BoxRec

Right you are allegedly, you have just seen one of your big name draws Nathan Cleverly lost his O and his World title to the big hitting Sergei Kovalev, the big question you have is, how do you rebuild Nathan Cleverly?

IRLangmaid25 wrote:Right you are allegedly, you have just seen one of your big name draws Nathan Cleverly lost his O and his World title to the big hitting Sergei Kovalev, the big question you have is, how do you rebuild Nathan Cleverly?

Get a fight in then bring Shumenov over next year.

Mr Warren does have a good record of rebuilding fighters after bad losses. Mitchell (despite not winning) got another World title shot. Chisora got a shot off the back of 2 losses (albeit one of them a robbery.) James DeGale got a European shot off the back of a British title defeat.

It usually means travelling and fighting on another promoters show but hey, if it does the trick and he wins then hey ho.

IRLangmaid25 wrote:Right you are allegedly, you have just seen one of your big name draws Nathan Cleverly lost his O and his World title to the big hitting Sergei Kovalev, the big question you have is, how do you rebuild Nathan Cleverly?

Wisely, using experience and with the guile crafted through over 30 years in the game

palooka wrote:

IRLangmaid25 wrote:Right you are allegedly, you have just seen one of your big name draws Nathan Cleverly lost his O and his World title to the big hitting Sergei Kovalev, the big question you have is, how do you rebuild Nathan Cleverly?

Wisely, using experience and with the guile crafted through over 30 years in the game

And not being afraid of fighting fire with powr having broke the money of Jarvis Astaire and them lot as well and fighting off Barry Hearn and Matchroom Sports before Handsome Eddie came back onto the seen and brought us PrizeFighter.

I might be missing the point from someone who knows all about the boxing industry but warren will be able to get Nathan back in there; if that's what he wants to do.

palooka wrote:I might be missing the point from someone who knows all about the boxing industry but warren will be able to get Nathan back in there; if that's what he wants to do.

I think it would be good for Nathan Cleverly to go out on the road on a few shows regardless if it is on a Warren Bill or not get some competitive 8/10 rounders in to get his confidence back up and also send him off to get some good topline sparring if he can as well, but Cleverly is only 26 years old so he is young enough to come around again for a World title shot in 18 months/ two years time.

IRLangmaid25 wrote:

palooka wrote:I might be missing the point from someone who knows all about the boxing industry but warren will be able to get Nathan back in there; if that's what he wants to do.

I think it would be good for Nathan Cleverly to go out on the road on a few shows regardless if it is on a Warren Bill or not get some competitive 8/10 rounders in to get his confidence back up and also send him off to get some good topline sparring if he can as well, but Cleverly is only 26 years old so he is young enough to come around again for a World title shot in 18 months/ two years time.

You've a point and the man has a Degree in Mathematics, he could get a very good income and nice job regardless of all the hassle of training and boxing. I do get the point you're making though

palooka wrote:

IRLangmaid25 wrote:

palooka wrote:I might be missing the point from someone who knows all about the boxing industry but warren will be able to get Nathan back in there; if that's what he wants to do.

I think it would be good for Nathan Cleverly to go out on the road on a few shows regardless if it is on a Warren Bill or not get some competitive 8/10 rounders in to get his confidence back up and also send him off to get some good topline sparring if he can as well, but Cleverly is only 26 years old so he is young enough to come around again for a World title shot in 18 months/ two years time.

You've a point and the man has a Degree in Mathematics, he could get a very good income and nice job regardless of all the hassle of training and boxing. I do get the point you're making though

Or perhaps he might go back into full time education and get a Masters and teach etc. He is not shy of options if he does go sod it and walk away. But I think he will just go for a couple of weeks just sit it out mull over a few things cand then go from there.

Being on sports as job means that in competition you lose from time to time; it's not the end of the world; just to obsessives on the internet. I'd watch Nathan again and especially v Enzo and I hope they get really good money for it and then Nathan can be a rocket scientist or whatever and Enzo can do whatever e wants to do.

palooka wrote:

IRLangmaid25 wrote:

palooka wrote:I might be missing the point from someone who knows all about the boxing industry but warren will be able to get Nathan back in there; if that's what he wants to do.

