BoxRec

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKMOqDLVFuk

Do you agree with him??

This post was made by KBB who is currently on your ignore list.

ReggieDiggs wrote:This post was made by KBB who is currently on your ignore list.

Reggie I'm just trying to talk boxing here, no need to act like an immature Pacquiao fan.

McCallum called SRL, Tommy Hearns, Duran and Hagler ducks.

I think that is a bit unfair of McCallum.

As great as McCallum was, he wasn't a 'name', so he had little to offer those guys.

Look at the timeline & it just made no sense for any of them to have gone after him.

By 1984, Leonard was retired & a full-time coke head (read his book; I'm not slating him).

Tommy Hearns was weight hopping & trying to knock out men at different weights to bag titles.

Duran's top flight career was beginning to wind down.

Hagler was losing his speed & was also boxing from memory & McCallum was a Light-middle.

By the time McCallum really made people sit up & take notice, the Big 4 were just about done as unit & were either on the job retired, or looking to fry bigger fish, as in the case of Hearns.

ReggieDiggs wrote:This post was made by KBB who is currently on your ignore list.

what kind of retard goes around responding to people on his ignore list just to tell them
they are on his ignore list? doesn't that defeat the purpose of putting them on an ignore
list? i'm sure everyone put on notice that they are being ignored by someone else on
some message board really feels crushed about it..

unfortunately boxing is a business and, even though mccallum earned with his skills
the right to be mentioned along with the elites, he didn't draw enough attention to
take part in superfights against them. hagler was dodged for a long time and was really
just a top draw toward the end. so often in this sport these guys spend their primes
trying to earn big money fights and really don't make their biggest paydays until after
they are past their primes. golovkin has been ducked for years now and it looks like
he will be another in this category.

the girl in the beginning of that video is a heartbreaker

It is a tad unfair of Mike McCallum to say that when you think about it. As Hagler hung them after losing to Sugar Ray Leonard at Middleweight, who turn went to Super-Middle before eventually ending his career losing to Terry Norris. Hearns was Super-Middle and Light-Heavy when McCallum arrived and Duran was well Duran....

IRLangmaid25 wrote:It is a tad unfair of Mike McCallum to say that when you think about it. As Hagler hung them after losing to Sugar Ray Leonard at Middleweight, who turn went to Super-Middle before eventually ending his career losing to Terry Norris. Hearns was Super-Middle and Light-Heavy when McCallum arrived and Duran was well Duran....

I'm not so sure that it is unfair for him to state the truth of the matter, we never had a chance to see him face any of them so why is it unfair for him to say something that appears as obvious??

Syntax Error wrote:I think that is a bit unfair of McCallum.

As great as McCallum was, he wasn't a 'name', so he had little to offer those guys.

I guess you can say that, but they all fought guys who were much lesser "names" than McCallum, who was a very well known and dangerous opponent.

The Great John L wrote:I guess you can say that, but they all fought guys who were much lesser "names" than McCallum, who was a very well known and dangerous opponent.

thats how it works, risk vs reward. if you were the draw and could make the same money as fighting mccallum
by facing a less dangerous opponent, what would you do? i would say he was ducked, but for good reason.
he wasn't worth the trouble. mccallum didn't have a home arena that he could fill. even as a champ he was
usually the visiting team

This post was made by sucarcristo who is currently on your ignore list.

The Great John L wrote:

Syntax Error wrote:I think that is a bit unfair of McCallum.

As great as McCallum was, he wasn't a 'name', so he had little to offer those guys.

I guess you can say that, but they all fought guys who were much lesser "names" than McCallum, who was a very well known and dangerous opponent.

McCallum was dangerous, as he showed KO'ing Terry Norris and pretty sure he KO'd Julian Jackson. After that James Toney and Roy Jones made him look ordinary though.

I guess he was a high risk low reward. Mike who?

Badhusker wrote:

The Great John L wrote:

Syntax Error wrote:I think that is a bit unfair of McCallum.

