BoxRec

Seems like every other week we are forced to watch some highly rated English/Irish/Welsh middleweight or Light Heavyweight get destroyed. Really tired of it. All of these names are the same to me and they all don't add up to a pile of shizter. Andy Lee, Makin, and every other bum that that has been destroyed by GGG, Chavez Jr. or Sergio Martinez. With the exception of Froch, all these bums need to accept that they are basically circuit level fighters that need to retire and are just taking up valuable tv time.

Luckybattles wrote:Seems like every other week we are forced to watch some highly rated English/Irish/Welsh middleweight or Light Heavyweight get destroyed. Really tired of it. All of these names are the same to me and they all don't add up to a pile of shizter. Andy Lee, Makin, and every other bum that that has been destroyed by GGG, Chavez Jr. or Sergio Martinez. With the exception of Froch, all these bums need to accept that they are basically circuit level fighters that need to retire and are just taking up valuable tv time.

It doesn't seem like that at all.

not as bad as american heavy weights

How many countries have a stronger group of boxers than the UK (since you didn't just mention English boxers)?

Not many.

That you don't know the difference between the English, Irish and Welsh about sums up the level of intelligence it took to post a thread like this. I am however wondering how the Scottish got off so lightly...

I give this a 2 on a scale of 1-10 in trolling. Work on your game son.

Do all trolls on Boxrec suck?

crusader wrote:How many countries have a stronger group of boxers than the UK (since you didn't just mention English boxers)?

Not many.

Germany does.

PsychoGamer wrote:

crusader wrote:How many countrlies have a stronger group of boxers than the UK (since you didn't just mention English boxers)?

Not many.

Germany does.

How many of them are actually German? And not eastern europeans who happen to be based in Germany?

PsychoGamer wrote:

crusader wrote:How many countries have a stronger group of boxers than the UK (since you didn't just mention English boxers)?

Not many.

Germany does.

That's very debatable and Germany is among the strongest anyway. I think the German talent drops more after the first few boxers, with the talent from the UK being clearly superior overall. I'm also addressing only male boxers as the OP limits his discussion to them.

BoxRec's P4P top 25

Marco Huck 556 37(26)-2(1)-1
Juergen Braehmer 457 44(32)-2-0
Felix Sturm 451 39(18)-4(1)-2
Arthur Abraham 441 40(28)-4(1)-0
Robert Stieglitz 420 47(27)-4(2)-0
Christian Hammer 334 16(10)-3(2)-0
Erkan Teper 304 13(9)-0-0
Francesco Pianeta 287 30(17)-1(1)-1
Jack Culcay 226 17(10)-1-0
Manuel Charr 205 26(15)-2(2)-0
Firat Arslan 177 34(21)-7(3)-2
Robin Krasniqi 170 42(16)-3-0
Edmund Gerber 140 24(15)-2(1)-0
Karo Murat 136 25(15)-2(1)-1
Juergen Doberstein 110 16(4)-1-1
Dimitri Sartison 108 31(19)-2(2)-0
Robert Woge 91 12(10)-1-0
Vincent Feigenbutz 88 14(13)-1(1)-0
Enrico Koelling 88 14(4)-0-0
Eduard Gutknecht 87 25(9)-3(1)-1
Nick Klappert 81 19(13)-1-0
Dominic Boesel 71 16(5)-0-0
Bernard Donfack 70 20(11)-11(1)-3
Besar Nimaniy 69 17(14)-0-0
Konstantin Airich 67 21(17)-9(4)-2

