BoxRec

Are there any current judges, officials or people in the know who can offer some practical advice on how to become a judge either amateur or pro? What are the requirements? General information really...

Cheers!

P.S After Smith/Abraham I understand if this thread gets a bucket load of abuse. Shocking scores!

Easiest job in the world

187 wrote:Easiest job in the world

Aye, find the brown envelope down the back of the radiator, score it for the home fighter, easy money.

expe wrote:

187 wrote:Easiest job in the world

Aye, find the brown envelope down the back of the radiator, score it for the home fighter, easy money.

Generally speaking there are some professions where you get on, career-wise, if you implicitly know what to do and who's back to cover when its crunch time.

What that (Spanish ?) judge did last night, in addition to giving it to Arthur by ten rounds, is send out a signal loud and clear that he knows what to do, that he can be trusted to do the right thing. I'm not talking about scoring a fight on merit, I'm talking about maintaining the home advantage tradition in boxing. He will go far.

JimJim2009 wrote:

expe wrote:

187 wrote:Easiest job in the world

Aye, find the brown envelope down the back of the radiator, score it for the home fighter, easy money.

Generally speaking there are some professions where you get on, career-wise, if you implicitly know what to do and who's back to cover when its crunch time.

What that (Spanish ?) judge did last night, in addition to giving it to Arthur by ten rounds, is send out a signal loud and clear that he knows what to do, that he can be trusted to do the right thing. I'm not talking about scoring a fight on merit, I'm talking about maintaining the home advantage tradition in boxing. He will go far.

Hearn can't really complain about the Spanish judge last night, I never heard complaining when he scored Rose-Maciel 117-111 for Rose.

What that (Spanish ?) judge did last night, in addition to giving it to Arthur by ten rounds, is send out a signal loud and clear that he knows what to do, that he can be trusted to do the right thing. I'm not talking about scoring a fight on merit, I'm talking about maintaining the home advantage tradition in boxing. He will go far.[/quote]
Hearn can't really complain about the Spanish judge last night, I never heard complaining when he scored Rose-Maciel 117-111 for Rose.[/quote]

If that's the same judge its a good example of serving your master. Both score cards heavily in favour of the home fighter, not reflecting how close the fight was. He will have a good career.

JimJim2009 wrote:

expe wrote:

187 wrote:Easiest job in the world

Aye, find the brown envelope down the back of the radiator, score it for the home fighter, easy money.

Generally speaking there are some professions where you get on, career-wise, if you implicitly know what to do and who's back to cover when its crunch time.

What that (Spanish ?) judge did last night, in addition to giving it to Arthur by ten rounds, is send out a signal loud and clear that he knows what to do, that he can be trusted to do the right thing. I'm not talking about scoring a fight on merit, I'm talking about maintaining the home advantage tradition in boxing. He will go far.

I can't be that hard - you get paid for going, probably treated like a VIP and get the best ringside seat

and you can get it completely wrong and still be invited to the next party

The more you get wrong the more famous you get

A simple rule needs brought into boxing, promotors are allowed zero contact with judges, financial, verbal, physical, sexual you name it, there should be restraining orders going both ways to keep them as far apart as possible.

Picture how football would look if the home team was responsible for appointing the ref, paying his wage, covering his expenses etc

Again, any practical advice on how to become a judge? All the gags are real rib tickling zingers but I'm asking sincerely.

seanilius wrote:Again, any practical advice on how to become a judge? All the gags are real rib tickling zingers but I'm asking sincerely.

In Britain to be a pro judge you have to be a referee. Only the star refs get to judge the big fights

ALI wrote:A simple rule needs brought into boxing, promotors are allowed zero contact with judges, financial, verbal, physical, sexual you name it, there should be restraining orders going both ways to keep them as far apart as possible.

Picture how football would look if the home team was responsible for appointing the ref, paying his wage, covering his expenses etc

And also a rule about officials cozying up to promoters sharing text messages and God knows what, and that is in the UK.

expe wrote:

187 wrote:Easiest job in the world

Aye, find the brown envelope down the back of the radiator, score it for the home fighter, easy money.

What if it's one of those old radiators things get stuck behind?

The whole card in Germany threw up some concerning judging.
Of the 4 fights that went the distance, only one reached an unanimous verdict and even then you had a 3 round difference between 2 judges in a 6 round fight.
Whilst I didnt see the Luke Watkins fight one judge had it a 4 rd shut out whilst another had it a draw.

The Paul Smith scoring was bizarre. I thought Sky failed in at least not getting the WBO Supervisor to comment.

The IBF insist on judges completing a short written assessment of each round on their scorecards, unlike any other sanctioning body, at least then they can refer to "your" interpretation of any given round.

There is so much wrong in our sport regarding this subject but due to the fragmentation of titles, governing bodies etc it will never get fully resolved.

seanilius wrote:Are there any current judges, officials or people in the know who can offer some practical advice on how to become a judge either amateur or pro? What are the requirements? General information really...

Cheers!