As great as McCallum was, he wasn't a 'name', so he had little to offer those guys.

I guess you can say that, but they all fought guys who were much lesser "names" than McCallum, who was a very well known and dangerous opponent.

McCallum was dangerous, as he showed KO'ing Terry Norris and pretty sure he KO'd Julian Jackson. After that James Toney and Roy Jones made him look ordinary though.

I guess he was a high risk low reward. Mike who?

The fact that none of the four fought him is indicative of just how dangerous he was. Your mention of Toney and Jones making him look oridnary is pretty silly considering how old McCallum was when he fought those guys, especially Jones. And despite his age, McCallum fought quite well against Toney in both fights. More interesting were his struggles with Kalambay, but as I recall Hearns got stomped by Barkley when he was only 30, and looked very ordinary in losing their rematch as well. And by the time Duran was the age that McCallum fought Toney he looked ordinary in a number of fights against club fighters. Do I really need to mention Pat Lawlor?

It's also fair to say that Jones and Toney could very well have made the big four look ordinary as well, especially had they fought Jones and Toney in their twilight years as McCallum did. In fact, it's hard to envision the MW Duran having any type of success against Jones or Toney.

The Great John L wrote:More interesting were his struggles with Kalambay.

kalambay was a master boxer. i see at least 9 future or former major title holders on his
record, with wins over drayton, dewitt, mccallum, barkley, and collins, and many top contenders.
he got momentarily careless against nunn but his few other losses were all very close. fighting
close with kalambay twice makes you elite as much as any other outcome on mccallum's record.
mccallum had world class skills and one-punch ko power so of course the stars would avoid him

sucracristo wrote:kalambay was a master boxer. i see at least 9 future or former major title holders on his
record, with wins over drayton, dewitt, mccallum, barkley, and collins, and many top contenders.
he got momentarily careless against nunn but his few other losses were all very close. fighting
close with kalambay twice makes you elite as much as any other outcome on mccallum's record.
mccallum had world class skills and one-punch ko power so of course the stars would avoid him

+1

I find it interesting that someone would try to place MCCALLUM in a position where they think he didn't deserve a shot, there was a reason all of them avoided fighting him.

KBB wrote:I find it interesting that someone would try to place MCCALLUM in a position where they think he didn't deserve a shot, there was a reason all of them avoided fighting him.

Yes there was.

McCallum was dangerous, as he showed KO'ing Terry Norris and pretty sure he KO'd Julian Jackson. After that James Toney and Roy Jones made him look ordinary though.

I guess he was a high risk low reward. Mike who? [/quote]

The fact that none of the four fought him is indicative of just how dangerous he was. Your mention of Toney and Jones making him look oridnary is pretty silly considering how old McCallum was when he fought those guys, especially Jones. And despite his age, McCallum fought quite well against Toney in both fights. More interesting were his struggles with Kalambay, but as I recall Hearns got stomped by Barkley when he was only 30, and looked very ordinary in losing their rematch as well. And by the time Duran was the age that McCallum fought Toney he looked ordinary in a number of fights against club fighters. Do I really need to mention Pat Lawlor?

It's also fair to say that Jones and Toney could very well have made the big four look ordinary as well, especially had they fought Jones and Toney in their twilight years as McCallum did. In fact, it's hard to envision the MW Duran having any type of success against Jones or Toney.[/quote]


Good point on Mccallum's age when he fought those guys. I didn't realize he was almost 40 years old. Jones in his prime pretty much made everyone else look ordinary I guess.

Any top fighter weighing between 140 - 160 & competing between 1980 - 1987 might claim to have been 'ducked' by one or all four of the Big 4 if they didn't get a bout with any of them.

Ducking is such a subjective & loaded term.

Ducking is what Riddick Bowe did to Lennox Lewis in 1993.

You can use whatever reason you like, but he ducked Lewis, when a fight between the two of them was the biggest & most natural fight out there; a fight that had a path towards it, so to speak.

