BoxRec

Our FINAL thread in the series, following the success of the Heavyweight, Light Heavyweight, Middleweight, Welterweight, Lightweight, Featherweight, Bantamweight and Flyweight threads...

This is a game which will be decided by the wisdom of the crowd.

Each of us has our own opinions on who was better than who, or which achievement was greater than others.
But let's bring it all together and allow simple mathematics to decide it all.

The game is this, each poster names and ranks his final 26 boxers of all time and with each selection comes a point.

Posters are NOT allowed to edit their posts or change their minds as it will effect the overall accumulated points for each fighter.

So, through the original eight weight divisions - we extract our top ten from each of the threads and we include the fighters in our all-time top 100 discussion.
This creates a lit of seventy four fighters, but we are still 26 places short of our top 100.

So our members are asked to name their 26 fighters (not on this list) and each of them will be given a point for every mention they receive.

I will keep a track of the total scoring each time I'm online. This game has a 30-day deadline, after 30 days - the final points totals will be decided.
Our deadline day will be June 1st.

10 Posters declared:
Ambling Alp II
crl333
HyacinthusTurnipseed
elmersalsa
SaadOffTheDeck
Ezzard
Seamus
APerno
Give up
BroughtonRulesRefuge


CURRENT Scoreboard: (10 Members have voted)

10 pts Julio Cesar Chavez

9 pts Marco Antonio Barrera

8 pts Jimmy McLarnin
8 pts Manny Pacquaio

7 pts Nino Benvenuti
7 pts Roy Jones Jr
7 pts Jake LaMotta
7 pts Ted Kid Lewis
7 pts Azumah Nelson

6 pts Wilfredo Gomez
6 pts Packey McFarland
6 pts Aaron Pryor
6 pts Dick Tiger
6 pts Mike Tyson

5 pts Carmen Basilio
5 pts Wilfred Benitez
5 pts Marcel Cerdan
5 pts Tiger Flowers
5 pts James J Jeffries
5 pts Erik Morales
5 pts Tommy Ryan

4 pts Jimmy Barry
4 pts Joe Brown
4 pts Khaosai Galaxy
4 pts Tommy Gibbons
4 pts Beau Jack
4 pts Harold Johnson
4 pts Sonny Liston
4 pts Juan Manuel Marquez
4 pts Luis Manuel Rodriguez
4 pts Maxie Rosenbloom
4 pts Barbadoes Joe Walcott
4 pts Holman Williams

3 pts Jack Kid Berg
3 pts Jimmy Bivins
3 pts Oscar De La Hoya
3 pts Jim Driscoll
3 pts Mike Gibbons
3 pts Peter Jackson
3 pts John Henry Lewis
3 pts Ricardo Lopez
3 pts Vicente Saldivar

2 pts Joe Calzaghe
2 pts Freddie Steele
2 pts John L Sullivan
2 pts Freddie Welsh

*All fighters who have achieved just a single vote are beneath the notice of this scoreboard*

The following 74 fighters have reached a top 10 in (at least) one of our threads and so qualifies for our top 100.
I have included the weight class(es) that the fighter qualified by.
(list in alphabetical order)

Ali, Muhammad (HW)
Ambers, Lou (LW)
Arguello, Alexis (FW)
Armstrong, Henry (FW, LW, WW)
Attell, Abe (FW)

Britton, Jack (WW)
Brown, Newsboy (FLW)
Brown, Panama Al (BW)
Burley, Charley (MW)

Canizales, Orlando (BW)
Canto, Miguel (FLW)
Canzoneri, Tony (LW)
Charles, Ezzard (LHW)
Chocolate, Kid (FW)
Conn, Billy (LHW)

Dempsey, Jack (HW)
Dixon, George (BW)
Duran, Roberto (LW)

Fitzsimmons, Bob (LHW, MW)
Foreman, George (HW)
Foster, Bob (LHW)
Frazier, Joe (HW)

Gans, Joe (LW)
Gavilan, Kid (WW)
Genaro, Frankie (FLW)
Greb, Harry (LHW, MW)
Griffith, Emile (WW)

Hagler, Marvin (MW)
Harada, Fighting (BW)
Hearns, Thomas (WW)
Herman, Pete (BW)
Herrera, Rafael (BW)
Holmes, Larry (HW)
Holyfield, Evander (HW)
Hopkins, Bernard (MW)

Jofre, Eder (BW)
Johnson, Jack (HW)

