BoxRec

Now that Gennady Golovkin isn’t an option for either of them, a Daniel Jacobs-Billy Joe Saunders fight should be an intriguing alternative for both middleweights.

Jacobs (32-2, 29 KOs) is interested and would even travel to England to challenge Saunders (24-0, 12 KOs) in his home country. The former WBA middleweight champion from Brooklyn isn’t convinced that would appeal to the unbeaten WBO middleweight champion.

“If the opportunity comes up where I can fight Saunders, obviously that’s something that I would love to do,” Jacobs told BS.com. “I would even travel over to where he is. That’s how confident I am that I can beat B.J. But he has shown no interest. He has never even been verbal about fighting me. He’s never even mentioned any of my fights in interviews. It’s surprising to me. It’s as if he doesn’t even know I exist. And to see these different things, it’s not looking good for me and him [to fight] because I don’t know if he takes me serious or not.”

Jacobs will root for Khurtsidze to knock off Saunders because they’re stablemates and share the same manager, Keith Connolly. If Saunders wins, however, Jacobs wants the brash British southpaw to fight him.

“He talks a lot of smack,” Jacobs said. “And he’s one of those comical characters in the sport of boxing that throughout the history we have and we entertain and we love. But it’s getting to the point now where it’s too corny. It’s not time for fun and games anymore. Let’s get to the real deal. Are you gonna further your career and fight the best? Or are you gonna play with it? What are you trying to do?”

http://www.BS.com/jacobs-id-fi ... EPs3e.dpuf

Here’s the deal, during January 2016, K2 & Queensbury Promotions initially entered into discussions to orchestrate a bout between Gennady Golovkin and Billy Joe Saunders.

Unfortunately Tom Loeffler’s offer was deemed insufficient, since it was claimed that the WBO world champion was only being guaranteed a payday that was less than $1.5m, which is smaller than the sums paid to David Lemieux and Daniel Jacobs.

Billy Joe Saunders then suffered a hand injury in April 2016.

He was then supposed to gain exposure to the American audience by appearing on the undercard of the Canelo-Smith bout, by facing Gabriel Rosado, with the Brit guaranteed a shot at Alvarez if he emerged victorious. However, the fight fell through due to a contractual dispute between Queensbury Promotions and GBP.

By the time Saunders eventually made his first defence of his WBO title, he had endured a twelve months period of inactivity, so he needed to face an “easier” opponent to rid himself of any ring rust.

Before Golovkin had even faced Daniel Jacobs, K2 & Queensbury Promotions made a second attempt to enter into discussions to arrange a bout between GGG & Billy Joe Saunders, with the fight scheduled to take place on the 10th June.

Fwank Warren actually paid Avtandil Khurtsidze a six-figure step-aside fee and had to also provided firm commitment to the Georgian that he would participate in a bout for the interim WBO title against Tommy Langford.

Fwank Warren only did this, because the financial terms of the GGG-Saunders fight contract had been agreed by all parties and there was an expectation that there Billy Joe would face Golovkin on the 10th June.

Unfortunately for the Brit though, GGG declined the bout, preferring to wait on the side-lines, due to K2’s reluctance to risk losing the September 16th Canelo super-fight. Simply put: Gennady "lost his pen".

After all the time-wasting caused by Tom Loeffler, as well as GGG’s indecision, coupled with the significant financial outlay to Fwank Warren's company… Billy Joe Saunders is now contractually-obliged to face Avtandil Khurtsidze on the 8th July. And if he manages to successfully defend his title for the second time, he will be in line to face the winner of the Canelo-GGG super-fight.

Therefore, at what point in time was Billy Joe Saunders supposed to call-out Danny Jacobs... and why would he even bother to do so?

Boxrec needs a resident editor emeritus.

verlichte wrote:
Fwank Warren only did this, because the financial terms of the GGG-Saunders fight contract had been agreed by all parties and there was an expectation that there Billy Joe would face Golovkin on the 10th June.

Unfortunately for the Brit though, GGG declined the bout, preferring to wait on the side-lines, due to K2’s reluctance to risk losing the September 16th Canelo super-fight. Simply put: Gennady "lost his pen".

He used that same pen and signed the contract with Canelo.

Jacobs is quality IMO, can't see them ever taking this fight, they will be holding out for Canelo/GGG in the future I think.

Why not call him out on social media ? Grab that WBO belt then rematch Golovkin.

verlichte wrote:Here’s the deal, during January 2016, K2 & Queensbury Promotions initially entered into discussions to orchestrate a bout between Gennady Golovkin and Billy Joe Saunders.

