BoxRec

Do you think they both have similarities when they both got hit on the chin? Or is it because they have the same physique that it just looks as if they are the same?

Bruno had a decent chin in my opinion obviously he went a bit skewiff when tagged but chin for chin who is better Bruno or AJ?

I almost felt that the fight last night was going to pan out like Bruno v Witherspoon

Both are manufactured boxers but Bruno had the more solid fundamentals. Bruno could jab with anyone - including Lennox Lewis - while AJ could only bounce around cluelessly in front of Klitschko, and leap in with the same hail marys which admittedly did pay off (eventually). There's a gulf in basics between the two, and it looks now like Bruno was as expected the heavier puncher.

In Witherspoon he was boxing a well-rounded Philly fighter in his prime and with a wide variety of power punches, almost always delivered in combinations. Very different proposition to a 41 year old European-style methodical boxer like Klit.

Wonder what would have been going through AJ's head in 6, 7, 8, 9 had it been a 15 round fight, as Bruno/Spoon was scheduled for!

Tuan_Jim wrote:Both are manufactured boxers but Bruno had the more solid fundamentals. Bruno could jab with anyone - including Lennox Lewis - while AJ could only bounce around cluelessly in front of Klitschko, and leap in with the same hail marys which admittedly did pay off (eventually). There's a gulf in basics between the two, and it looks now like Bruno was as expected the heavier puncher.

In Witherspoon he was boxing a well-rounded Philly fighter in his prime and with a wide variety of power punches, almost always delivered in combinations. Very different proposition to a 41 year old European-style methodical boxer like Klit.

Wonder what would have been going through AJ's head in 6, 7, 8, 9 had it been a 15 round fight, as Bruno/Spoon was scheduled for!

What's a "manufactured boxer"?

Taansend wrote:

Tuan_Jim wrote:Both are manufactured boxers but Bruno had the more solid fundamentals. Bruno could jab with anyone - including Lennox Lewis - while AJ could only bounce around cluelessly in front of Klitschko, and leap in with the same hail marys which admittedly did pay off (eventually). There's a gulf in basics between the two, and it looks now like Bruno was as expected the heavier puncher.

In Witherspoon he was boxing a well-rounded Philly fighter in his prime and with a wide variety of power punches, almost always delivered in combinations. Very different proposition to a 41 year old European-style methodical boxer like Klit.

Wonder what would have been going through AJ's head in 6, 7, 8, 9 had it been a 15 round fight, as Bruno/Spoon was scheduled for!

What's a "manufactured boxer"?

You're not so new to boxing that you've never heard the expression, so to ask it means any conversation with you is going to be pointless. Excuse me while I reach for the block, or "tedium-reflector", button.

There are definite similarities mainly due to the physique influencing fighting style.

I think Joshua clearly has more power and is probably more durable but last night both raised and answered some questions.

The problem is that the depth in the division is far less than in Bruno's time. Bruno would have been a player in this era. I still think Joshua is a better version though.

Taansend wrote:

Tuan_Jim wrote:Both are manufactured boxers but Bruno had the more solid fundamentals. Bruno could jab with anyone - including Lennox Lewis - while AJ could only bounce around cluelessly in front of Klitschko, and leap in with the same hail marys which admittedly did pay off (eventually). There's a gulf in basics between the two, and it looks now like Bruno was as expected the heavier puncher.

In Witherspoon he was boxing a well-rounded Philly fighter in his prime and with a wide variety of power punches, almost always delivered in combinations. Very different proposition to a 41 year old European-style methodical boxer like Klit.

Wonder what would have been going through AJ's head in 6, 7, 8, 9 had it been a 15 round fight, as Bruno/Spoon was scheduled for!

What's a "manufactured boxer"?

Someone who doesn't have the natural skills of a Tyson Fury or a Billy Joe, someone who has the physique and power that can be moulded into a fighter. Thats my take on it . .

Tuan_Jim wrote:

Taansend wrote:

Tuan_Jim wrote:Both are manufactured boxers but Bruno had the more solid fundamentals. Bruno could jab with anyone - including Lennox Lewis - while AJ could only bounce around cluelessly in front of Klitschko, and leap in with the same hail marys which admittedly did pay off (eventually). There's a gulf in basics between the two, and it looks now like Bruno was as expected the heavier puncher.

