BoxRec

Who would win and why?

This is actually a pretty good matchup. Neither Tate or Povetkin were very slick but both were decently schooled with good AM careers and both mostly outworked their opponents. Probably similar punching power-wise as well . . not feather-fisted but lacking one-punch power. Povetkin has the speed advantage.

Even fight . . forced to pick give me the bigger man in Tate to get the edge over the long haul with his greater strength and edge in height/reach. Povetkin has never been a lateral movement, in and out guy, and he'd probably have to become one to beat Big John.

Not a huge fan of Povetkin but I think he might actually take this one. John had some durability issues and Povetkin for all his shortcomings was tough.

Similar skill level, but Tate was a natural 230+ guy while Potsy is a chubby 230 pounds. Povetkinn starts fast and builds a lead before Tate wears him down and stops in the mid to late rounds.

Povetkin doesn't punch like Weaver.

Tate doesn't punch like Wlad.

For me Tate would win this by close decision

Woldemar wrote:Tate doesn't punch like Wlad.

Absolutely agree. However, he threw a lot more punches than Wlad.

Tate would have smashed Povetkin to smithereens - go and check out Tate vs John L. Gardner.

Tate vs Duane Bobick good perfomance by John.

John Tate was a very good fighter, I was thinking of Mike Dokes! Tate would have beaten him too.

Fat Git wrote:John Tate was a very good fighter, I was thinking of Mike Dokes! Tate would have beaten him too.

Yes, I think Dokes could have handled Povetkin pretty easily.

Dokes was good, his lifestyle wasnt. Povetkin wouldnt get near either Tate or Dokes.

Tate and Dokes such tragic stories.

Fat Git wrote:John Tate was a very good fighter, I was thinking of Mike Dokes! Tate would have beaten him too.

I think a lot of people don't know enough about Tate. They just see he got ko'd by Weaver.
However, he was in almost complete control of that fight until the last round. He had also beat Coetzee pretty convincingly in front of a huge crowd in South Africa. He was thought of pretty highly going into the Weaver fight. Had he won that, he probably has a unification showdown with Holmes in his next fight.

Ambling Alp II wrote:

Fat Git wrote:John Tate was a very good fighter, I was thinking of Mike Dokes! Tate would have beaten him too.

I think a lot of people don't know enough about Tate. They just see he got ko'd by Weaver.
However, he was in almost complete control of that fight until the last round. He had also beat Coetzee pretty convincingly in front of a huge crowd in South Africa. He was thought of pretty highly going into the Weaver fight. Had he won that, he probably has a unification showdown with Holmes in his next fight.

Although I'm not sure Holmes would have fought him. Had they fought I think he could have given Holmes a pretty good fight.

Broomhall wrote:Dokes was good, his lifestyle wasnt. Povetkin wouldnt get near either Tate or Dokes.

Tate and Dokes such tragic stories.

Dokes was good, somewhat overrated.Greg Page was a more tragic example.

The Great John L wrote:

Ambling Alp II wrote:

Fat Git wrote:John Tate was a very good fighter, I was thinking of Mike Dokes! Tate would have beaten him too.

I think a lot of people don't know enough about Tate. They just see he got ko'd by Weaver.
However, he was in almost complete control of that fight until the last round. He had also beat Coetzee pretty convincingly in front of a huge crowd in South Africa. He was thought of pretty highly going into the Weaver fight. Had he won that, he probably has a unification showdown with Holmes in his next fight.

Although I'm not sure Holmes would have fought him. Had they fought I think he could have given Holmes a pretty good fight.

I think Holmes would have fought him. Holmes craved attention (and he didn't think he got enough), and this fight would have got him more attention than any other at the time.
Agree that Tate probably would have gave him a lot of trouble.

Ambling Alp II wrote:
I think Holmes would have fought him. Holmes craved attention (and he didn't think he got enough), and this fight would have got him more attention than any other at the time.
Agree that Tate probably would have gave him a lot of trouble.