Unfortunately Tom Loeffler’s offer was deemed insufficient, since it was claimed that the WBO world champion was only being guaranteed a payday that was less than $1.5m, which is smaller than the sums paid to David Lemieux and Daniel Jacobs.

Billy Joe Saunders then suffered a hand injury in April 2016.

He was then supposed to gain exposure to the American audience by appearing on the undercard of the Canelo-Smith bout, by facing Gabriel Rosado, with the Brit guaranteed a shot at Alvarez if he emerged victorious. However, the fight fell through due to a contractual dispute between Queensbury Promotions and GBP.

By the time Saunders eventually made his first defence of his WBO title, he had endured a twelve months period of inactivity, so he needed to face an “easier” opponent to rid himself of any ring rust.

Before Golovkin had even faced Daniel Jacobs, K2 & Queensbury Promotions made a second attempt to enter into discussions to arrange a bout between GGG & Billy Joe Saunders, with the fight scheduled to take place on the 10th June.

Fwank Warren actually paid Avtandil Khurtsidze a six-figure step-aside fee and had to also provided firm commitment to the Georgian that he would participate in a bout for the interim WBO title against Tommy Langford.

Fwank Warren only did this, because the financial terms of the GGG-Saunders fight contract had been agreed by all parties and there was an expectation that there Billy Joe would face Golovkin on the 10th June.

Unfortunately for the Brit though, GGG declined the bout, preferring to wait on the side-lines, due to K2’s reluctance to risk losing the September 16th Canelo super-fight. Simply put: Gennady "lost his pen".

After all the time-wasting caused by Tom Loeffler, as well as GGG’s indecision, coupled with the significant financial outlay to Fwank Warren's company… Billy Joe Saunders is now contractually-obliged to face Avtandil Khurtsidze on the 8th July. And if he manages to successfully defend his title for the second time, he will be in line to face the winner of the Canelo-GGG super-fight.

Therefore, at what point in time was Billy Joe Saunders supposed to call-out Danny Jacobs... and why would he even bother to do so?

The "lost the pen" gag doesn't work EO. Eubank Jr missed the GGG fight and fought a nobody.

GGG on the other hand "missed" the Saunders fight, to get the biggest match up in boxing. GGG vs Canelo.

In a purely speculative point of view I don't think Saunders would beat Jacobs

I'd like to see Jacobs vs Saunders. That'd be the next best Middleweight fight out there while we're waiting for GGG vs Canelo for sure, and the winner would definitely be the #1 guy in line to get the winner.

Jacobs vs David Lemieux works too.

Weren't they talking about fighting a while back?

One person in the poll thinks Saunders is going to win. I guess he's British.

RScarf1 wrote:One person in the poll thinks Saunders is going to win. I guess he's British.

I want this person to stand up.

20 votes to 1 in favor of Jacobs.

Man Jacobs' stock has really risen since the GGG fight. He would've been favored to be Saunders before the GGG fight as well, but I'll bet the poll would've been closer.

RScarf1 wrote:One person in the poll thinks Saunders is going to win. I guess he's British.

I'll bet I could guess who it was. There's one poster on here in particular who thinks a fighter is 10 times better than he actually is if he's British.

Jacobs, Lemieux, BJS, Khurtsidze, Eubank. All good fights.

ElJefe wrote:Jacobs, Lemieux, BJS, Khurtsidze, Eubank. All good fights.

Yep you could mix and match those guys any which way, and you got an interesting matchup.

It's in Saunder's interest to fight Golovkin after he beats Canelo. After GGG beats Canelo, his PPV numbers will automatically go up in his next fight. As a result Saunders makes more money. BJS should be happy.

Been over this in my post and it is very clear who the one person is.

http://boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=211432

This whole 'lost his pen' is a load of crap. It is a very simple narrative that BJS and Fwank Warren use to cover up dodges.

This argument is so easy to dissect it is almost silly to continue talking about it. Lemeiux and Jacobs are better more entertaining fighters, with bigger world wide reps and far more exciting styles. This may explain the bigger offers. However this is completely irrelevant for the following reason,

When has BJS made even half of £1.5 million for a fight? How can it not be enough money when you have never earned a fraction of that in any of your previous fights, because you fight bums.

You really think GGG would not jump at the chance to unify the middleweight division. They just got bored of a nobody at world level trying to call shots and demand more money to fight when he has done nothing, so they moved on to avoid further embarrassment on both parts.

And what about canelo? They wanted him instead of Chavez Jnr. Why didn't he want that fight?