P.S After Smith/Abraham I understand if this thread gets a bucket load of abuse. Shocking scores!

to become an Amateur judge, you have to appply to the ABAE , you do a judge/timekeepers course, once passed, you do 2 seasons as a Judge/Timekeeper, then can apply to be a referee, you go on a course, and walaah, done,
it has been done in 1 season, but you have to be.
1 very good.
2 be out 3 nights a week judging....

Pro Boxing - You need to contact your BbbofC area representative, make an application.
You are then invited to a regional meeting and interviewed locally by Regional Board officials, comprising of local officials/trainers.
If you're knowledge of the BBBofC rulebook and previous experience as a fighter or knowledge of boxing is thorough enough and you pass the interview they will allow you to attend local shows on a probationary period. Throughout this period you will score every fight and your score will be assessed by the board.
This is done until you can evidence consistent scoring in line with the current referees/judges. This normally is a minimum of a year. Once the Area head honcho is satisfied you know what you're doing he can recommend you to the Board.
You are then given a formal interview at HQ in Cardiff with Robert Smith and all current A Star referees. They each ask you practical questions and the board quiz you in general.
If you pass this you can then be a trialist.
This means you can enter the ring on undercard fights and ref the fight whilst another ref scores it. You also score it but your score doesn't count as its hard enough reffing at first without having to score throughout. Your performance is then assessed monthly and your scorecards are compared as before.
This period lasts a year or two. If successful the area honcho can forward a recommendation that you are considered for your B class license. If you pass the blood tests, etc and pay the fees you can then be a ref and judge, only on fights up to 8 rounds.
For a British judge to score 12 round championship fights you must be A star. That can take over 20yrs to obtain although there have been examples much quicker ie less than ten years.

Clint Magnum wrote:Pro Boxing - You need to contact your BbbofC area representative, make an application.
You are then invited to a regional meeting and interviewed locally by Regional Board officials, comprising of local officials/trainers.
If you're knowledge of the BBBofC rulebook and previous experience as a fighter or knowledge of boxing is thorough enough and you pass the interview they will allow you to attend local shows on a probationary period. Throughout this period you will score every fight and your score will be assessed by the board.
This is done until you can evidence consistent scoring in line with the current referees/judges. This normally is a minimum of a year. Once the Area head honcho is satisfied you know what you're doing he can recommend you to the Board.
You are then given a formal interview at HQ in Cardiff with Robert Smith and all current A Star referees. They each ask you practical questions and the board quiz you in general.
If you pass this you can then be a trialist.
This means you can enter the ring on undercard fights and ref the fight whilst another ref scores it. You also score it but your score doesn't count as its hard enough reffing at first without having to score throughout. Your performance is then assessed monthly and your scorecards are compared as before.
This period lasts a year or two. If successful the area honcho can forward a recommendation that you are considered for your B class license. If you pass the blood tests, etc and pay the fees you can then be a ref and judge, only on fights up to 8 rounds.
For a British judge to score 12 round championship fights you must be A star. That can take over 20yrs to obtain although there have been examples much quicker ie less than ten years.

Strange that after having to go through what seems a genuinely thorough process we end up with some judges who cant score for muck. IJL springs to mind and Terrence O`Connor. They have turned in some utter shockers.

Not sure if the Spanish are as demanding on the entrance qualifications, but even with this process in the Uk we still get shocking cairds.

I`ve said before, they should take the average scores out of 5 people watching on TV and 3 ringside. 3 blokes is not enough and the 5 TV judges would be more difficult to "get to" for the promoter.

The scorecard at the weekend in Germany was truly concerning.
As for the UK, the two A star refs you named, they referee and score literally hundreds of fights a year without incident. Hundreds. When they get it right nobody bats an eyelid, when they get stick for one its remembered constantly. Occupational hazard. They are humans not robots.
One bad decision is one too many but all I would say is that no man is perfect, they're not robots.
If someone feels really strongly the judges are so bad in the UK and loves the sport, then give something back to it and devote your spare time to it by applying and proving you can do it better by becoming a better ref or judge. Its open to anyone who has the knowledge and love of the great sport. Obviously you need spare time too but its only a couple of nights a month locally for the first few years until you prove yourself.
There's a huge difference between knowing the path and walking the path.

You're right there, Clint. It's like on Amazon when a product has hundreds of decent reviews and the odd shocker. It's the shocker that catches people's attention.

Clint Magnum wrote:The scorecard at the weekend in Germany was truly concerning.
As for the UK, the two A star refs you named, they referee and score literally hundreds of fights a year without incident. Hundreds. When they get it right nobody bats an eyelid, when they get stick for one its remembered constantly. Occupational hazard. They are humans not robots.
One bad decision is one too many but all I would say is that no man is perfect, they're not robots.
If someone feels really strongly the judges are so bad in the UK and loves the sport, then give something back to it and devote your spare time to it by applying and proving you can do it better by becoming a better ref or judge. Its open to anyone who has the knowledge and love of the great sport. Obviously you need spare time too but its only a couple of nights a month locally for the first few years until you prove yourself.
There's a huge difference between knowing the path and walking the path.

