BoxRec

I was surprised to see AA got beat last night in Vegas, I was even more surprised to see he got 120-108'd on 3 judges scorecards. No one has given him an absolute lesson since he was cobra'd a few years back.

is this kid that beat him the real deal?

Thanks for posting the scores. I didn't see them elsewhere. Appreciated.

I was going through some tweets from people watching it & it sounds like the kid was showing great defence & footwork. A very interesting addition to the Super Middleweight top dogs.

Abraham got whooped but it's been due.

Ramirez will only get better be interesting where he goes from here.

Did anybody watch it? How good does this kid look?

I'd heard about him but never seen him, had the impression he was a bit protected/overated. It seems not.

That lad Oscar Valdez smashed Gradovich on the same card as well, he can't be far away from a title shot.

Excellent performance from Ramirez,yeh he totally schooled Abraham,i had it 118-110 although even the 2 rounds i gave to Arthur were close,really impressed with Ramirez's display,sticking and moving throughout the 12 rounds,always busy,as expected when you fight someone with Abraham's defence Gilberto landed on the gloves a lot but he also landed clean plenty as well,Abraham was poor,never really got out of 2nd gear,i gave him the 5th and 6th rounds but he was too one paced throughout and never took enough chances to hold onto his title

Ramirez defintely has the skills and style to give DeGale problems,neither guy will have the southpaw benefit,James might be faster but Gilberto has by far the better engine,he doesnt stop moving

Been following Ramirez for years (since he beat Porky Medina) and must admit that was the most complete I've seen him. As with Smith the big question will be how long he can stay at 168

I'v always thought Abraham is a guy who will get schooled by someone with a good engine and a strong chin. In Germany he gets the benefit of the doubt from the judges for taking long breaks with his gloves up. Ward, Froch and now this lad have been three guys who have schooled him.

Ramirez fought pretty much a perfect fight and was a level above AA. He also hurt him worse in the second round than I've ever seen AA hurt.

I've generally thought of Ramirez as more of a grinder with a high workrate and good engine, but he showed plenty of skill in schooling AA and making him look inept for the most part.

crusader wrote:Ramirez fought pretty much a perfect fight and was a level above AA. He also hurt him worse in the second round than I've ever seen AA hurt.

I've generally thought of Ramirez as more of a grinder with a high workrate and good engine, but he showed plenty of skill in schooling AA and making him look inept for the most part.

Yeah Abraham was defo buzzed but i thought Murray hurt him worse(from memory)

Yes, Ramirez for me is the #1 Super Middleweight based on that display. I think given Froch and Ward no longer boxing (or at Super Middle), I think there is a real toss up for 3 of the 4 champions as to who was #1. As Ramirez out classed Abraham he moves to #1.

Neither DeGale or Jack have put that clinic in world title fights.

stujones wrote:Yes, Ramirez for me is the #1 Super Middleweight based on that display. I think given Froch and Ward no longer boxing (or at Super Middle), I think there is a real toss up for 3 of the 4 champions as to who was #1. As Ramirez out classed Abraham he moves to #1.

Neither DeGale or Jack have put that clinic in world title fights.

Would still take DeGale to shut out AA. Groves as well. He isn't anything special. Tough, tight and makes average fighters look better than they are. His work rate is poor. Always has been.

Stuarty30 wrote:

stujones wrote:Yes, Ramirez for me is the #1 Super Middleweight based on that display. I think given Froch and Ward no longer boxing (or at Super Middle), I think there is a real toss up for 3 of the 4 champions as to who was #1. As Ramirez out classed Abraham he moves to #1.

Neither DeGale or Jack have put that clinic in world title fights.

Would still take DeGale to shut out AA. Groves as well. He isn't anything special. Tough, tight and makes average fighters look better than they are. His work rate is poor. Always has been.

groves??.....jesus, what are you drinking mate? groves is a busted flush. good fight between him and AA now but i think somewhere over the 12 AA lands clean and groves is licking the canvas or having his leg behind his head......again!!

rhino222 wrote:

Stuarty30 wrote:

stujones wrote:Yes, Ramirez for me is the #1 Super Middleweight based on that display. I think given Froch and Ward no longer boxing (or at Super Middle), I think there is a real toss up for 3 of the 4 champions as to who was #1. As Ramirez out classed Abraham he moves to #1.

Neither DeGale or Jack have put that clinic in world title fights.

Would still take DeGale to shut out AA. Groves as well. He isn't anything special. Tough, tight and makes average fighters look better than they are. His work rate is poor. Always has been.

groves??.....jesus, what are you drinking mate? groves is a busted flush. good fight between him and AA now but i think somewhere over the 12 AA lands clean and groves is licking the canvas or having his leg behind his head......again!!

Obviously it's a possibility but it's a fight I see Groves coasting. Far better boxer. If he doesn't get sucked in then he wins with ease IMO.

Stuarty30 wrote:

stujones wrote:Yes, Ramirez for me is the #1 Super Middleweight based on that display. I think given Froch and Ward no longer boxing (or at Super Middle), I think there is a real toss up for 3 of the 4 champions as to who was #1. As Ramirez out classed Abraham he moves to #1.

Neither DeGale or Jack have put that clinic in world title fights.

Would still take DeGale to shut out AA. Groves as well. He isn't anything special. Tough, tight and makes average fighters look better than they are. His work rate is poor. Always has been.

I'm still not sold on DeGale's own work rate. Remember Dirrell got the better of the second half of their fight (and Dirrell's own work rate / stamina at the end of the fight has been questioned). Bute also, not exactly known for his stamina and is now in his mid 30s.

I agree, he makes average fighters (although being pedantic, depends on your definition of average) better than they are.... but somehow, the good fighters (maybe not the very best but solid top tenners) somehow cannot get the W - when you expect them too.... e.g. Taylor, Steiglitz, Murray etc. He's been a champion now for 10 years.

He definitely has an issue with travelling though. He fights terrible away from Germany - remembering the Froch fight was in Helsinki

Still surprised Abraham agreed to fight in the US as I can't see huge money on the table for Saturday's fight.

Ramirez looks a good fighter and that's by far the most polished he's performed so far. Finally SM is turning into a good division again.