He wont take fights because he will lose at world class as he is literally decent at British level. This is proven from the Eubank and Blackwell fights. Both British fights, both he was v. lucky to win and didn't really show anything particularly special. Especially Blackwell. I actually thought Blackwell won that fight, he was dominating second half of fight. He has been holding out for the mega payday he thought GGG would offer him to unify the division, but they didn't want to play his games. Its simple and makes sense. Action speaks louder than words. BJS actions regarding GGG and Canelo say more then any of his press statements ever could, if you are looking properly.

He dun goofed.

Now no one is interested in him as there are bigger fights with better opposition. He needs to win his mandatory in order to stay relevant. How much do you think BJS is gonna make against Khurtsidze. I can tell you it wont even be half of £1.5 mil. So he is now in a position where if he loses its all over. The big pay day he seemed to be holding out for will never come to fruition if he loses.

Greed and cowardice. So don't worry while jacobs is fighting anyone and entertaining the world with his courage, explosive style and his miracle story and GGG moves on to the canelo mega fight and then maybe onto super middleweight, BJS will be back at British level most likely struggling against the blackwells of the world and probably losing his inevitable rematch against Eubank which will be his only real fight left.

Who will remember BJS as a good british world champion? BJS, thats who.

And btw I am a Brit, so its only a minority who are blinded by nationality.

tonymaccaroni wrote:Been over this in my post and it is very clear who the one person is.

http://boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=211432

This whole 'lost his pen' is a load of crap. It is a very simple narrative that BJS and Fwank Warren use to cover up dodges.

This argument is so easy to dissect it is almost silly to continue talking about it. Lemeiux and Jacobs are better more entertaining fighters, with bigger world wide reps and far more exciting styles. This may explain the bigger offers. However this is completely irrelevant for the following reason,

When has BJS made even half of £1.5 million for a fight? How can it not be enough money when you have never earned a fraction of that in any of your previous fights, because you fight bums.

You really think GGG would not jump at the chance to unify the middleweight division. They just got bored of a nobody at world level trying to call shots and demand more money to fight when he has done nothing, so they moved on to avoid further embarrassment on both parts.

And what about canelo? They wanted him instead of Chavez Jnr. Why didn't he want that fight?

He wont take fights because he will lose at world class as he is literally decent at British level. This is proven from the Eubank and Blackwell fights. Both British fights, both he was v. lucky to win and didn't really show anything particularly special. Especially Blackwell. I actually thought Blackwell won that fight, he was dominating second half of fight. He has been holding out for the mega payday he thought GGG would offer him to unify the division, but they didn't want to play his games. Its simple and makes sense. Action speaks louder than words. BJS actions regarding GGG and Canelo say more then any of his press statements ever could, if you are looking properly.

He dun goofed.

Now no one is interested in him as there are bigger fights with better opposition. He needs to win his mandatory in order to stay relevant. How much do you think BJS is gonna make against Khurtsidze. I can tell you it wont even be half of £1.5 mil. So he is now in a position where if he loses its all over. The big pay day he seemed to be holding out for will never come to fruition if he loses.

Greed and cowardice. So don't worry while jacobs is fighting anyone and entertaining the world with his courage, explosive style and his miracle story and GGG moves on to the canelo mega fight and then maybe onto super middleweight, BJS will be back at British level most likely struggling against the blackwells of the world and probably losing his inevitable rematch against Eubank which will be his only real fight left.

Who will remember BJS as a good british world champion? BJS, thats who.

And btw I am a Brit, so its only a minority who are blinded by nationality.

Are you saying that K2 and Queensberry Promotions had not agreed the financial terms, the venue and the fight date contractual stipulations to orchestrate a bout between Golovkin and Jacobs?

Are you saying that Billy Joe hadn't signed the aforementioned contract?

Are you claiming that Gennady Golovkin, despite making multiple promises to fight on the 10th June, over several months, declined to sign the contract to fight Billy Joe Saunders?

Are you saying that Tom Loeffler hadn't told the media multiple times that Gennady wanted to fight Billy Joe Saunders on the 10th June?

Are you claiming that Billy Joe Saunders didn't publish the text messages received from Tom Loeffler apologising for the late delivery of Golovkin's signed contract?

Please explain to everyone what you believe the facts to be in relation to this matter, because your lack of knowledge suggests that you've only just started following the sport.

verlichte wrote:

tonymaccaroni wrote:Been over this in my post and it is very clear who the one person is.

http://boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=211432

This whole 'lost his pen' is a load of crap. It is a very simple narrative that BJS and Fwank Warren use to cover up dodges.