In Witherspoon he was boxing a well-rounded Philly fighter in his prime and with a wide variety of power punches, almost always delivered in combinations. Very different proposition to a 41 year old European-style methodical boxer like Klit.

Wonder what would have been going through AJ's head in 6, 7, 8, 9 had it been a 15 round fight, as Bruno/Spoon was scheduled for!

What's a "manufactured boxer"?

You're not so new to boxing that you've never heard the expression, so to ask it means any conversation with you is going to be pointless. Excuse me while I reach for the block, or "tedium-reflector", button.

In your opinion, what is a "manufactured boxer"?

Not after a row or trading petty insults. Just asking a question.

You used the phrase so you should have an idea.

What does that phrase mean?

Jackson328 wrote:

Taansend wrote:

Tuan_Jim wrote:Both are manufactured boxers but Bruno had the more solid fundamentals. Bruno could jab with anyone - including Lennox Lewis - while AJ could only bounce around cluelessly in front of Klitschko, and leap in with the same hail marys which admittedly did pay off (eventually). There's a gulf in basics between the two, and it looks now like Bruno was as expected the heavier puncher.

In Witherspoon he was boxing a well-rounded Philly fighter in his prime and with a wide variety of power punches, almost always delivered in combinations. Very different proposition to a 41 year old European-style methodical boxer like Klit.

Wonder what would have been going through AJ's head in 6, 7, 8, 9 had it been a 15 round fight, as Bruno/Spoon was scheduled for!

What's a "manufactured boxer"?

Someone who doesn't have the natural skills of a Tyson Fury or a Billy Joe, someone who has the physique and power that can be moulded into a fighter. Thats my take on it . .

Cheers

So you're either a natural boxer or a manufactured boxer?

Or neither like I was

One major difference between the two is how they react under pressure.

If Bruno was in there last night, he would have been TKOd long before round 11.

Bruno could not react under pressure & would just freeze, get lit up like a Christmas tree, then the referee would have to save him.

Bruno probably had a better chin, as you had to really bang to knock him off his feet, but he definitely could not have come back from adversity the way Joshua did last night.

Tuan_Jim wrote:Both are manufactured boxers but Bruno had the more solid fundamentals. Bruno could jab with anyone - including Lennox Lewis - while AJ could only bounce around cluelessly in front of Klitschko, and leap in with the same hail marys which admittedly did pay off (eventually). There's a gulf in basics between the two, and it looks now like Bruno was as expected the heavier puncher.

In Witherspoon he was boxing a well-rounded Philly fighter in his prime and with a wide variety of power punches, almost always delivered in combinations. Very different proposition to a 41 year old European-style methodical boxer like Klit.

Wonder what would have been going through AJ's head in 6, 7, 8, 9 had it been a 15 round fight, as Bruno/Spoon was scheduled for!

i agree, but do i'd say Bruno's jab improved a lot throughout his career and its an area Joshua could make huge strides in. I also think if Joshua can lose 10lbs he can be more affective over distance.

I said in another thread this morning that I told my lad at the end of the 6th round last night that AJ looked like Bruno after being tagged heavily. Glazed eyes and legs heavy, no coordination etc but at least Joshua dug deep and found a way to come back. There is a feeling that Wlad let him off the hook but AJ had already landed big and maybe thats what deterred Klitschko from going for the finish? Definite similarities though between Joshua and Bruno. In fairness to Joshua he was a late starter in the sport and has had to learn on the run, the timescale from starting out to winning Olympic gold is startling and the same with unifying heavyweight titles in his 19th fight! He is still learning and therefore still beatable and vulnerable at this point of his career. I bet Tyson Fury must rue going off the rails when he did because now would have been a great time to get AJ in the ring, he can only improve from here I reckon

Jackson328 wrote:

Taansend wrote:

Tuan_Jim wrote:Both are manufactured boxers but Bruno had the more solid fundamentals. Bruno could jab with anyone - including Lennox Lewis - while AJ could only bounce around cluelessly in front of Klitschko, and leap in with the same hail marys which admittedly did pay off (eventually). There's a gulf in basics between the two, and it looks now like Bruno was as expected the heavier puncher.

In Witherspoon he was boxing a well-rounded Philly fighter in his prime and with a wide variety of power punches, almost always delivered in combinations. Very different proposition to a 41 year old European-style methodical boxer like Klit.

