BoxRec

We lost Rubin....

RIP....I have nothing nice to say about the man I will leave it at RIP.

I read a biography of Carter and he was no saint though to spend that long in prison for something you've not done is beyond imagining ; the US was (is) a bad bad place for black men without money, education or good connections. RIP Hurricane.

palooka wrote:I read a biography of Carter and he was no saint though to spend that long in prison for something you've not done is beyond imagining ; the US was (is) a bad bad place for black men without money, education or good connections. RIP Hurricane.

It was never proven he did not do the crime.It was proven he was not given a fair trial.
Huge freaking difference.

OJ Simpson took notes, because he essentially followed the same legal "reasoning" to get off on his crime, that team Carter used.

Never forget, after being 'freed' Carter ran off to Canada and never came back. Never forget, that the police and feds never looked into anyone else doing the crime.

Why? Because, the evidence was so overwhelming that Carter did it. He got off because of "racism" and "bias". Not because of concrete evidence.

He was a good fighter, yes, but the man himself was rotten to the core.

Il Duce wrote:

palooka wrote:I read a biography of Carter and he was no saint though to spend that long in prison for something you've not done is beyond imagining ; the US was (is) a bad bad place for black men without money, education or good connections. RIP Hurricane.

Mr Palooka,

Just what 'location' is good for........ Black Men without > money, education or good connections.

Mr. Palooka must be of the "Blame America First" persuasion.

yancey - you must be the sort to imagine all sorts about a person from one post.

Il Duce wrote:

palooka wrote:I read a biography of Carter and he was no saint though to spend that long in prison for something you've not done is beyond imagining ; the US was (is) a bad bad place for black men without money, education or good connections. RIP Hurricane.

Mr Palooka,

Just what 'location' is good for........ Black Men without > money, education or good connections.

That's a fair comment and I concede; would you answer me, which location is good for a white man without money, education or good connections now? And the US in the 1960's was a particularly bad place to be a man like Carter.

Thanks for the honest answer Il Duce

I was reading a Charlie Burley biography today and a fighter mentioned, he killed a man in a fight and shot at someone else out of the ring.

Would you consider a thread on him?

Jack Chase is the boxer.

yancey wrote:

Il Duce wrote:

palooka wrote:I read a biography of Carter and he was no saint though to spend that long in prison for something you've not done is beyond imagining ; the US was (is) a bad bad place for black men without money, education or good connections. RIP Hurricane.

Mr Palooka,

Just what 'location' is good for........ Black Men without > money, education or good connections.

Mr. Palooka must be of the "Blame America First" persuasion.

Who exactly should be blamed for Carter's, as well as generation after generation of Black people's struggles with American slavery/segregation and criminalization of existence?

Nepal? Kazakhstan, maybe? Perhaps Finland?

The U.S. has an absolutely atrocious history as a settler colony and many people actually feel sorry for themselves that people "blame" them for it, well boo hoo.

It's not hard to know what European discourse would sound like had the Germans won WWII, we have a perfect example, just significantly more violent and lengthy.

HomicideHenry wrote:OJ Simpson took notes, because he essentially followed the same legal "reasoning" to get off on his crime, that team Carter used.

Never forget, after being 'freed' Carter ran off to Canada and never came back. Never forget, that the police and feds never looked into anyone else doing the crime.

Why? Because, the evidence was so overwhelming that Carter did it. He got off because of "racism" and "bias". Not because of concrete evidence.

He was a good fighter, yes, but the man himself was rotten to the core.

Agreed.

Answer to question #1
No place is good for any White Man without money, education or connections.

The early-mid 1960's wasn't particularly fun for anybody.[/quote]

My parents enjoyed the 1960's very much....they were immigrants from Cyprus to the united kingdom and worked extremely hard and made a success out of themselves ....they had no money at first...they itergrated into society, made friends, had 4 children....had such fun times with their family....50 years later their legacy is with us....hard working, honest and no excuses...happy family..maybe we were lucky??

I lived only a few blocks away from the bar that this happened. I also knew both John Artis and Rubin Carter a little.

Artis ran the hurdles for Central High School a few years before and I ran distance races for Passaic County Tech, both schools were located in Paterson at the time.

I met Carter several years before at the Riverside Oval in Paterson and he even pitched some softball (http://www.BS.com/forums/showt ... p?t=137142#). One time he and several of his friends went across the street of the ball field and went bowling. I followed him and he asked me to keep score, which I did. Also, when he pitched he used to let me sit with his team, he called me kid.

When I was in high school they let me go to the court house several times to do a report on the case. It was some long days, but I reported back what I saw and heard. They had several family (http://www.BS.com/forums/showt ... p?t=137142#) members of the people that were killed on the stand. It was pretty sad and some of the items they showed were still full of blood.

I also knew Lt. Vince DeSimone some, and several of my friends knew him very well and they all said he was a honest cop and would never have done what the picture stated he did. Just read the site that Cal Deal has and you can make your own judgement.

Carter was on his way down as a boxer when this happened, just look at his record.