This

Clint Magnum wrote:The scorecard at the weekend in Germany was truly concerning.
As for the UK, the two A star refs you named, they referee and score literally hundreds of fights a year without incident. Hundreds. When they get it right nobody bats an eyelid, when they get stick for one its remembered constantly. Occupational hazard. They are humans not robots.
One bad decision is one too many but all I would say is that no man is perfect, they're not robots.
If someone feels really strongly the judges are so bad in the UK and loves the sport, then give something back to it and devote your spare time to it by applying and proving you can do it better by becoming a better ref or judge. Its open to anyone who has the knowledge and love of the great sport. Obviously you need spare time too but its only a couple of nights a month locally for the first few years until you prove yourself.
There's a huge difference between knowing the path and walking the path.

Wonderfully put. That's effectively why I'm asking. I get disheartned by decisions like the one we saw at the weekend and know that it occurs at every level of the sport Amateur or pro. I'm lucky enough to have a job that affords me a flexible schedule and would love to give back something positive to the sport I love. Fingers crossed I can find a way in.

Clint Magnum wrote:Pro Boxing - You need to contact your BbbofC area representative, make an application.
You are then invited to a regional meeting and interviewed locally by Regional Board officials, comprising of local officials/trainers.
If you're knowledge of the BBBofC rulebook and previous experience as a fighter or knowledge of boxing is thorough enough and you pass the interview they will allow you to attend local shows on a probationary period. Throughout this period you will score every fight and your score will be assessed by the board.
This is done until you can evidence consistent scoring in line with the current referees/judges. This normally is a minimum of a year. Once the Area head honcho is satisfied you know what you're doing he can recommend you to the Board.
You are then given a formal interview at HQ in Cardiff with Robert Smith and all current A Star referees. They each ask you practical questions and the board quiz you in general.
If you pass this you can then be a trialist.
This means you can enter the ring on undercard fights and ref the fight whilst another ref scores it. You also score it but your score doesn't count as its hard enough reffing at first without having to score throughout. Your performance is then assessed monthly and your scorecards are compared as before.
This period lasts a year or two. If successful the area honcho can forward a recommendation that you are considered for your B class license. If you pass the blood tests, etc and pay the fees you can then be a ref and judge, only on fights up to 8 rounds.
For a British judge to score 12 round championship fights you must be A star. That can take over 20yrs to obtain although there have been examples much quicker ie less than ten years.

How is a referee monitored going forward.

Clint Magnum wrote:Pro Boxing - You need to contact your BbbofC area representative, make an application.
You are then invited to a regional meeting and interviewed locally by Regional Board officials, comprising of local officials/trainers.
If you're knowledge of the BBBofC rulebook and previous experience as a fighter or knowledge of boxing is thorough enough and you pass the interview they will allow you to attend local shows on a probationary period. Throughout this period you will score every fight and your score will be assessed by the board.
This is done until you can evidence consistent scoring in line with the current referees/judges. This normally is a minimum of a year. Once the Area head honcho is satisfied you know what you're doing he can recommend you to the Board.
You are then given a formal interview at HQ in Cardiff with Robert Smith and all current A Star referees. They each ask you practical questions and the board quiz you in general.
If you pass this you can then be a trialist.
This means you can enter the ring on undercard fights and ref the fight whilst another ref scores it. You also score it but your score doesn't count as its hard enough reffing at first without having to score throughout. Your performance is then assessed monthly and your scorecards are compared as before.
This period lasts a year or two. If successful the area honcho can forward a recommendation that you are considered for your B class license. If you pass the blood tests, etc and pay the fees you can then be a ref and judge, only on fights up to 8 rounds.
For a British judge to score 12 round championship fights you must be A star. That can take over 20yrs to obtain although there have been examples much quicker ie less than ten years.

Good post but just to add that A referees can do up to 10 rounds and ref area titles and the like; it usually takes around 2/3 years to go from B to A but again depends on the ref; some longer few shorter. From memory I think Howard Foster became the quickest A* Referee in about 5 years 4 Months? I'm sure someone will correct me if I am wrong.

Clint Magnum wrote:The scorecard at the weekend in Germany was truly concerning.
As for the UK, the two A star refs you named, they referee and score literally hundreds of fights a year without incident. Hundreds. When they get it right nobody bats an eyelid, when they get stick for one its remembered constantly. Occupational hazard. They are humans not robots.
One bad decision is one too many but all I would say is that no man is perfect, they're not robots.
If someone feels really strongly the judges are so bad in the UK and loves the sport, then give something back to it and devote your spare time to it by applying and proving you can do it better by becoming a better ref or judge. Its open to anyone who has the knowledge and love of the great sport. Obviously you need spare time too but its only a couple of nights a month locally for the first few years until you prove yourself.
There's a huge difference between knowing the path and walking the path.

I know what you are saying, but if I made a hugecock up in my job there would be consequenes. If i did it several times I would be sacked. Nature of the beast.

How can a proffesional justify the scoring of McDermott v Fury 1.

The lack of accountability is shocking.