BoxRec

sorry to bother ppl with another thread about this.
but i believe peter fury is right, and haye will face vitali in the summer, after vitali fights stiverne.

this shoulder problem wasnt a new injury , it was an ongoing thing that david decided to have surgery on now than later. as a result he can get out of fury fight and hang around for vitali.

His shoulder would have been no better or worse than what it was on 28th september!!!

what i will point out is that david haye said he didnt want to pull out of wlad fight with his toe, cos people had booked tickets flights hotels etc!!!!!

Isn't vitali going for president in the 2015 election? Not sure 3months out to fight Haye is in vitalis plans.

I don't understand about these conspiracy theories about Haye not wanting to fight Fury etc.

Haye has had ONE fight in almost 18 months & is semi-retired, so why would be go through the trouble of signing to fight someone & then ducking out?

He could have just stayed 'retired', had the surgery (if this is true) & stepped back in in 2014 to fight Vitali because it's not as if there's anything else going on at the top of the HW tree.

Anyone who thinks David Haye had surgery to avoid fighting Tyson Fury needs to be sectioned.

It's one of those things and Peter Fury at least saw it coming after the cut eye postponement - he said that Haye wouldn't go through with the bout and didn't want to fight Fury. Time will tell, if Haye returns and boxes Vitali then it'll look suss.

Groove Armada wrote:

palooka wrote: Time will tell, if Haye returns and boxes Vitali then it'll look suss.

And anyone (Keithmoon) who disagrees with that needs their head testing.

Haye must have been injured all along.

lol:

Yeah, because Fury is so hard to hit and has such an amazing chin, that Haye thought, "I know, I'll have potentially career ending surgery, just to avoid fighting Tyson Fury.

That would have been an easy £5,000,000 for Haye.

Groove Armada wrote:You do not know what goes through Hayes head. It isn't career threatening,this is David Haye we are talking about....pure salesman.

Salesmen want commission, correct?

£5,000,000 for a fight against a guy that most boxing experts think he would win easily. Or shoulder surgery and £0. Hmmmm.

They may have spoken to camp Vitali and got the tip that he was to box twice more; if he boxed Fury less than 100% and won but looked poor then a fight v Vitali would be off, if he lost v Fury the bout would be off, it may be that the shoulder would be a factor in a February bout but OK by August. If another shot a the world title is what he desire the most then it'd be worth dropping the Fury bout and getting sorted; he'd make the same dough v Klitsko and if he won a heap more after.

But I just don't know; it's a puzzle. I'll call in and speak to Tysons father in law tomorrow and see what he thinks.

palooka wrote:They may have spoken to camp Vitali and got the tip that he was to box twice more; if he boxed Fury less than 100% and won but looked poor then a fight v Vitali would be off, if he lost v Fury the bout would be off, it may be that the shoulder would be a factor in a February bout but OK by August. If another shot a the world title is what he desire the most then it'd be worth dropping the Fury bout and getting sorted; he'd make the same dough v Klitsko and if he won a heap more after.

But I just don't know; it's a puzzle. I'll call in and speak to Tysons father in law tomorrow and see what he thinks.

Palooka, I respect your opinion on here mate, but do you really think Haye has somehow ducked Fury?

The conspiracy theories seem far fetched to me. I don't think Haye would make as much money from fighting Vitali without a belt and to me Fury would have been an easy nights work.

SteveDow wrote:The conspiracy theories seem far fetched to me. I don't think Haye would make as much money from fighting Vitali without a belt and to me Fury would have been an easy nights work.

Even if he was mandatory for Vitali, he wouldn't get £5,000,000 IMO

keithmoonhangover wrote:

palooka wrote:They may have spoken to camp Vitali and got the tip that he was to box twice more; if he boxed Fury less than 100% and won but looked poor then a fight v Vitali would be off, if he lost v Fury the bout would be off, it may be that the shoulder would be a factor in a February bout but OK by August. If another shot a the world title is what he desire the most then it'd be worth dropping the Fury bout and getting sorted; he'd make the same dough v Klitsko and if he won a heap more after.

