BoxRec

An official at a show I was at tonight claimed Jones Jnr not turning up for the Tony Moran fight cost the promoter £48,000! Apparently he's persuing Jones (or whoever) for 100k compensation.

Gotta have deep pockets as a relatively small promoter to lose 48k!

Yep, he did lose a considerable amount, no question about that.

The RJJ contract was for 2 fights, of which i was hoping to secure the second of those, safe to say i think i got off lucky

I'm hearing the Enzo fight is looking increasingly likely for Russia

When you see the amount of dropouts on them kind of bills you have to question the validity of the claimed announcements in the first place. Too many changes of opponents & too many TBA don't fill the paying public with confidence either

Are there other examples like this where a promoter has paid a boxer a deposit of sorts?

How skint is RJJ?
And and faded legend is unpredictable when it comes to fights

I don't think he is even skint, he us HBO commentator which will be paying a fair bit

Think Vaughan has bigger problems to worry about than Roy Jones owing him money.

kamicazze wrote:Are there other examples like this where a promoter has paid a boxer a deposit of sorts?

I do konw it was MBC sanctioned and they have announced Jeff Lacey. Ronald Hearns & James Toney as their contracts set in stone on other shows only for them to never materialise.

kamicazze wrote:Are there other examples like this where a promoter has paid a boxer a deposit of sorts?

I paid Audley Harrison a deposit before he came to fight Ali Adams in 2012. I would be sceptical about paying deposits generally but Audley is very ethical financially and contractually so it did not worry me. Have heard some bad stories with lots of lost money re deposits though.

Can promoters take out some kind of insurance against situations like this ?

stevegoodwin wrote:

kamicazze wrote:Are there other examples like this where a promoter has paid a boxer a deposit of sorts?

I paid Audley Harrison a deposit before he came to fight Ali Adams in 2012. I would be sceptical about paying deposits generally but Audley is very ethical financially and contractually so it did not worry me. Have heard some bad stories with lots of lost money re deposits though.

Agree but still must have some reservations about paying up front.

Cazelo wrote:I don't think he is even skint, he us HBO commentator which will be paying a fair bit

Probably doesn't pay that well compared to what he is used to. I seem to recall he had some giant ranch type property, which isn't going to be cheap to maintain.

That's the problem with these superstar fighters, they build expensive lifestyles around them which are very expensive to maintain, and when the money stops flowing in, their costs are still there. I seem to remember reading once that Mike Tyson's mansion cost him 100,000 dollars a month to maintain due to his huge staffing and other costs.

Hasn't he had problems with the IRS too - in the U.S those bastards will hound you till you die over money owed. It's ruined plenty of fights. Joe Louis was hounded into poverty and an early grave by the IRS - over monies that he donated to the war effort, but was counted by the IRS as taxable income. He died without ever paying off the huge sums he owed, which accumulated interest, and they even swiped the money left to him by his mother in her will (600 dollars) - when he fought Marciano, he 'earned' 300,000 USD, but after the 90% tax of the time, he was left with 30,000 USD, all of which had to be paid to the IRS.

Stephen Vaughan also flew Jones Jr and his team over for a press conference in the Bier Kellar and put them up in the Hilton in Liverpool for a few days on top of whatever he lost on the show can't imagine that was cheap

I heard that RJJ was moving to Russia. There tax rates are ridiculously low at 13% for residents. A few stars with tax issues have moved there and if you are famous enough Putin will waive the 6month residency period (non residents are subject to 30% tax for 1st 6months). Compare that to tax rates here and in the USA/France etc and it saves you a fortune.
Loads of celebs get done over by the IRS in the US. It's a bit different to here in so much as you can pretty much fob them off for a while before they catch up with you. The only people that have managed to beat the IRS was the Scientology church, everyone else has ended up losing homes and virtually all income until the debts are paid.
I think its fair to say that some boxers don't get the right advice and think that there are ways around paying what is owed.They are often ripped off by advisors. Joe Louis, Evander Holyfield and Tyson are all examples who have been shafted.
To pay out £40 odd grand before the contest sounds naive, its not even like the guy lives in this country and could be legally pursued for it.

CharlesListon wrote:I heard that RJJ was moving to Russia.

Gimmick surely, even if the tax was 0% why would Roy move there to be spat at in the street for the autumn of his life?

Sklar wrote:

CharlesListon wrote:I heard that RJJ was moving to Russia.

Gimmick surely, even if the tax was 0% why would Roy move there to be spat at in the street for the autumn of his life?

I wouldnt fancy it personally, but they all the celebs live in a posh coastal area down on or near the Crimea. Its like a Riviera apparently. Nice and hot in the summer and not dreadful in winter.

CharlesListon wrote:I heard that RJJ was moving to Russia. There tax rates are ridiculously low at 13% for residents. A few stars with tax issues have moved there and if you are famous enough Putin will waive the 6month residency period (non residents are subject to 30% tax for 1st 6months). Compare that to tax rates here and in the USA/France etc and it saves you a fortune.
Loads of celebs get done over by the IRS in the US. It's a bit different to here in so much as you can pretty much fob them off for a while before they catch up with you. The only people that have managed to beat the IRS was the Scientology church, everyone else has ended up losing homes and virtually all income until the debts are paid.
I think its fair to say that some boxers don't get the right advice and think that there are ways around paying what is owed.They are often ripped off by advisors. Joe Louis, Evander Holyfield and Tyson are all examples who have been shafted.
To pay out £40 odd grand before the contest sounds naive, its not even like the guy lives in this country and could be legally pursued for it.