Kane, Peter (FLW)
Ketchel, Stanley (MW)
Kilbane, Johnny (FW)

LaBarba, Fidel (FLW)
Langford, Sam (LHW, MW)
Leonard, Benny (LW)
Leonard, Sugar Ray (WW)
Lewis, Lennox (HW)
Loughran, Tommy (LHW)
Louis, Joe (HW)
Lynch, Benny (FLW)

Marciano, Rocky (HW)
Mayweather Jr, Floyd (WW)
McGovern, Terry (BW)
Miller, Freddie (FW)
Monzon, Carlos (MW)
Moore, Archie (LHW)

Napoles, Jose (WW)

Olivares, Ruben (BW)
Ortiz, Carlos (LW)
Ortiz, Manuel (BW)

Pedroza, Eusebio (FW)
Pep, Willie (FW)
Perez Pascual (FLW)

Robinson, Sugar Ray (MW, WW)
Ross, Barney (WW, LW)

Saddler, Sandy (FW)
Sanchez, Salvador (FW)
Spinks, Michael (LHW)

Tunney, Gene (LHW)

Villa, Pancho (FLW)

Walker, Mickey (MW)
Whitaker, Pernell (LW)
Wilde, Jimmy (FLW)
Williams, Ike (LW)
Wonjongkam, Pongsaklek (FLW)

Zarate, Carlos (BW)

I'm looking forward to posting my 26 names... I'll definitely be including Wilfredo Gomez - think that he's a certainty to get in.
And looking at the Super Middles - I'll be giving a point each to Joe Calzaghe and Carl Froch.

If I'm being honest, there's not that many Cruiserweights that I would consider to be great boxers, so I'll probably ignore most of the better ones.

Thanks for this, Crease. I'm finding it difficult because it's not divided into weight classes but will try to get my names in...

Crease wrote:I'm looking forward to posting my 26 names... I'll definitely be including Wilfredo Gomez - think that he's a certainty to get in.
And looking at the Super Middles - I'll be giving a point each to Joe Calzaghe and Carl Froch.

If I'm being honest, there's not that many Cruiserweights that I would consider to be great boxers, so I'll probably ignore most of the better ones.

I got to see Wilfredo Gomez fight (Mario Gonzalez KO6) at the Miami Beach Convention Center, back in '88. It was quite the treat' - I got to sit close. It was his first fight after losing the (WBA) title, so tickets prices weren't through the roof; we popped $50 each to sit ringside; worth it.

This is going to be bloody difficult

Here's the names that landed just outside the top 10 in the 8 weight classes.
Obviouly doesn't cover the in between weight classes

Heavy
11th - 34 pts Sonny Liston
12th - 29 pts Mike Tyson
13th - 18 pts Wladimir Klitschko
14th - 15 pts Gene Tunney
15th - 12 pts James J Jeffries
16th - 11 pts Vitali Klitschko
17th - 07 pts Sam Langford
18th - 06 pts John L Sullivan
19th - 03 pts Riddick Bowe
Tied 20th - 01 pt Ezzard Charles
Tied 20th - 01 pt Peter Jackson

Lightheavy
11th - 43 pts Roy Jones Jr
12th - 30 pts Maxie Rosenbloom
13th - 28 pts Harold Johnson
14th - 21 pts Tommy Gibbons
Tied 15th - 10 pts Jimmy Bivins
Tied 15th - 10 pts Sergey Kovalev
16th - 09 pts John Henry Lewis
18th - 04 pts Mike Gibbons
Tied 19th - 03 pts Georges Carpentier
Tied 19th - 03 pts Matthew Saad Muhammad
Tied 19th - 03 pts Joey Maxim
Tied 19th - 03 pts Andre Ward

Middle
Tied 11th - 25 pts Roy Jones Jr
Tied 11th - 25 pts Dick Tiger
Tied 11th - 25 pts Gennady Golovkin
14th - 22 pts Jake LaMotta
15th - 21 pts Tiger Flowers
16th - 15 pts Mike Gibbons
17th - 13 pts Nino Benvenuti
Tied 18th - 12 pts James Toney
Tied 18th - 12 pts Tommy Ryan
20th - 9 pts Freddie Steele

Welter
11th - 37 pts Jimmy McLarnin
12th - 20 pts Barbados Joe Walcott
13th - 18 pts Ted Kid Lewis
Tied 14th - 16 pts Luis Manuel Rodriguez
Tied 14th - 16 pts Carmen Basilio
Tied 14th - 16 pts Manny Pacquaio
17th - 13 pts Roberto Duran
18th - 11 pts Pernell Whitaker
19th - 07 pts Aaron Pryor
Tied 20th - 06 pts Don Curry
Tied 20th - 06 pts Mickey Walker
Tied 20th - 06 pts Antonio Margarito