But I just don't know; it's a puzzle. I'll call in and speak to Tysons father in law tomorrow and see what he thinks.

Palooka, I respect your opinion on here mate, but do you really think Haye has somehow ducked Fury?

Thanks Keith, I just don't know, it's just I remember Peter Fury was very sure after the September cut that the bout would not go ahead, he said he wanted Haye to guarantee the training expenses as he felt Haye would pull out. I don't think Haye is afraid of Fury but he may have been an unknown variable in a calculation that Haye was making - his stated aim was to face Vitali - I don't imagine that has changed; with the wear and tear and after sparring the young pups he may have felt he had one big push left and he'd rather give it a go for the championship than risk looking bad or losing v Fury.

Again though, I just do not know.

palooka wrote:[Thanks Keith, I just don't know, it's just I remember Peter Fury was very sure after the September cut that the bout would not go ahead, he said he wanted Haye to guarantee the training expenses as he felt Haye would pull out. I don't think Haye is afraid of Fury but he may have been an unknown variable in a calculation that Haye was making - his stated aim was to face Vitali - I don't imagine that has changed; with the wear and tear and after sparring the young pups he may have felt he had one big push left and he'd rather give it a go for the championship than risk looking bad or losing v Fury.

Again though, I just do not know.

I know mate, but 5 hours of surgery to avoid a seemingly easy fight, just does not stack up.

keithmoonhangover wrote:

palooka wrote:[Thanks Keith, I just don't know, it's just I remember Peter Fury was very sure after the September cut that the bout would not go ahead, he said he wanted Haye to guarantee the training expenses as he felt Haye would pull out. I don't think Haye is afraid of Fury but he may have been an unknown variable in a calculation that Haye was making - his stated aim was to face Vitali - I don't imagine that has changed; with the wear and tear and after sparring the young pups he may have felt he had one big push left and he'd rather give it a go for the championship than risk looking bad or losing v Fury.

Again though, I just do not know.

I know mate, but 5 hours of surgery to avoid a seemingly easy fight, just does not stack up.

It may not be to avoid an easy fight but to get it sorted to a different timetable and for a different bout.

If he'd have not got it sorted now maybe the shoulder would have been further hurt with the training and the bout v Fury - as it is if a bout v Vitali does come off (Vitali final bout before a big political career) then Haye's last bout (before injuries etc) will have been the Chisora knockout - if he'd have looked shite v Fury then the big bout would be harder to sell/

Groove Armada wrote:

keithmoonhangover wrote:

palooka wrote:[Thanks Keith, I just don't know, it's just I remember Peter Fury was very sure after the September cut that the bout would not go ahead, he said he wanted Haye to guarantee the training expenses as he felt Haye would pull out. I don't think Haye is afraid of Fury but he may have been an unknown variable in a calculation that Haye was making - his stated aim was to face Vitali - I don't imagine that has changed; with the wear and tear and after sparring the young pups he may have felt he had one big push left and he'd rather give it a go for the championship than risk looking bad or losing v Fury.

Again though, I just do not know.

I know mate, but 5 hours of surgery to avoid a seemingly easy fight, just does not stack up.

It does stack up if HAYE had a niggling injury and saw a window to get it fixed and out the fight to be 100% for Vitali.

Cheers - you put across what I tried to say

Groove Armada wrote:It does stack up if HAYE had a niggling injury and saw a window to get it fixed and out the fight to be 100% for Vitali.

David Haye has just had major reconstructive surgery on his shoulder, which took five hours. I've been talking to my best mate tonight, who is a consultant surgeon and trust me, that was not a niggling injury.

Jeff "left hook" Lacy completely lost his left hook after his shoulder operation.

A big operation on the shoulder that feeds his killer right hand ? you can't tell me that's a positive thing for Haye at his age now.