I think it would be good for Nathan Cleverly to go out on the road on a few shows regardless if it is on a Warren Bill or not get some competitive 8/10 rounders in to get his confidence back up and also send him off to get some good topline sparring if he can as well, but Cleverly is only 26 years old so he is young enough to come around again for a World title shot in 18 months/ two years time.

You've a point and the man has a Degree in Mathematics, he could get a very good income and nice job regardless of all the hassle of training and boxing. I do get the point you're making though

Or perhaps he might go back into full time education and get a Masters and teach etc. He is not shy of options if he does go sod it and walk away. But I think he will just go for a couple of weeks just sit it out mull over a few things cand then go from there.[/quote]


I get the feeling he 'does' boxing because he enjoys it. He can do the other stuff at any time.

Get Nathan to drop his Dad as his trainer before any further steps are planned.

Fight enzo mc there's no love lost between the pair financially makes sense, clev ent a massive puncher so won't overly hurt him business wise makes sense to me.

Cleverly looked so weak. I think Warren is losing his touch somewhat. What was the point of this fight?

Many, many fighters have lost in devastating fashion and rebounded to have excellent careers. I don't think he has a glass jaw, as he took some tough shots and it wasn't anywhere close to a 1-punch knockout. Cleverly was scared and had the wrong game plan, frankly. I don't know the entirety of his skill set, okay. But I DO KNOW he faced a confident Russian assassin/bomber who's on a HELL of a ROLL. Bad match-up for a up-and-coming LHW.

I would move him to the US, where most (but not ALL) of the most coveted trainers reside. Or, he could demand that Enzo Calz make him into a future Hall of Famer. Either way, his confidence is probably just a TAD LOW right now. haha.

It was clear who was the boxer and who was the stronger of the two. Too bad Emmanuel is no longer living (RIP E.S.) because he could be of GREAT HELP. I would NOT suggest Virgil Hunter, as his stable is way too full. Nor would I suggest Golovkin's trainer (Sanchez?) or Freddie Roach. Maybe B-Hop's trainer Eddie Mustaf(?), but again I don't know his line-up.

A few quick suggestions: Learn more head movement, learn evasive tactics after being cornered on the ropes, learn how to mentally recover after a knockdown, more cardio and weight lifting, and more confidence in his abilities. He looked like an amateur.

Definitely needs to drop pops and start work on developing a defence. He's clearly in shape but looks skinny at the weight, which given recent performance, means he won't be bombing people out.

Rebuilding? They need to aim lower, forget these fake titles and fooling the public that this guy is world class. He isn't, never has been and never will be, but there's no shame in that. Not everyone can be a superstar. Just pitch him at Euro level or something and see if he can deal with that. Welsh people seem to like him so hopefully for him he'll still be able to draw fans.

He should 100% go back with Enzo Calzaghe that's exactly what he needs. His Chin is fine he was walking through Bellews punches and he's a big hitter.. Kovalov is just a beast of a puncher no one would withstand those.. He is fast and has a high output and is very tall for the weight.. If he can learn to hit and not be hit Iand stop war'ing all the time he will come back stronger.. I think the Enzo Mac fight is a ideal next fight big money and he wins very easily. Then he needs to look at a couple of fringe World Level fighters then maybe Hopkins or shumenev!! Maybe Froch will want to fight him now still a huge fight..

daviddee wrote:He should 100% go back with Enzo Calzaghe that's exactly what he needs. His Chin is fine he was walking through Bellews punches and he's a big hitter.. Kovalov is just a beast of a puncher no one would withstand those.. He is fast and has a high output and is very tall for the weight.. If he can learn to hit and not be hit Iand stop war'ing all the time he will come back stronger.. I think the Enzo Mac fight is a ideal next fight big money and he wins very easily. Then he needs to look at a couple of fringe World Level fighters then maybe Hopkins or shumenev!! Maybe Froch will want to fight him now still a huge fight..

God know, he needs to stay away from him. Enzo had a purple patch due to getting good matchmaking off the money Joe's shows were bringing in. He needs a tactician not someone who will scream at him to do better without any advice.

