BoxRec

Depends on how you look at it?!

Chin....10/10...Heart 10/10....Boxing Skills 10/10...Stamina 10/10...Recoup Powers 10/10....Finisher 10/10....Always in Shape 10/10...

Able To Adjust In Any Fight 10/10....Marketing Power 7/10 Total HYBRID BOXER EXTRAORDINAIRE ...ROLLS ROYCE PHANTOM OF BOXING

D https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4VZSkRdnyQ

bnovelist wrote:Depends on how you look at it?!

Chin....10/10...Heart 10/10....Boxing Skills 10/10...Stamina 10/10...Recoup Powers 10/10....Finisher 10/10....Always in Shape 10/10...

Able To Adjust In Any Fight 10/10....Marketing Power 7/10 Total HYBRID BOXER EXTRAORDINAIRE ...ROLLS ROYCE PHANTOM OF BOXING

D https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4VZSkRdnyQ

Not to mention he dominated his division, sure he could've tested himself and moved north to face Spinks but personally I never saw him as a big 160lber so he did the right thing and stayed there and owned it which is why he is in my top 5 all time best. He could also fight as an orthodox fighter or as a SP.

I always said it and been saying it for years "If Hagler Was a Natural 215lber Young Tyson Would Have Been Toast!" I much rather face a young

Tyson than a Marvin Hagler who punches you in the face HARD from many angles for the full duration shiiiit........ Hagler lunges in, leans in,

bends in, everything possible to wear his man down. Ray Robinson is glorified rightfully so! But let him fight Hagler!

Ray Robinson was the best Welterweight in the world for almost a decade before he actually got a title shot. He then went on, to compete at a division that he was actually not that well suited to, as he was pretty slight, even so, he went on to also dominate 160, though because he was fighting bigger stronger men, lost a few there.

Hagler was my favourite fighter as a kid, but I'd never rate him above SRR. You could argue the case that Monzon was greater at 160 than him too.

Hagler was a BEAST. I'm a SRL first and foremost but I can still appreciate a great fighter when I see one. There's no middle ground when it comes to who won that fight so I won't argue that with anyone. I just don't understand why Hagler fought the type of fight he did against SRL. You can clearly see with these clips that Hagler's success stemmed from relentless pressure from the opening bell. Where was that against SRL? Yes, SRL was mobile in the fight but even when Hagler caught up to him, we didn't see the lunging right crosses or the relentless pressure. Maybe it just wasn't his night.

caldo2025 wrote:Hagler was a BEAST. I'm a SRL first and foremost but I can still appreciate a great fighter when I see one. There's no middle ground when it comes to who won that fight so I won't argue that with anyone. I just don't understand why Hagler fought the type of fight he did against SRL. You can clearly see with these clips that Hagler's success stemmed from relentless pressure from the opening bell. Where was that against SRL? Yes, SRL was mobile in the fight but even when Hagler caught up to him, we didn't see the lunging right crosses or the relentless pressure. Maybe it just wasn't his night.

Hagler was his own worst enemy, he tried to prove he could outbox Leonard, and after 4 rounds of getting picked off, realised he couldn't do it, but by then had thrown 4 rounds away.

Leonard had forced a much larger ring on Hagler too, which made it difficult for him to close the gap.

For what it's worth, I thought Leonard won it clearly. It was close, but clear.

No, Hagler should not be considered for TBE. He is one of my favorite fighters of all time. He was a great MW, but he was not at TBE level.

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:Hagler was a BEAST. I'm a SRL first and foremost but I can still appreciate a great fighter when I see one. There's no middle ground when it comes to who won that fight so I won't argue that with anyone. I just don't understand why Hagler fought the type of fight he did against SRL. You can clearly see with these clips that Hagler's success stemmed from relentless pressure from the opening bell. Where was that against SRL? Yes, SRL was mobile in the fight but even when Hagler caught up to him, we didn't see the lunging right crosses or the relentless pressure. Maybe it just wasn't his night.

Hagler was his own worst enemy, he tried to prove he could outbox Leonard, and after 4 rounds of getting picked off, realised he couldn't do it, but by then had thrown 4 rounds away.

Leonard had forced a much larger ring on Hagler too, which made it difficult for him to close the gap.

For what it's worth, I thought Leonard won it clearly. It was close, but clear.

Leonard only took the fight because he saw in the Mugabi fight that Hagler had slipped. Had he fought Hagler a few years before he would have been stopped imo.

Baby Face Finster wrote: Leonard only took the fight because he saw in the Mugabi fight that Hagler had slipped. Had he fought Hagler a few years before he would have been stopped imo.

SRL is my favorite boxer of all time but I can't argue with your point at all. The Hagler that fought SRL was not the same guy that demolished Hearns or anyone else in his path in his prime. SRL did do some running in that fight but nothing crazy I don't think. Nothing like Floyd did late in that fight with Manny. I think SRL definitely knew what he was doing taking this fight when he did and it's no surprise that Marvin never fought again.