Light
11th - 21 pts Joe Brown
12th - 20 pts Packey McFarland
13th - 16 pts Julio Cesar Chavez
14th - 12 pts Manny Pacquaio
15th - 11 pts Freddie Welsh
16th - 9 pts Shane Mosley
17th - 8 pts Edwin Valero
18th - 7 pts Esteban DeJesus
Tied 19th - 5 pts Juan Manuel Marquez
Tied 19th - 5 pts Alexis Arguello

Feather
11th - 27 pts George Dixon
12th - 24 pts Marco Antonio Barrera
13th - 21 pts Vicente Saldivar
14th - 19 pts Naseem Hamed
15th - 18 pts Terry McGovern
16th - 16 pts Azumah Nelson
17th - 10 pts Manny Pacquaio
18th - 8 pts Tony Canzoneri
19th - 6 pts Jim Driscoll
20th - 4 pts Erik Morales

Bantam
12th - 17 pts Veeraphol Sahaprom
13th - 12 pts Jeff Chandler11 pts Rafael Marquez
14th - 11 pts Rafael Marquez
15th - 10 pts Jimmy Barry
16th - 9 pts Khaosai Galaxy
17th - 6 pts Kid Williams
18th - 5 pts Chucho Castillo
Tied 19th - 4 pts Rodolfo Martinez
Tied 19th - 4 pts Joe Lynch

Fly
Tied 11th - 16 pts Santos Laciar
Tied 11th - 16 pts Jimmy Barry
13th - 14 pts Pone Kingpetch
14th - 13 pts Venice Borkhorsor
15th - 12 pts Horacio Accavallo
16th - 9 pts Betulio Gonzalez
Tied 17th - 8 pts Midget Wolgast
Tied 17th - 8 pts Masao Ohba
19th - 6 pts Ricardo Lopez

There are fighters I never listed who I would rate higher overall then a few of the ones I did select, and this would be on the basis of what they did over more than one weight class.

Seamus wrote:There are fighters I never listed who I would rate higher overall then a few of the ones I did select, and this would be on the basis of what they did over more than one weight class.

Same, I'll keep tabs on it but this one is a bit too much work for me. Even the division ratings I know aren't accurate without a lot of research.

Guys like Packey McFarland, Sam Langford, and Jimmy Barry are hard to rate in one weight class. But, they were fighting in different weight classes that it's hard to rate them specifically in one class.

Peter Jackson, to me, is a top 100 ATG pound per pound boxer. I studied his record and career and he was very impressive. We should have a look at this guy.

Also, the great Manny Pacquiao is kind of hard to rate him in a weight class specifically.

OK, I will give this a shot. My 26 are:

Marco Antonio Barrera
Wilfred Benitez
Nino Benvenuti
Jack Kid Berg
Riddick Bowe
Marcel Cerdan
Julio Cesar Chavez
Oscar De La Hoya
Wilfredo Gomez
Beau Jack
James J. Jeffries
Harold Johnson
Roy Jones Jr.
Jake LaMotta
Sonny Liston
Jimmy McLarnin
Bob Montgomery
Erik Morales
Shane Mosely
Azumah Nelson
Manny Pacquiao
Aaron Pryor
Luis Rodrigues
Vincente Saldivar
Dick Tiger
Mike Tyson

Obviously there are going to be some tough calls. Several great fighters that I had to leave out.

I would hope that Benitez, Pacquiao, Chavez, and McLarnin would be obvious choices. They probably could be in the Top 50 all time, not just the top 100.

Duran on both lists ? - H. Camacho didn't make it to the second tier?

Crease wrote:I'm looking forward to posting my 26 names... I'll definitely be including Wilfredo Gomez - think that he's a certainty to get in.
And looking at the Super Middles - I'll be giving a point each to Joe Calzaghe and Carl Froch.

If I'm being honest, there's not that many Cruiserweights that I would consider to be great boxers, so I'll probably ignore most of the better ones.

OK - I recognize my error regarding the double posting of Duran (LW & WW) - but there are several names on both lists, should I vote for Terry McGovern and have him in the top 100 as both a BW and FW - same with Duran, Alexis Arguello, ETC. Please advise - ????

