Rodrigo Valdes vs. Bennie Briscoe 'III'

Posted: 27 Apr 2013, 14:56
by Rover
Il Duce wrote:Carlos Monzon had signed a 'contract' in May 1975 - to face Rodrigo Valdes in October 1975.

The contract stipulated that both fighters (WBA Champion - Carlos Monzon) and (WBC Champion - Rodrigo Valdes)
could each participate in 'one' Title Defense each, before the October 1975 'Unification Bout'.

The bout was set to take place in Paris (October 1975), right after Carlos Monzon's {18-Month Suspension} was
lifted by the European Boxing Commission.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In the meantime,

Carlos Monzon fought #1 WBA-arnked - Tony Licata on June 30, 1975.

Rodrigo Valdes fought #10 WBC-ranked - Rudy Robles on August 16, 1975.

Several days later, Rodrigo Valdes was involved in an automobile accident, and severly injured his right hand,
which immediately put the bout with Carlos Monzon on 'delay'.
Why was Monzon suspended?

Re: Rodrigo Valdes vs. Bennie Briscoe 'III'

Posted: 27 Apr 2013, 16:00
by Rover
Il Duce wrote:In February 1974,

Carlos Mozon was 'fined and suspended' by the European Boxing Commission for failure to take
a 'Post Fight Urine Test' after his bout with Welterweight Champion - Jose Napoles.

Carlos Monzon was then suspensed for participating in a European Bout for 18-Months, until October 1975.

And Rodrigo Valdez would not fight Carlos Monzon in Argentina in 1974 or 1975, only at a 'Neutral Site'.
Thanks for that info.

Re: Rodrigo Valdes vs. Bennie Briscoe 'III'

Posted: 28 Apr 2013, 11:20
by scartissue
Il Duce wrote:Mr. Rover,,,,

Don't besmerch Shako Mamba.....'The Black Mamba Snake'...was a pretty good boxer.

Carlos Monzon signed to fight him in May 1976, and for 'Mucho Dinero',,,,,,,,,,then pulled out.... :??
Il Duce, were these WBA ratings? I have to agree with Rover's amusement on Shako Mamba's rating. Looking at his record, he didn't beat anyone to deserve a #9 rating, whereas,Marvin Hagler at #10 had, within the past year, stopped Cyclone hart and Willie Monroe (twice). Moreover, the ratings were made to look like the joke they were within a couple of months when Hagler stopped Mike Colbert and Mamba lost to British club-fighter Jan Magdiarz. Perhaps his lofty rating can best be determined when seeing that his rating coincided with a move to Europe at that time. Some powerful Euro promoter no doubt 'acquired' a rating for him.

Re: Rodrigo Valdes vs. Bennie Briscoe 'III'

Posted: 28 Apr 2013, 13:05
by scartissue
Il Duce wrote:Mr. Scartissue,

These were the WBC Ratings, which went all the way up to #40.

The African Boxing Union had some corrurpt Army Colonel as the President of their Organization, and
he had cash.....

Shako 'The Black Mamba Snake' Mamba could fight, but he was 'not' better than Marvin Hagler in 1977.

He was supposed to fight Carlos Monzon in May 1976, as the Monzon vs. Valdes bout was slow
in getting put together.
By the middle of '76 there was not one world-ranked win on Mamba's resume. A non-title fight I could see, but anyone who would put together a Monzon-Mamba fight in June of '76 with monzon's prestigious title on the line, should hang their head in shame. Not that the WBC shouldn't have before or since.

Re: Rodrigo Valdes vs. Bennie Briscoe 'III'

Posted: 28 Apr 2013, 14:15
by Rover
scartissue wrote:
Il Duce wrote:Mr. Scartissue,

These were the WBC Ratings, which went all the way up to #40.

The African Boxing Union had some corrurpt Army Colonel as the President of their Organization, and
he had cash.....

Shako 'The Black Mamba Snake' Mamba could fight, but he was 'not' better than Marvin Hagler in 1977.

He was supposed to fight Carlos Monzon in May 1976, as the Monzon vs. Valdes bout was slow
in getting put together.
By the middle of '76 there was not one world-ranked win on Mamba's resume. A non-title fight I could see, but anyone who would put together a Monzon-Mamba fight in June of '76 with monzon's prestigious title on the line, should hang their head in shame. Not that the WBC shouldn't have before or since.
:TU:
Mamba would've added nothing to Monzon's legacy.

Re: Rodrigo Valdes vs. Bennie Briscoe 'III'

Posted: 28 Apr 2013, 15:27
by Rover
Il Duce wrote:Seems that the Argentinian's knew more about Shako Mamba than the American Boxing Pundits.

Several articles about him in El Grafico, Shako Mamba labeled as a 'Dangerous African', with
numerous impressive wins.

http://search.yahoo.com/r/_ylt=A0oG7jv. ... oxpele-_JM
Sounds like puffing up an opponent, as I see nothing impressive in his record.

Re: Rodrigo Valdes vs. Bennie Briscoe 'III'

Posted: 28 Apr 2013, 15:42
by scartissue
Rover wrote:
Il Duce wrote:Seems that the Argentinian's knew more about Shako Mamba than the American Boxing Pundits.

Several articles about him in El Grafico, Shako Mamba labeled as a 'Dangerous African', with
numerous impressive wins.

http://search.yahoo.com/r/_ylt=A0oG7jv. ... oxpele-_JM
Sounds like puffing up an opponent, as I see nothing impressive in his record.
I think that's what it was. If someone was sniffing around about making a fight like that the press will come out in droves with pieces on a prospective opponent. In reality, someone would have been hung and drawn for that kind of match, whereas you can get away with it today. Mamba hadn't even challenged for the Commonwealth title, which is the natural rung on the ladder for someone holding an African title. The champ at the time was Monty Betham and he was no great shakes, just a brawler. Mamba would have had a good chance of taking his title and would have done himself a world of good in the ratings. I was knee-deep in this sport by '72 and believe me, Shako Mamba was on no ones radar. i don't doubt Il Duce, because his research is always good, but it does show how easily a rating or cash flow can manipulate things.

Re: Rodrigo Valdes vs. Bennie Briscoe 'III'

Posted: 28 Apr 2013, 19:19
by Rover
Il Duce wrote:In 1974, they were trying to get Shako Mamba some name recognition,

They were trying to put together bouts between Shako Mamba and the British Light Middleweight Champion - Larry Paul,
and former Light Middleweight Title Challenger, Trinidadian - Matt Donovan.

I'd put Shako Mamba on an 'even basis' with Sugar Ray Seales.
Those may have been decent light middles but not middles.