Great point.

caldo2025 wrote:

Baby Face Finster wrote: Leonard only took the fight because he saw in the Mugabi fight that Hagler had slipped. Had he fought Hagler a few years before he would have been stopped imo.

SRL is my favorite boxer of all time but I can't argue with your point at all. The Hagler that fought SRL was not the same guy that demolished Hearns or anyone else in his path in his prime. SRL did do some running in that fight but nothing crazy I don't think. Nothing like Floyd did late in that fight with Manny. I think SRL definitely knew what he was doing taking this fight when he did and it's no surprise that Marvin never fought again.

Great point.

SRL was like Arturo Gatti compared to Mayweather, although he boxed very cautiously, he did actually engage Marvin, even winning key exchanges with him.

People forget what a huge underdog Leonard was going into that fight.

Marvin should have gone for the rematch, I think he could have done a lot better, it's not like he was shot. His pride got the better of him.

Baby Face Finster wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:Hagler was a BEAST. I'm a SRL first and foremost but I can still appreciate a great fighter when I see one. There's no middle ground when it comes to who won that fight so I won't argue that with anyone. I just don't understand why Hagler fought the type of fight he did against SRL. You can clearly see with these clips that Hagler's success stemmed from relentless pressure from the opening bell. Where was that against SRL? Yes, SRL was mobile in the fight but even when Hagler caught up to him, we didn't see the lunging right crosses or the relentless pressure. Maybe it just wasn't his night.

Hagler was his own worst enemy, he tried to prove he could outbox Leonard, and after 4 rounds of getting picked off, realised he couldn't do it, but by then had thrown 4 rounds away.

Leonard had forced a much larger ring on Hagler too, which made it difficult for him to close the gap.

For what it's worth, I thought Leonard won it clearly. It was close, but clear.

Leonard only took the fight because he saw in the Mugabi fight that Hagler had slipped. Had he fought Hagler a few years before he would have been stopped imo.

This is well known, but I still wouldn't have picked many others to have beaten Hagler at that point. Certainly not a welterweight.

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
SRL was like Arturo Gatti compared to Mayweather, although he boxed very cautiously, he did actually engage Marvin, even winning key exchanges with him.

People forget what a huge underdog Leonard was going into that fight.

Marvin should have gone for the rematch, I think he could have done a lot better, it's not like he was shot. His pride got the better of him.

I remember feeling scared for Sugar Ray going into that fight. People were saying that he would never be the same after getting in the ring with Marvin and I was right there with them. I read Sugar's book a year ago and he talks about this fight and how he lost all fear and doubt that night and it was almost like an out of body experience. He said that he looked into Marvin's eyes and he knew he was going to win.

There was something about Sugar's style that just demoralized his opponent. Look what he did to Duran and though Marvin would never quit in the ring like that coward, he did never fight again so Sugar definitely did something to Marvin's soul and desire.

I'd say Buster beating Tyson was the biggest upset in boxing history but I'd put Sugar Ray beating Hagler a distant 2nd in my lifetime in upsets.

caldo2025 wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
SRL was like Arturo Gatti compared to Mayweather, although he boxed very cautiously, he did actually engage Marvin, even winning key exchanges with him.

People forget what a huge underdog Leonard was going into that fight.

Marvin should have gone for the rematch, I think he could have done a lot better, it's not like he was shot. His pride got the better of him.

I remember feeling scared for Sugar Ray going into that fight. People were saying that he would never be the same after getting in the ring with Marvin and I was right there with them. I read Sugar's book a year ago and he talks about this fight and how he lost all fear and doubt that night and it was almost like an out of body experience. He said that he looked into Marvin's eyes and he knew he was going to win.

There was something about Sugar's style that just demoralized his opponent. Look what he did to Duran and though Marvin would never quit in the ring like that coward, he did never fight again so Sugar definitely did something to Marvin's soul and desire.

I'd say Buster beating Tyson was the biggest upset in boxing history but I'd put Sugar Ray beating Hagler a distant 2nd in my lifetime in upsets.

Although he didn't do that to duran in the first fight.

Roberto had a horrific training camp for the second fight, having allowed himself to get into a shocking state, and not giving himself enough time to lose the weight slowly. He was a shell of a man in that fight. That's definitely one fight which flatters Leonard, in my opinion.

jamesmcdonnell wrote: Roberto had a horrific training camp for the second fight, having allowed himself to get into a shocking state, and not giving himself enough time to lose the weight slowly. He was a shell of a man in that fight. That's definitely one fight which flatters Leonard, in my opinion.

I don't care what he did in training camp, the guy quit in the ring in a MEGAFIGHT. Plenty of people have horrible training camps and perform horribly on fight night but not many people quite in the ring like that. It wasn't because he was getting beat up so badly like Chavez Jr vs. Fonfara and he didn't want to take any more punishment. He quit from frustration. Sugar Ray used the larger ring perfectly and made him look foolish with the BOLO punches. You can't sell me on taking it easy on Duran. He was a coward that night and there's no other way you can look at it.