1. M.A.Barrera
2. Jimmy Barry
3. Wilfredo Benitez
4. Joe Brown
5. Marcel Cerdan
6. J.C.Chavez
7. Oscar De la Hoya
8. NP Jack Dempsey
9. Jim Driscoll
10. Tiger Flowers
11. Khaosai Galaxy
12. Wilfredo Gomez
13. J.J.Jeffries
14. Roy Jones Jr
15. Jake Lamotta
16. Ted Kid Lewis
17. Ricardo Lopez
18. Jimmy McLarnin
19. Charlie Mitchell
20. Erik Morales
21. Battling Nelson
22. Manny Pacquiao
23. Aaron Pryor
24. Tommy Ryan
25. Mike Tyson
26. Barbados Joe Walcott

Marco Antonio Barrera
Carmen Basilio
Wilfried Benitez
Nino Benvenuti
Jack "Kid" Berg
Eddie Booker
Joe Calzaghe
Julio Cesar Chavez
Khaosai Galaxy
Mike Gibbons

Tommy Gibbons
Wilfredo Gomez
Roy Jones Jr
Cocoa Kid
Jake LaMotta
Ted "Kid" Lewis
Ricardo Lopez
Juan Manuel Marquez
Packey McFarland
Jimmy McLarnin

Eric Morales
Azumah Nelson
Manny Pacquiao
Aaron Pryor
Freddie Welsh
Holman Williams


Holman Williams, the Gibbons bros. along with the obvious Pacquiao, Jones, Chavez and McLarnin were the first names on my list, the rest I whittled down from about 50-60 or so candidates without too much hard science. A shame the likes of Joe Brown, Jimmy Bivins, Harold Johnson, Luis Manuel Rodriguez, Jimmy Barry, Vicente Salvidar etc etc etc have missed out again but I'm pretty happy with that 26.

Here are my top 26 in alphabetical order:

1. Marco Antonio Barrera
2. Carmen Basilio
3. Wilfred Benitez
4. Joe Brown
5. Georges Carpentier
6. Julio Cesar Chavez
7. George Dixon
8. Tiger Flowers
9. Peter Jackson
10. Roy Jones, Jr
11. Jake LaMotta
12. Ted "Kid" Lewis
13. Sam Langford
14. Sonny Liston
15. Ricardo "Finito" Lopez
16. Juan Manuel Marquez
17. Packey McFarland
18. Terry McGovern
19. Jimmy McLarnin
20. Manny Pacquiao
21. Luis Manuel Rodriguez
22. Maxie Rosenbloom
23. Vicente Saldivar
24. Dick Tiger
25. Mike Tyson
26. Barbados Joe Walcott

elmersalsa wrote:Here are my top 26 in alphabetical order:

1. Marco Antonio Barrera
2. Carmen Basilio
3. Wilfred Benitez
4. Joe Brown
5. Georges Carpentier
6. Julio Cesar Chavez
7. George Dixon
8. Tiger Flowers
9. Peter Jackson
10. Roy Jones, Jr
11. Jake LaMotta
12. Ted "Kid" Lewis
13. Sam Langford
14. Sonny Liston
15. Ricardo "Finito" Lopez
16. Juan Manuel Marquez
17. Packey McFarland
18. Terry McGovern
19. Jimmy McLarnin
20. Manny Pacquiao
21. Luis Manuel Rodriguez
22. Maxie Rosenbloom
23. Vicente Saldivar
24. Dick Tiger
25. Mike Tyson
26. Barbados Joe Walcott

Dixon, Langford and McGovern are already on the list FYI.

I've narrowed it down to 49

I'm not going to look at the rankings again for fear of that list growing

No need to be a sour puss, it's all in fun.

Erik Morales
MAB
JMM
JCC
Holman Williams
RJJ
Rosenbloom
Harold Johnson
Tommy Gibbons
Bivins
JH Lewis
Tiger
Benvenutti
Toney
Ryan
Steele
McClarnin
Laciar
Ted Lewis
Luis Rodriguez
Basilio
Pacquiao
McFarland
Azumah nelson
Wilfredo Gomez
Benitez

HyacinthusTurnipseed wrote:

elmersalsa wrote:Here are my top 26 in alphabetical order:

1. Marco Antonio Barrera
2. Carmen Basilio
3. Wilfred Benitez
4. Joe Brown
5. Georges Carpentier
6. Julio Cesar Chavez
7. George Dixon
8. Tiger Flowers
9. Peter Jackson
10. Roy Jones, Jr
11. Jake LaMotta
12. Ted "Kid" Lewis
13. Sam Langford
14. Sonny Liston
15. Ricardo "Finito" Lopez
16. Juan Manuel Marquez
17. Packey McFarland
18. Terry McGovern
19. Jimmy McLarnin
20. Manny Pacquiao
21. Luis Manuel Rodriguez
22. Maxie Rosenbloom
23. Vicente Saldivar
24. Dick Tiger
25. Mike Tyson
26. Barbados Joe Walcott

Dixon, Langford and McGovern are already on the list FYI.