This argument is so easy to dissect it is almost silly to continue talking about it. Lemeiux and Jacobs are better more entertaining fighters, with bigger world wide reps and far more exciting styles. This may explain the bigger offers. However this is completely irrelevant for the following reason,

When has BJS made even half of £1.5 million for a fight? How can it not be enough money when you have never earned a fraction of that in any of your previous fights, because you fight bums.

You really think GGG would not jump at the chance to unify the middleweight division. They just got bored of a nobody at world level trying to call shots and demand more money to fight when he has done nothing, so they moved on to avoid further embarrassment on both parts.

And what about canelo? They wanted him instead of Chavez Jnr. Why didn't he want that fight?

He wont take fights because he will lose at world class as he is literally decent at British level. This is proven from the Eubank and Blackwell fights. Both British fights, both he was v. lucky to win and didn't really show anything particularly special. Especially Blackwell. I actually thought Blackwell won that fight, he was dominating second half of fight. He has been holding out for the mega payday he thought GGG would offer him to unify the division, but they didn't want to play his games. Its simple and makes sense. Action speaks louder than words. BJS actions regarding GGG and Canelo say more then any of his press statements ever could, if you are looking properly.

He dun goofed.

Now no one is interested in him as there are bigger fights with better opposition. He needs to win his mandatory in order to stay relevant. How much do you think BJS is gonna make against Khurtsidze. I can tell you it wont even be half of £1.5 mil. So he is now in a position where if he loses its all over. The big pay day he seemed to be holding out for will never come to fruition if he loses.

Greed and cowardice. So don't worry while jacobs is fighting anyone and entertaining the world with his courage, explosive style and his miracle story and GGG moves on to the canelo mega fight and then maybe onto super middleweight, BJS will be back at British level most likely struggling against the blackwells of the world and probably losing his inevitable rematch against Eubank which will be his only real fight left.

Who will remember BJS as a good british world champion? BJS, thats who.

And btw I am a Brit, so its only a minority who are blinded by nationality.

Are you saying that K2 and Queensberry Promotions had not agreed the financial terms, the venue and the fight date contractual stipulations to orchestrate a bout between Golovkin and Jacobs?

Are you saying that Billy Joe hadn't signed the aforementioned contract?

Are you claiming that Gennady Golovkin, despite making multiple promises to fight on the 10th June, over several months, declined to sign the contract to fight Billy Joe Saunders?

Are you saying that Tom Loeffler hadn't told the media multiple times that Gennady wanted to fight Billy Joe Saunders on the 10th June?

Are you claiming that Billy Joe Saunders didn't publish the text messages received from Tom Loeffler apologising for the late delivery of Golovkin's signed contract?

Please explain to everyone what you believe the facts to be in relation to this matter, because your lack of knowledge suggests that you've only just been following the sport.

Im just saying that is all BJS's rhetoric as told by him and his team. You have chosen to believe it. I don't.

You said it yourself. He refused first time round as the money wasn't good enough for him..... Even if what you are saying is literally what happened its meaningless. Whatever GGG decides to do after being messed around first time I dont blame him. Happens all the time in the real world, someone messes you around, so you mess them around....

I mean even if everything you state is factually correct and not just press release excuses are you actually saying that Golovkin 'dodged' BJS and his chance to unify the division? With an easy win? I mean if anything if everything you state is true he simply moved on to bigger and better things. My gut is he was pissed with the first refusal and thought this guy is a coward and does not deserve to be in the ring with me so I am gonna mess him around.

What does any of this even matter? You may think you are an expert of the scene and I know nothing, but you seem to think that BJS is on the same level as GGG, Canelo, Jacobs, Lemieux and anyone else who can punch and doesn't run out of steam after 7 rounds.

Thats just fantasy world mate.

Explain what BJS has done in his career to earn more then a £1.5 mil purse? Sorry I just don't buy what your implying.

tonymaccaroni wrote: Im just saying that is all BJS's rhetoric as told by him and his team. You have chosen to believe it. I don't.

You said it yourself. He refused first time round as the money wasn't good enough for him..... Even if what you are saying is literally what happened its meaningless. Whatever GGG decides to do after being messed around first time I dont blame him. Happens all the time in the real world, someone messes you around, so you mess them around....

I mean even if everything you state is factually correct and not just press release excuses are you actually saying that Golovkin 'dodged' BJS and his chance to unify the division? With an easy win? I mean if anything if everything you state is true he simply moved on to bigger and better things. My gut is he was pissed with the first refusal and thought this guy is a coward and does not deserve to be in the ring with me so I am gonna mess him around.