vs

Carl Froch 1016 33(24)-2-0
Kell Brook 637 32(22)-0-0
Tyson Fury 561 22(16)-0-0
Amir Khan 443 29(19)-3(2)-0
Dereck Chisora 431 20(13)-4(1)-0
Martin Murray 427 28(12)-1-1
Carl Frampton 390 18(13)-0-0
James DeGale 390 19(13)-1-0
Frankie Gavin 344 19(12)-1-0
Ovill McKenzie 338 23(12)-12(3)-0
Ola Afolabi 324 21(10)-3-4
Billy Joe Saunders 320 20(11)-0-0
Matthew Macklin 311 30(20)-5(3)-0
Kevin Mitchell 302 38(28)-2(2)-0
George Groves 293 19(15)-2(2)-0
Tony Bellew 292 22(14)-2(1)-1
Scott Quigg 282 28(21)-0-2
Ricky Burns 275 36(11)-4-1
Lee Selby 271 19(7)-1-0
Nathan Cleverly 264 28(14)-1(1)-0
Anthony Crolla 246 28(11)-4(1)-1
David Price 241 18(15)-2(2)-0
Brian Rose 222 25(7)-2(2)-1
Terry Flanagan 215 25(9)-0-0
Stephen Smith 207 20 (12)-1-0

No they don't suck.

BUT ... they almost all seem to have an irrational arrogance and their fans tend to highly overrate their abilities. So instead of simply being very good fighters, all of their losses and shortcomings get magnified. Then their discouraged fans and the fans who thought they were overrated shit on them mercilessly. It's really a fun process to watch happen over and over and over and over again.

However, most fighters who make it out of the UK are good, except for guys like Fury. I wish they would fight more in the U.S., but they seem to be making good money and drawing good crowds at home.

PsychoGamer wrote:

crusader wrote:How many countries have a stronger group of boxers than the UK (since you didn't just mention English boxers)?

Not many.

Germany does.

No they don't!

Is the UK the third biggest boxing nation in the world in terms of top fighters produced? Maybe, maybe not, but it's probably close.

We have about a fifth of the population of the US and probably produce about a fifth as many top fighters as them, so we're doing OK I imagine.

I'd say that currently only Mexico and the U.S. clearly have better pro talent. Very much a case for the UK being next.

crusader wrote:

PsychoGamer wrote:

crusader wrote:How many countries have a stronger group of boxers than the UK (since you didn't just mention English boxers)?

Not many.

Germany does.

That's very debatable and Germany is among the strongest anyway. I think the German talent drops more after the first few boxers, with the talent from the UK being clearly superior overall. I'm also addressing only male boxers as the OP limits his discussion to them.

BoxRec's P4P top 25

Marco Huck 556 37(26)-2(1)-1
Juergen Braehmer 457 44(32)-2-0
Felix Sturm 451 39(18)-4(1)-2
Arthur Abraham 441 40(28)-4(1)-0
Robert Stieglitz 420 47(27)-4(2)-0
Christian Hammer 334 16(10)-3(2)-0
Erkan Teper 304 13(9)-0-0
Francesco Pianeta 287 30(17)-1(1)-1
Jack Culcay 226 17(10)-1-0
Manuel Charr 205 26(15)-2(2)-0
Firat Arslan 177 34(21)-7(3)-2
Robin Krasniqi 170 42(16)-3-0
Edmund Gerber 140 24(15)-2(1)-0
Karo Murat 136 25(15)-2(1)-1
Juergen Doberstein 110 16(4)-1-1
Dimitri Sartison 108 31(19)-2(2)-0
Robert Woge 91 12(10)-1-0
Vincent Feigenbutz 88 14(13)-1(1)-0
Enrico Koelling 88 14(4)-0-0
Eduard Gutknecht 87 25(9)-3(1)-1
Nick Klappert 81 19(13)-1-0
Dominic Boesel 71 16(5)-0-0
Bernard Donfack 70 20(11)-11(1)-3
Besar Nimaniy 69 17(14)-0-0
Konstantin Airich 67 21(17)-9(4)-2