From what I've both read and heard there was actually some talk about a Holmes-Tate unification match. I think Holmes would have taken the fight had it came off sometime between 1980-1982 and of course had Tate not lost to Weaver or anyone else in the interim. It really wasn't until about 1983 and onward that Holmes began side stepping top challengers. The Holmes of 1978-1982 was pretty good about facing the best available men.

drunkenpiper36 wrote:

Ambling Alp II wrote:
I think Holmes would have fought him. Holmes craved attention (and he didn't think he got enough), and this fight would have got him more attention than any other at the time.
Agree that Tate probably would have gave him a lot of trouble.

From what I've both read and heard there was actually some talk about a Holmes-Tate unification match. I think Holmes would have taken the fight had it came off sometime between 1980-1982 and of course had Tate not lost to Weaver or anyone else in the interim. It really wasn't until about 1983 and onward that Holmes began side stepping top challengers. The Holmes of 1978-1982 was pretty good about facing the best available men.

Yes there was plenty of talk about Holmes fighting a unification, but I don' think the talk included Holmes or his people. After beating Norton in a close exciting fight Holmes fought Evangelista, 13 fight Ocasio and then the completely unheralded Weaver who gave him a very tough fight. He did fight Shavers next, someone he had already outclassed, but then went on to fight Zanon, the portly, ranked but relatively unproven Leroy Jones, journeyman LeDoux and then the 38yo Ali.

I consider Holmes one of the top 4 or 5 HWs of all time, but to say he fought the best available during that time is a pretty hard opinion to defend. His opposition improved dramatically beginning in '81 so I guess had Tate been able to hold on and survive the last few rounds against Weaver it's possible that Holmes might have considered him, but he never really showed any desire to unify, or even acknowledge any other title claimant.

Since we are in a political season in the US, here is is some spin on why these were mostly legit defenses:
6 of the 8 defenses were against Top 10 Contenders. (Ali and Weaver were not.)

Nobody really stood out in late 1978-1980.

Shavers was probably considered the biggest threat, even though he had lost to Holmes previously. He was coming off the big ko of Norton.
Ocasio had beaten Jimmy Young twice before the Holmes fight.
Le Roy Jones was actually the mandatory # 1 contender by the WBC. Holmes had to defend or get stripped.
Zanon actually looked pretty good against Quarry and Norton until his glass jaw let him down. He had also beat the great Evangelista twice.

He made 8 defenses in 28 months. That is unheard of today. Going into the fights, really only the LeDoux fight was a bum of the month type defense.

Outside of Tate and Coetzee, there really wasn't anyone else at that point.

The Great John L wrote:After beating Norton in a close exciting fight Holmes fought Evangelista, 13 fight Ocasio and then the completely unheralded Weaver who gave him a very tough fight. He did fight Shavers next, someone he had already outclassed, but then went on to fight Zanon, the portly, ranked but relatively unproven Leroy Jones, journeyman LeDoux and then the 38yo Ali.

I consider Holmes one of the top 4 or 5 HWs of all time, but to say he fought the best available during that time is a pretty hard opinion to defend. His opposition improved dramatically beginning in '81 so I guess had Tate been able to hold on and survive the last few rounds against Weaver it's possible that Holmes might have considered him, but he never really showed any desire to unify, or even acknowledge any other title claimant.

He fought quite a few second raters as you mentioned even during that proposed time frame. But from 1978 to 1982 he fought Norton, Shavers, Cooney, Berbick, Snipes, and Leon Spinks. For the most part that was the heavyweight division. Dokes was still pretty green during that time and Tate lost in his first defense of the title, then lost to Berbick and dropped off the face of the earth. Weaver deserved a rematch but had at least already gotten a crack at Larry. Coetzee was another possibility but was losing to men who Holmes was beating. For the most part his early reign was solid and if nothing else " busy". I agree that he started taking soft touches later.

tate would stop povetkin and not hug him all nite and fite like a man