Yeah, I heard that a while back - not sure whatever came of it though. Thing is, how practical would that be, he'd no longer be in the US where his work is - I can't imagine that there's a huge amount of money to be had for him fighting in Russia - he's just not a superstar any more.

Perhaps though the IRS couldn't pursue him though if he was resident in Russia, but they would sure as hell arrest him as soon as he re-entered the country, so he'd have to avoid the U.S for the rest of his natural born days.

USA require citizens to pay us taxes even if they work and live outside the US. So jones will have to pay Russian taxes if he resides there and us taxes on top of that.

rio wrote:USA require citizens to pay us taxes even if they work and live outside the US. So jones will have to pay Russian taxes if he resides there and us taxes on top of that.

He wouldn't be a usa citizen though. He'd become a Russian citizen.

CharlesListon wrote:

rio wrote:USA require citizens to pay us taxes even if they work and live outside the US. So jones will have to pay Russian taxes if he resides there and us taxes on top of that.

He wouldn't be a usa citizen though. He'd become a Russian citizen.

Yes, that's what I meant.

However, the tax would still be owed - and if Jones returned to the U.S, he'd I'm sure still be charged, on re-entry, as the taxes accrued would have been prior to relinquishing his U.S citizenship - if you can even do such a thing.

I'm pretty certain USSR has no extradition treaty with the U.S, so if he wanted to leave for good, he could, but plenty of other countries do have extradition treaties, so travelling around might become tricky.

Yeah, he'd pretty much have to be careful wherever he went outside Russia.
If he did avoid the usa the irs would have as much chance getting money off him as Steve Vaughan does.

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

Cazelo wrote:I don't think he is even skint, he us HBO commentator which will be paying a fair bit

Probably doesn't pay that well compared to what he is used to. I seem to recall he had some giant ranch type property, which isn't going to be cheap to maintain.

That's the problem with these superstar fighters, they build expensive lifestyles around them which are very expensive to maintain, and when the money stops flowing in, their costs are still there. I seem to remember reading once that Mike Tyson's mansion cost him 100,000 dollars a month to maintain due to his huge staffing and other costs.

Hasn't he had problems with the IRS too - in the U.S those bastards will hound you till you die over money owed. It's ruined plenty of fights. Joe Louis was hounded into poverty and an early grave by the IRS - over monies that he donated to the war effort, but was counted by the IRS as taxable income. He died without ever paying off the huge sums he owed, which accumulated interest, and they even swiped the money left to him by his mother in her will (600 dollars) - when he fought Marciano, he 'earned' 300,000 USD, but after the 90% tax of the time, he was left with 30,000 USD, all of which had to be paid to the IRS.

Great response. It's the superstar lifestyles that damage "stars" when they are broke they are still richer than the common man just not as rich as they used to be. So the Maybach has to be downgraded to an S Class Mercedes and the 12 bedroom mansion becomes 8 bedroom.

salaambrown wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

Cazelo wrote:I don't think he is even skint, he us HBO commentator which will be paying a fair bit

Probably doesn't pay that well compared to what he is used to. I seem to recall he had some giant ranch type property, which isn't going to be cheap to maintain.

That's the problem with these superstar fighters, they build expensive lifestyles around them which are very expensive to maintain, and when the money stops flowing in, their costs are still there. I seem to remember reading once that Mike Tyson's mansion cost him 100,000 dollars a month to maintain due to his huge staffing and other costs.

Hasn't he had problems with the IRS too - in the U.S those bastards will hound you till you die over money owed. It's ruined plenty of fights. Joe Louis was hounded into poverty and an early grave by the IRS - over monies that he donated to the war effort, but was counted by the IRS as taxable income. He died without ever paying off the huge sums he owed, which accumulated interest, and they even swiped the money left to him by his mother in her will (600 dollars) - when he fought Marciano, he 'earned' 300,000 USD, but after the 90% tax of the time, he was left with 30,000 USD, all of which had to be paid to the IRS.

Great response. It's the superstar lifestyles that damage "stars" when they are broke they are still richer than the common man just not as rich as they used to be. So the Maybach has to be downgraded to an S Class Mercedes and the 12 bedroom mansion becomes 8 bedroom.

Well the thing is, if you're going through millions a year, it's easy to end up pretty broke. One day you look at the accounts, and there's nothing there except a bunch of assets worth far less than you paid for them, and a humungous tax bill which your accountant didn't tell you about.

Tyson didn't have an 8 bedroom mansion or anything like it - he had a small condo in Vegas, which is dirt cheap to live in anyway. I reckon he is doing okish now, but he's certainly not a rich man, I don't think Jones Jr is either,I think he sold all his property as he couldn't afford it any more.

Going to be difficult to enforce an English court judgment in the US or worse still Russia even if he wins. I feel bad for the promoter.