vs

Carl Froch 1016 33(24)-2-0
Kell Brook 637 32(22)-0-0
Tyson Fury 561 22(16)-0-0
Amir Khan 443 29(19)-3(2)-0
Dereck Chisora 431 20(13)-4(1)-0
Martin Murray 427 28(12)-1-1
Carl Frampton 390 18(13)-0-0
James DeGale 390 19(13)-1-0
Frankie Gavin 344 19(12)-1-0
Ovill McKenzie 338 23(12)-12(3)-0
Ola Afolabi 324 21(10)-3-4
Billy Joe Saunders 320 20(11)-0-0
Matthew Macklin 311 30(20)-5(3)-0
Kevin Mitchell 302 38(28)-2(2)-0
George Groves 293 19(15)-2(2)-0
Tony Bellew 292 22(14)-2(1)-1
Scott Quigg 282 28(21)-0-2
Ricky Burns 275 36(11)-4-1
Lee Selby 271 19(7)-1-0
Nathan Cleverly 264 28(14)-1(1)-0
Anthony Crolla 246 28(11)-4(1)-1
David Price 241 18(15)-2(2)-0
Brian Rose 222 25(7)-2(2)-1
Terry Flanagan 215 25(9)-0-0
Stephen Smith 207 20 (12)-1-0

Champions = fat

Titles aren't any more impressive than what it took to win them, and the quality of German boxers drops off more significantly than the quality of UK boxers does.

There are also boxers from the UK that recently won world titles but didn't make the top 25, such as Stuart Hall, Paul Butler, and Jamie McDonnell, and in terms of current world champions it's even, with McDonnell, Froch, and Quigg if his title counts vs Abraham, Huck, and Braehmer if his title counts.

You forgot to bold Clev by the way.

crusader wrote:Titles aren't any more impressive than what it took to win them, and the quality of German boxers drops off more significantly than the quality of UK boxers does.

Let's look at the Top-10 of each:

GERMANY:

Christian Hammer - Heavyweight
Erkan Teper - Heavyweight
Francesco Pianeta - Heavyweight
Marco Huck - Cruiserweight
Jürgen Brähmer - Lightheavyweight
Arthur Abraham - Supermiddleweight
Robert Stieglitz - Supermiddleweight
Felix Sturm - Middleweight
Jack Culcay - Lightmiddleweight

ENGLAND

Tyson Fury - Heavyweight
Dereck Chisora - Heavyweight
Ovill McKenzie - Cruiserweight
Carl Froch - Supermiddleweight
James DeGale - Supermiddleweight
Martin Murray - Middleweight
Kell Brook - Welterweight
Amir Khan - Welterweight
Frankie Gavin - Welterweight
Carl Frampton - Superbantamweight

...

We don't have any boxers below Lightmiddleweight, so lets cut that.

We have:

Hammer, Teper, Pianeta, Huck, Brähmer, Abraham, Stieglitz, Sturm.

You have:

Fury, Chisora, McKenzie, Froch, DeGale, Murray.

...

1. Fury - he has no chin! Huck would be his worst nightmare, but also Teper, Hammer & Pianeta could beat him. 1-0
2. Chisora - would lose against Huck. 2-0
3. McKenzie - would lose against Huck. 3-0
4. Froch - would lose against Brähmer. 4-0
5. DeGale - would lose against Abraham or Stieglitz. 5-0
6. Murray - had a draw with Sturm, would lose against Abraham or Stieglitz. 6-0

crusader wrote:You forgot to bold Clev by the way.

You forgot he got knocked the f*** out against Kovalev?

I think your predictions are very debatable (e.g. Froch losing to Braehmer) and the fighters chosen account for only a small portion of each country's fighters. You also conveniently dismiss good fighters from the UK like Khan and Frampton even though boxers from all divisions should be considered in an assessment of how strong a country is, put Murray against supermiddleweights, and somewhat humorously use Huck in three of your predictions.

I could also say:

Sturm: would lose to Froch
Stieglitz: would lose to Froch
Abraham: would lose to Froch
Braehmer: would lose to Froch
Pianeta: would lose to Fury and Chisora
Teper: would lose to Fury and Chisora
Hammer: would lose to Fury and Chisora
Huck: would lose to Fury and Chisora

You forgot he got knocked the f*** out against Kovalev?