It was man against boy in there. He was never in the fight.

freddydoesdallas wrote:

daviddee wrote:He should 100% go back with Enzo Calzaghe that's exactly what he needs. His Chin is fine he was walking through Bellews punches and he's a big hitter.. Kovalov is just a beast of a puncher no one would withstand those.. He is fast and has a high output and is very tall for the weight.. If he can learn to hit and not be hit Iand stop war'ing all the time he will come back stronger.. I think the Enzo Mac fight is a ideal next fight big money and he wins very easily. Then he needs to look at a couple of fringe World Level fighters then maybe Hopkins or shumenev!! Maybe Froch will want to fight him now still a huge fight..

God know, he needs to stay away from him. Enzo had a purple patch due to getting good matchmaking off the money Joe's shows were bringing in. He needs a tactician not someone who will scream at him to do better without any advice.

So you're saying that: 1) Joe C. was not a wonderful, talented fighter? or 2) His dad had NOTHING to do with that?

I just know Wales is not full of boxing trainers and the Calzaghe gym is low-key, and not a Hollywood meet-and-greet.

Preface: I KNOW YOU DID NOT MAKE THIS COMMENT, okay? But I will address it below.

BTW, Lennox was in the "Euro League" at one time, as was Winky Wright, Sergio Martinez, the Klit Brothers, and many other legendary fighters. Is that an insult on the competition or something? How about the "Cuban Circuit", or the "Argentina Boxing League"? You get my point...right? Every country/area/continent has bums and also wonderful fighters. you see world-class fighters from almost the entire continent, so think before you speak my friend.

Cleverly fought a better man at a better point in his career. His time may come....or it may not. It depends on his determination.

Rebuild him? To what? Why waste your time and money?

Fundamentally the man cannot fight. He can potshot low level boxers on shows that make little money, but as far as him ever being among world class? It's ridiculous. I think Nathan himself has learned that after last night's brutal wakeup call.

For all that dancing around, that stalking the ring prefight with the smug, knowing smirk on his face as if this was going to be some Archie Moore-style display of boxing genius, he looked no better than some of the clueless journeyman Kovalev routinely bashes out. He's simply never going to have the chin or acumen to win at world level, or be a genuine world champion.

The whole episode is another embarrassment for the awful WBO title.

Sometimes we have to be honest and realistic. Cleverley is a really good light heavy but Kovalev is just better. Man U beat Swansea because they are simply a better team, there's no shame , nothing to be unduly concerned about ,and there shouldn't be any recriminations.
Cleverley has to decide if he wants to continue in the knowledge that he isn't the best in the world, and never will be unless Kovalev retires .There's still plenty of money to be made if he needs it.
There was absolutely nothing ANY trainer or ANY tactics could have made which would have made any difference, when you're fighting a man with concrete slabs for hands. did anybody check there weren't any horse shoes lying about afterwards??

I agree with Macho. I doubt FW is heartbroken about all this. I don't see where he was generating any cash. He might have done last night, with HBO's involvement, but then he had to fight a live one. It was a sink or swim fight, he sunk. I think FW will be concentrating on Bjs, Gavin, Frampton in Belfast and possibly going back to the Echo in Liverpool if he has all three Smith brothers holding British titles simultaneously. Swifty looked brilliant last night. Finally like the fighter all the Scousers said he was. Needs to get cracking with Bradley Saunders as well, easily his best prospect. In short, life goes on!

Another thing was his behaviour in getting hurt and beckoning Kov in, the disbelief when getting knocked down and the look of total shock when going down repeatedly and losing. He looked as if he thought this couldn't possibly happen to a fighter like him, as if his victories over Shawn Hawk and Tony Bellew meant he was some elite level fighter and things like this don't happen to him.

It was an insane level of denial he was in, reminiscent of Khan running out to try bang out Prescott, sheer insanity. I think Tyson Fury is headed for the exact same baffling (to him) world crashing down scenario.

We in the UK have to concentrate on developing fighters the right way, rather than protecting them and building up these degrading paper champions.