I might be wrong, but I don't remember there being a huge clamour for Mike McCallum to fight anyone of the Big 4.

As I've said before, with Leonard's annual retirements, Hearns' weight hopping & Duran winding down, they were never a real option.

As for Hagler, he was the middleweight champion & if McCallum wanted a piece of the Marvellous one, he should have gone up to 160 & beat a bath to his door.

Hagler never ducked anyone & was always fighting someone's champion or number one contender, so the onus would have been on Mike to make that happen.

Syntax Error wrote:Any top fighter weighing between 140 - 160 & competing between 1980 - 1987 might claim to have been 'ducked' by one or all four of the Big 4 if they didn't get a bout with any of them.

Ducking is such a subjective & loaded term.

Ducking is what Riddick Bowe did to Lennox Lewis in 1993.

You can use whatever reason you like, but he ducked Lewis, when a fight between the two of them was the biggest & most natural fight out there; a fight that had a path towards it, so to speak.

I might be wrong, but I don't remember there being a huge clamour for Mike McCallum to fight anyone of the Big 4.

As I've said before, with Leonard's annual retirements, Hearns' weight hopping & Duran winding down, they were never a real option.

As for Hagler, he was the middleweight champion & if McCallum wanted a piece of the Marvellous one, he should have gone up to 160 & beat a bath to his door.

Hagler never ducked anyone & was always fighting someone's champion or number one contender, so the onus would have been on Mike to make that happen.

It could be argued that Lennox ducked Chris Byrd when he tossed the belt into the can and if you watch the video link that I posted then you will hear McCallum explain the debate he and Hagler had because he told the entire story and it is pretty clear that Marvin ducked him from what is being told.

Syntax Error wrote: when a fight between the two of them was the biggest & most natural fight out there;

it was lewis who refused to sign the contract that was put right in front of him to fight bowe
because he didn't think he was getting enough money, then lewis made it personal.
if you aren't the champ, then you can't dictate the terms and if you don't sign the contract
you are offered, then boohoo for you. bowe would have put lewis's lights out in 93 worse than
rahman and mccall did later. there was definitely more public demand for bowe-lewis than
mccallum vs the big 4, though.

to be fair, mccallum never really fought in the same division as any of the big 4 for more than
a minute, and he was too dangererous without the big following to make it worth it for them to
go out of their way to fight him. they were already legends and he was hardly a household name,
although respected by anyone who followed boxing more than casually.

Minor bitterness in there but Mike sounds fairly sincere.
Truth be told McCallum wasn't a bigger name on the mainstreams lips at that time I would have thought, Leonard shined, Hearns had a reputation and Hagler was Hagler.
Doesn't mean McCallum didn't belong in their company because he did, he wasn't a good B level he was a highly respected A level boxer.

sucracristo wrote:

Syntax Error wrote: when a fight between the two of them was the biggest & most natural fight out there;

it was lewis who refused to sign the contract that was put right in front of him to fight bowe
because he didn't think he was getting enough money, then lewis made it personal.
if you aren't the champ, then you can't dictate the terms and if you don't sign the contract
you are offered, then boohoo for you. bowe would have put lewis's lights out in 93 worse than
rahman and mccall did later. there was definitely more public demand for bowe-lewis than
mccallum vs the big 4, though.

to be fair, mccallum never really fought in the same division as any of the big 4 for more than
a minute, and he was too dangererous without the big following to make it worth it for them to
go out of their way to fight him. they were already legends and he was hardly a household name,
although respected by anyone who followed boxing more than casually.

I agree with your last paragraph, however as far as McCallum not being a household name then all I can say to that is that many of the fighters outside of the battles they (MMH, SRL, TH, RD) had with one another weren't as big as McCallum and though he didn't spend any lengthy time in their weight classes he more than proved that he was willing to fight anyone and should've been given a shot but wasn't more than likely for the very reason you've stated.