Let me re-order it:
I will put Holman Williams, Tommy Ryan and Jimmy Barry in and take out Langford, Dixon and McGovern. Thanks.

That is my final vote.

1. M.A.Barrera
2. Jimmy Barry
3. Mike Gibbons
4. Joe Brown
5. Marcel Cerdan
6. J.C.Chavez
7. Tommy Gibbons
8. Harold Johnson
9. Jim Driscoll
10. Tiger Flowers
11. Khaosai Galaxy
12. Wilfredo Gomez
13. J.J.Jeffries
14. Jimmy Bivins
15. Jake Lamotta
16. Ted Kid Lewis
17. Dick Tiger
18. Jimmy McLarnin
19. Nino Benvenuti
20. Vicente Saldivar
21. Jeff Fenech
22. Manny Pacquiao
23. Azumah Nelson
24. Tommy Ryan
25. Luis Rodriguez
26. Barbados Joe Walcott

APerno wrote:OK - I recognize my error regarding the double posting of Duran (LW & WW)

Don't worry about it, there's nothing to apologise for. They were your lists, so you could select anyone you so wished to choose.

APerno wrote:- but there are several names on both lists, should I vote for Terry McGovern and have him in the top 100 as both a BW and FW - same with Duran, Alexis Arguello, ETC. Please advise - ????

Do NOT select any of the above 74 fighters, because they have already made in into our top 100.
Vote for 26 fighters who are not on the top 100 list.

Six Members votes in and our scoreboard looks like this;

Crease wrote:CURRENT Scoreboard: (06 Members have voted)

6 pts Marco Antonio Barrera
6 pts Julio Cesar Chavez
6 pts Jimmy McLarnin
6 pts Manny Pacquaio

5 pts Wilfred Benitez
5 pts Wilfredo Gomez
5 pts Roy Jones Jr
5 pts Jake LaMotta
5 pts Ted Kid Lewis

4 pts Nino Benvenuti
4 pts Erik Morales
4 pts Azumah Nelson
4 pts Luis Manuel Rodriguez
4 pts Tommy Ryan
4 pts Dick Tiger

3 pts Jimmy Barry
3 pts Carmen Basilio
3 pts Joe Brown
3 pts Marcel Cerdan
3 pts Tiger Flowers
3 pts Khaosai Galaxy
3 pts Tommy Gibbons
3 pts James J Jeffries
3 pts Harold Johnson
3 pts Ricardo Lopez
3 pts Juan Manuel Marquez
3 pts Packey McFarland
3 pts Aaron Pryor
3 pts Mike Tyson
3 pts Barbadoes Joe Walcott
3 pts Holman Williams

2 pts Jack Kid Berg
2 pts Jimmy Bivins
2 pts Oscar De La Hoya
2 pts Jim Driscoll
2 pts Mike Gibbons
2 pts Sonny Liston
2 pts Maxie Rosenbloom
2 pts Vicente Saldivar

*All fighters who have only achieved a single vote are beneath the notice of this scoreboard*

15 fighters on 4 pts or more, they a re looking good for getting into the top 100. Still a long way to go yet.

1.Sammy Angott
2.Nino Benvenuti
3.Jack "Kid" Berg
4.Marcel Cerdan
5.Antonio Cervantes
6.Julio Cesar Chavez
7.Young Corbett III
8.Jack Dillon
9.Johnny Dundee
10.Jim Driscoll
11.Khaosai Galaxy
12.Mike Gibbons
13.Tommy Gibbons
14.Wilfredo Gomez
15.Beau Jack
16.John Henry Lewis
17.Ted "Kid" Lewis
18.Sammy Mandell
19.Kid McCoy
20.Packey McFarland
21.Jimmy McLarnin
22.Memphis Pal Moore
23.Azumah Nelson
24.Philadelphia Jack O'Brien
25.Tommy Ryan
26.Holman Williams