Wonder what would have been going through AJ's head in 6, 7, 8, 9 had it been a 15 round fight, as Bruno/Spoon was scheduled for!

What's a "manufactured boxer"?

Someone who doesn't have the natural skills of a Tyson Fury or a Billy Joe, someone who has the physique and power that can be moulded into a fighter. Thats my take on it . .

Yeah, I'd think of someone like Seth Mitchell. Hard to think of an gold medal Olympian as simply manufactured for me, though.

Taansend wrote:

Jackson328 wrote:

Taansend wrote:
What's a "manufactured boxer"?

Someone who doesn't have the natural skills of a Tyson Fury or a Billy Joe, someone who has the physique and power that can be moulded into a fighter. Thats my take on it . .

Cheers

So you're either a natural boxer or a manufactured boxer?

Or neither like I was

Same here, I retired after 3 novice bouts when I realised that I just wasn't very good at punching people!

Still love to watch the experts though

Jackson328 wrote:I said in another thread this morning that I told my lad at the end of the 6th round last night that AJ looked like Bruno after being tagged heavily. Glazed eyes and legs heavy, no coordination etc but at least Joshua dug deep and found a way to come back. There is a feeling that Wlad let him off the hook but AJ had already landed big and maybe thats what deterred Klitschko from going for the finish? Definite similarities though between Joshua and Bruno. In fairness to Joshua he was a late starter in the sport and has had to learn on the run, the timescale from starting out to winning Olympic gold is startling and the same with unifying heavyweight titles in his 19th fight! He is still learning and therefore still beatable and vulnerable at this point of his career. I bet Tyson Fury must rue going off the rails when he did because now would have been a great time to get AJ in the ring, he can only improve from here I reckon

Also Klit had been tagged the same round he caught Joshua and was tired himself, i think that contributed hugely to him not being able to stop Joshua. If Klit had caught him in that same round without having taking a few the same round, then i honestly think Wlad would have had the energy to stop him. But..if my aunt had balls etc..

Syntax Error wrote:One major difference between the two is how they react under pressure.

If Bruno was in there last night, he would have been TKOd long before round 11.

Bruno could not react under pressure & would just freeze, get lit up like a Christmas tree, then the referee would have to save him.

Bruno probably had a better chin, as you had to really bang to knock him off his feet, but he definitely could not have come back from adversity the way Joshua did last night.

Great analogy that is. Bruno just didn't have that vicious streak in him, he was a lovable guy in a bad guys sport but he was a (manufactured) boxer not a fighter., he showed that when he famously wobbled Tyson with that left hook but didn't have the instinct to jump on Iron Mike. Aside from the humble persona I think Joshua has a bit more of a nasty streak and actually enjoys hurting people in there which bodes well for him. I think Frank had a much better jab too, one of the best in the business during his era in fact.

Jackson328 wrote:

Syntax Error wrote:One major difference between the two is how they react under pressure.

If Bruno was in there last night, he would have been TKOd long before round 11.

Bruno could not react under pressure & would just freeze, get lit up like a Christmas tree, then the referee would have to save him.

Bruno probably had a better chin, as you had to really bang to knock him off his feet, but he definitely could not have come back from adversity the way Joshua did last night.

Great analogy that is. Bruno just didn't have that vicious streak in him, he was a lovable guy in a bad guys sport but he was a (manufactured) boxer not a fighter., he showed that when he famously wobbled Tyson with that left hook but didn't have the instinct to jump on Iron Mike. Aside from the humble persona I think Joshua has a bit more of a nasty streak and actually enjoys hurting people in there which bodes well for him. I think Frank had a much better jab too, one of the best in the business during his era in fact.

So Joshua isn't manufactured then

After last night, although there are similarities, Joshua is far superior in many ways. And that includes his chin and reaction when tagged.

Most interestingly, Josh got a really good second wind, whereas when Bruno was gassed, he stayed that way.

Taansend wrote:

Jackson328 wrote:

Syntax Error wrote:One major difference between the two is how they react under pressure.

If Bruno was in there last night, he would have been TKOd long before round 11.

Bruno could not react under pressure & would just freeze, get lit up like a Christmas tree, then the referee would have to save him.

Bruno probably had a better chin, as you had to really bang to knock him off his feet, but he definitely could not have come back from adversity the way Joshua did last night.