Groove Armada wrote:

keithmoonhangover wrote:

palooka wrote:[Thanks Keith, I just don't know, it's just I remember Peter Fury was very sure after the September cut that the bout would not go ahead, he said he wanted Haye to guarantee the training expenses as he felt Haye would pull out. I don't think Haye is afraid of Fury but he may have been an unknown variable in a calculation that Haye was making - his stated aim was to face Vitali - I don't imagine that has changed; with the wear and tear and after sparring the young pups he may have felt he had one big push left and he'd rather give it a go for the championship than risk looking bad or losing v Fury.

Again though, I just do not know.

I know mate, but 5 hours of surgery to avoid a seemingly easy fight, just does not stack up.

It does stack up if HAYE had a niggling injury and saw a window to get it fixed and out the fight to be 100% for Vitali.

Question is AND what if that is the reason? I'd rather see him fight Vitali than Fury, Vitali v Haye is a mega fight, Haye v Fury was an entertaining mismatched domestic novelty fight which was being used to try and catapult haye into a fight with one of the klitschkos. If he's been offered the vitali fight he would be a bit daft not to get his shoulder fixed and take that opportunity rather than follow through with fighting Fury for a chance to get the opportunity he already had.

Im not saying pulling out of agreed fights is right in anyway but the klitschkos have done it, many fighters have done it, its how the business works. At the fans expense more often than not.

Was Tyson Fury and his team crying for Charr when he knew Haye pulled out with an "injury" in order to get the fight on with Fury instead.

i dont think haye is scared of fury.
my heart wanted fury to deck haye but my head knows haye is too good.

haye thought why risk an injury vs fury (or even a defeat) and have a gauranteeed title fight in summer

remember, haye avoided charr for bigger fish, now same with tyson.

i think the surgery is obviously real, but wasnt has to have it now situation. but the timing suited haye well

I'm pretty sure he'd not have risked losing £5m on a speculative chance that he'll fight Vitali next year. He'd have been better off fighting Fury for the £5m and then fighting Vitali, surely? I mean if it's such a forgone convulsion he was going to paste Fury. Would've been decent warm up for Vitali too fighting a giant.

youngrell wrote:I'm pretty sure he'd not have risked losing £5m on a speculative chance that he'll fight Vitali next year. He'd have been better off fighting Fury for the £5m and then fighting Vitali, surely? I mean if it's such a forgone convulsion he was going to paste Fury. Would've been decent warm up for Vitali too fighting a giant.

unless the vitali fight has been actually offered i fully believe haye is genuinely injured.

Groove Armada wrote:Wards surgery was 1 1/2 hour. Who did HAYES? Stevie Wonder?

5 hours in HAYE speak= 1 hour.

This is like talking to an 11 year old. I'm just gonna let you crack on with your crazy theory.

keithmoonhangover wrote:

Groove Armada wrote:You do not know what goes through Hayes head. It isn't career threatening,this is David Haye we are talking about....pure salesman.

Salesmen want commission, correct?

£5,000,000 for a fight against a guy that most boxing experts think he would win easily. Or shoulder surgery and £0. Hmmmm.

That's the thing which doesn't make sense. Why would he blow out a huge payday like that, he's not going to get paid so much more against Vitali. Especially now, he's kind of ruined his rep if that was a ruse to get out of the fight.

He's going to look pretty daft if he sudden;y comes out of retirement after his 'career ending injury' to fight Vitali. Nobody will buy the fight.

Groove Armada wrote:Haye surely was NOT in sparring. He just wanted a way out. Lo this facebook page with him in hospital smiling like a toss pot. Disgraceful, imo.

Some brummie taxi driver told me it was a insurance job by haye and booth.......lol lmao I just made that up.but u see my point about online conspiracy theories

keithmoonhangover wrote:Anyone who thinks David Haye had surgery to avoid fighting Tyson Fury needs to be sectioned.

x2 because there was no way a fit Haye would lose to a fit Fury and the bank balance after the fight win lose or draw would be super yummie