Cal Deal did a GREAT JOB in getting the material together and I read his site many times over the years.

http://www.graphicwitness.com/carter/index.html

I read just about everything about this case and I believe that both John Artis and Rubin Carter were and still are Guilty, But now the Only Judge that counts in the end has Judged him!

I don't know if he did it or not, probably he did, maybe he didn't, who knows?

But I'll tell you this there are hundreds of black men on death row, and thousands who have been sentenced to death, lynched, etc for nothing at all.
The exoneration project, using DNA, has exonerated mostly black men. In Dallas County, Texas alone the number is ridiculous. And you know what in many of these cases, the person who did have the matching DNA was white and was the prime witness against the accused. So basically in Texas white folks would kill who they wanted and then point to the nearest black guy and say guess what the (insert racist expletive) did it, and next thing you know the fella was on death row.

In the United States we have more people in prison than China, India and Russia combined. We have "privatized" our prisons so now we have people with a financial interest in prisons lobbying elected officials for stiffer sentences. Our prisons are disproportionately black and blacks receive longer sentences for the same crime as whites.

Racism in the United States is a very real thing and so maybe Carter "got away with it", none of us will ever really know, but what we do know is thousands of white men have "got away with it" and they did so by pointing the finger at some poor black guy. So that's justice in America, little unfair to bitch about Carter getting off when so many have died needlessly.

DaveyMac wrote:I don't know if he did it or not, probably he did, maybe he didn't, who knows?

But I'll tell you this there are hundreds of black men on death row, and thousands who have been sentenced to death, lynched, etc for nothing at all.
The exoneration project, using DNA, has exonerated mostly black men. In Dallas County, Texas alone the number is ridiculous. And you know what in many of these cases, the person who did have the matching DNA was white and was the prime witness against the accused. So basically in Texas white folks would kill who they wanted and then point to the nearest black guy and say guess what the (insert racist expletive) did it, and next thing you know the fella was on death row.

In the United States we have more people in prison than China, India and Russia combined. We have "privatized" our prisons so now we have people with a financial interest in prisons lobbying elected officials for stiffer sentences. Our prisons are disproportionately black and blacks receive longer sentences for the same crime as whites.

Racism in the United States is a very real thing and so maybe Carter "got away with it", none of us will ever really know, but what we do know is thousands of white men have "got away with it" and they did so by pointing the finger at some poor black guy. So that's justice in America, little unfair to bitch about Carter getting off when so many have died needlessly.

I agree with most of what your saying. There will always be some White people that hate Blacks But there also some Black people that hate Whites. I do most of the ring announcing in the state of New Jersey and every time I go into the ring I see some blood on the canvas. I can't tell if it's from a White person or a Black person or any other color person. I just wish people were color blind when it comes to this.

^

Do you do just Boxing or MMA as well?

If just Boxing - are you the dreads dude?

hhascup wrote:But now the Only Judge that counts in the end has Judged him!

The internet?

I do mostly boxing But I have done MMA as well.

GOD will be his Final Judge!

You're in a lot of hot water fella

No Tomorrow wrote:^

Do you do just Boxing or MMA as well?

If just Boxing - are you the dreads dude?

No the dreads dude is also a friend of mine who also is the PA announcer for the Brooklyn Nets.

You can google my name "Henry Hascup" to find several bio's on myself.

Il Duce wrote:H Has Cup,

Any information on this..... Rubin Carter vs. Ernie Burford bout.

Saturday ~ June 23, 1962 {Madison Square Garden}

ABC-TV Fight with Don Dunphy

The Fight Poster stated that it was 10-Rounder, but Box/Rec has it as an 8-Rounder.

This bout was the main undercard for Joey Archer - Jose Gonzalez

The Memphis Light-Middleweight shocked everyone, when he 'upset' the Hurricane by a Unanimous Decision.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q= ... FxIQgUa1HQ

On page 57 of September 1962 Ring Magazine it states the following:

The latest knockout "sensation," Rubin Cater, 160½, Paterson, N.J., didn't have much luck with his punch against the ringwise Ernie Burford, 153½, Memphis, Tenn., in the semi-final eight. Burford was too shifty and experienced.

Il Duce wrote:Mr. H Has Cup,

Excellent.........

I see that Ernie Burford was being billed as;

Beating > Henry Hank {November 25, 1958} and Charley Joseph {July 27, 1959}
Drawing > Gene Armstrong {September 21, 1960}

Nice 'promoting' by Matchmaker ~ Teddy Brenner for a June 23, 1962 bout, seeing that Ernie was TKO'd in his previous 2-Bouts
in 1961.

Well he did But I know what your talking about! They only put in what they want too to make the fight seem better then it actually is.

Il Duce wrote:Thanks Mr. 'H'

I found some information on Ernie Burford,

Who said his 'upset' victory over Rubin Carter on June 23, 1962 at Madison Square Garden salvaged his career.

Ernie said that Rubin could punch holes in Plaster Walls, but he went 'Out-of-Steam' after the 2nd-Round in their
1st Bout.

After Ernie 'upset' Rubin, he was invited back to the Garden and was supposed to fight "The Fighting Leatherneck"
Tommy Schaefer 17-2-1 {8 KO's} in August 1962.

Sounds Good!