He was a world champion though. If you're counting only current champions why bold Sturm and Stieglitz? Did you forget that Sturm got outclassed by 40 year old Sam Soliman and Stieglitz lost to Abraham?

crusader wrote:I think your predictions are very debatable (e.g. Froch losing to Braehmer) and the fighters chosen account for only a small portion of each country's fighters. You also conveniently dismiss good fighters from the UK like Khan and Frampton even though boxers from all divisions should be considered in an assessment of how strong a country is, put Murray against supermiddleweights, and somewhat humorously use Huck in three of your predictions.

I could also say:

Sturm: would lose to Froch
Stieglitz: would lose to Froch
Abraham: would lose to Froch
Braehmer: would lose to Froch
Pianeta: would lose to Fury and Chisora
Teper: would lose to Fury and Chisora
Hammer: would lose to Fury and Chisora
Huck: would lose to Fury and Chisora

You forgot he got knocked the f*** out against Kovalev?

He was a world champion though. If you're counting only current champions why bold Sturm and Stieglitz? Did you forget that Sturm got outclassed by 40 year old Sam Soliman and Stieglitz lost to Abraham?

Do you know the US vs UK thread in Boxing Asylum? Lets start one here, Germany vs England. First fight will be Abraham vs Smith, lets see who wins!

Last HW encounters should be:

Chisora vs Gerber
Hammer vs Williams
Teper vs Rogan
Teper vs Sprott

Germany wins 3-1!

UK has one of the healtiest boxing scene on earth, nothing sucks about it

not sure how they suck, theres very few elite level boxers in the world. even a glass jawed buffoon like Khan is still one of the worlds best

PsychoGamer wrote:

crusader wrote:I think your predictions are very debatable (e.g. Froch losing to Braehmer) and the fighters chosen account for only a small portion of each country's fighters. You also conveniently dismiss good fighters from the UK like Khan and Frampton even though boxers from all divisions should be considered in an assessment of how strong a country is, put Murray against supermiddleweights, and somewhat humorously use Huck in three of your predictions.

I could also say:

Sturm: would lose to Froch
Stieglitz: would lose to Froch
Abraham: would lose to Froch
Braehmer: would lose to Froch
Pianeta: would lose to Fury and Chisora
Teper: would lose to Fury and Chisora
Hammer: would lose to Fury and Chisora
Huck: would lose to Fury and Chisora

You forgot he got knocked the f*** out against Kovalev?

He was a world champion though. If you're counting only current champions why bold Sturm and Stieglitz? Did you forget that Sturm got outclassed by 40 year old Sam Soliman and Stieglitz lost to Abraham?

Do you know the US vs UK thread in Boxing Asylum? Lets start one here, Germany vs England. First fight will be Abraham vs Smith, lets see who wins!

Last HW encounters should be:

Chisora vs Gerber
Hammer vs Williams
Teper vs Rogan
Teper vs Sprott

Germany wins 3-1!

Abraham vs Smith?
Germany's number one supermiddle vs the UKs 4th or 5th?
Not to mention the three shot heavyweights who have travelled to Germany to loose.

No question about it but it seems like they are content with mediocrity.

Luckybattles wrote:No question about it but it seems like they are content with mediocrity.

Try harder.

UK fighters have basically become a feeder system of bums for guys like Sergio Martinez, GGG, Chavez Jr., Kovalev, Canelo, and any other "so called" star that can attract a dollar or two. I would like to go over the laundry list of bums but there are to mention. Bad Intentions said it best. They are not bad fighters per say. They just get a lot of publicity and fight on stages far beyond their actual ability and worth.

Nothing against the English people in general. I believe them to be some of the finest classiest people on earth.

Weird style of trolling bro.