Great analogy that is. Bruno just didn't have that vicious streak in him, he was a lovable guy in a bad guys sport but he was a (manufactured) boxer not a fighter., he showed that when he famously wobbled Tyson with that left hook but didn't have the instinct to jump on Iron Mike. Aside from the humble persona I think Joshua has a bit more of a nasty streak and actually enjoys hurting people in there which bodes well for him. I think Frank had a much better jab too, one of the best in the business during his era in fact.

So Joshua isn't manufactured then

I think he is to an extent but he just seems to have that harder edge to his character and a resolve that Bruno didn't. As Syntax Error said, Bruno would have got stopped last night as soon as Wlad started landing, he would have frozen under the lights and stiffened up. Joshua looked hurt and shaken but he found that determination and spite to not be the victim and he'll get tougher still at the level he's now operating in.

boxingknockout wrote:After last night, although there are similarities, Joshua is far superior in many ways. And that includes his chin and reaction when tagged.

Most interestingly, Josh got a really good second wind, whereas when Bruno was gassed, he stayed that way.

Thats what most impressed me about AJ last night, I honestly thought he was totally gone after the 6th but he dug in and after a few quiet rounds he came out in the 11th with a real spring in his step and Wlad was overwhelmed

All good points.

I would add that Joshua showed he carries his power into the later rounds, which not all big punchers do (I don't think Bruno did though I may be wrong). Together with his second wind (albeit it took a long time to come) that bodes very well.

Manufactured boxer? Not sure I agree he is, but I understand the meaning.

Can't manufacture fighters though. Joshua is 100% a fighter no doubt at all.

Bruno's boxing basics and fundamentals are far better than Joshuas, I agree on that

Wlad boxed out of his skin last night, great performance, but he seemed to lack what he needed to stay on Joshua and get him out of there which I easily think he could of done, but then, if my Aunt had balls..

Joshua clearly shown that he has some good recovery skills, but over a long period of time imo, it takes him a while to get back to normal after being tagged

Same in the Whyte fight, took Joshua a couple of rnds to straighten himself back out

If Joshua fights someone who will stick on him like a shark that smells blood after he gets hit then Joshua will be well and truly done for imo

I know the same could be said for anyone but from the past 2 times I've seen Joshua take a big hit it takes him a while to straighten himself out imo and that is going to cost him one day

dookus wrote:All good points.

I would add that Joshua showed he carries his power into the later rounds, which not all big punchers do (I don't think Bruno did though I may be wrong). Together with his second wind (albeit it took a long time to come) that bodes very well.

Exactly. Joshua has been in two wars in which he found a way back after a big wobble and after exhaustion. Finishing strong after being in difficulty is good especially for a massive guy.

For all Bruno's "solid basics" he never found a way back after fading in a fight.

lillywhite14 wrote:Manufactured boxer? Not sure I agree he is, but I understand the meaning.

Can't manufacture fighters though. Joshua is 100% a fighter no doubt at all.

My point exactly.

Both similar. Pretty sure bruno did once come back after looking out of it against jumbo cummings and held on against mcall. Joshua probably the power advantage...more explosive than frank.
More fight in him.


Suffer the same type of thing tho. When bruno got tagged he shut down mentally. His brain went. Joshua doesnt suffer from that what he does suffer from tho is when he gets tagged he shuts down physically. Hes mentally better than frank with a punch. But he does physically shut down...for too long. His incredible fitness is seeing him through to give him his second wind. But its a matter of time before he gets knocked out. Because it takes him too long to recuperate. Hes actually got a bit lucky in that klitchko was that bit too old to capitalise and dillon whyte buckled his shoulder as he was going in for the kill. Plus his size helps him. But its a big weakness they cant do much to fix. I say it comes back to haunt him in the future.

That was tremendous heart last nite tho from him.

Autobarn wrote:

dookus wrote:All good points.

I would add that Joshua showed he carries his power into the later rounds, which not all big punchers do (I don't think Bruno did though I may be wrong). Together with his second wind (albeit it took a long time to come) that bodes very well.

Exactly. Joshua has been in two wars in which he found a way back after a big wobble and after exhaustion. Finishing strong after being in difficulty is good especially for a massive guy.

For all Bruno's "solid basics" he never found a way back after fading in a fight.

He only faded against Tim Witherspoon - who is a step up from Whyte and a 41 year old Klitschko. McCall he lasted and Bonecrusher he was still strong in the 10th - till getting blasted by a guy with savage power.