What does any of this even matter? You may think you are an expert of the scene and I know nothing, but you seem to think that BJS is on the same level as GGG, Canelo, Jacobs, Lemieux and anyone else who can punch and doesn't run out of steam after 7 rounds.

Thats just fantasy world mate.

Explain what BJS has done in his career to earn more then a £1.5 mil purse? Sorry I just don't buy what your implying.

fergusg/EO/vershitty believes everything he reads when it aligns with his agenda, but would call people (like Loefler) liars when it doesn't.

tonymaccaroni wrote:

verlichte wrote:

tonymaccaroni wrote:Been over this in my post and it is very clear who the one person is.

http://boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=211432

This whole 'lost his pen' is a load of crap. It is a very simple narrative that BJS and Fwank Warren use to cover up dodges.

This argument is so easy to dissect it is almost silly to continue talking about it. Lemeiux and Jacobs are better more entertaining fighters, with bigger world wide reps and far more exciting styles. This may explain the bigger offers. However this is completely irrelevant for the following reason,

When has BJS made even half of £1.5 million for a fight? How can it not be enough money when you have never earned a fraction of that in any of your previous fights, because you fight bums.

You really think GGG would not jump at the chance to unify the middleweight division. They just got bored of a nobody at world level trying to call shots and demand more money to fight when he has done nothing, so they moved on to avoid further embarrassment on both parts.

And what about canelo? They wanted him instead of Chavez Jnr. Why didn't he want that fight?

He wont take fights because he will lose at world class as he is literally decent at British level. This is proven from the Eubank and Blackwell fights. Both British fights, both he was v. lucky to win and didn't really show anything particularly special. Especially Blackwell. I actually thought Blackwell won that fight, he was dominating second half of fight. He has been holding out for the mega payday he thought GGG would offer him to unify the division, but they didn't want to play his games. Its simple and makes sense. Action speaks louder than words. BJS actions regarding GGG and Canelo say more then any of his press statements ever could, if you are looking properly.

He dun goofed.

Now no one is interested in him as there are bigger fights with better opposition. He needs to win his mandatory in order to stay relevant. How much do you think BJS is gonna make against Khurtsidze. I can tell you it wont even be half of £1.5 mil. So he is now in a position where if he loses its all over. The big pay day he seemed to be holding out for will never come to fruition if he loses.

Greed and cowardice. So don't worry while jacobs is fighting anyone and entertaining the world with his courage, explosive style and his miracle story and GGG moves on to the canelo mega fight and then maybe onto super middleweight, BJS will be back at British level most likely struggling against the blackwells of the world and probably losing his inevitable rematch against Eubank which will be his only real fight left.

Who will remember BJS as a good british world champion? BJS, thats who.

And btw I am a Brit, so its only a minority who are blinded by nationality.

Are you saying that K2 and Queensberry Promotions had not agreed the financial terms, the venue and the fight date contractual stipulations to orchestrate a bout between Golovkin and Jacobs?

Are you saying that Billy Joe hadn't signed the aforementioned contract?

Are you claiming that Gennady Golovkin, despite making multiple promises to fight on the 10th June, over several months, declined to sign the contract to fight Billy Joe Saunders?

Are you saying that Tom Loeffler hadn't told the media multiple times that Gennady wanted to fight Billy Joe Saunders on the 10th June?

Are you claiming that Billy Joe Saunders didn't publish the text messages received from Tom Loeffler apologising for the late delivery of Golovkin's signed contract?

Please explain to everyone what you believe the facts to be in relation to this matter, because your lack of knowledge suggests that you've only just been following the sport.

Im just saying that is all BJS's rhetoric as told by him and his team. You have chosen to believe it. I don't.

You said it yourself. He refused first time round as the money wasn't good enough for him..... Even if what you are saying is literally what happened its meaningless. Whatever GGG decides to do after being messed around first time I dont blame him. Happens all the time in the real world, someone messes you around, so you mess them around....

I mean even if everything you state is factually correct and not just press release excuses are you actually saying that Golovkin 'dodged' BJS and his chance to unify the division? With an easy win? I mean if anything if everything you state is true he simply moved on to bigger and better things. My gut is he was pissed with the first refusal and thought this guy is a coward and does not deserve to be in the ring with me so I am gonna mess him around.

What does any of this even matter? You may think you are an expert of the scene and I know nothing, but you seem to think that BJS is on the same level as GGG, Canelo, Jacobs, Lemieux and anyone else who can punch and doesn't run out of steam after 7 rounds.

Thats just fantasy world mate.

Explain what BJS has done in his career to earn more then a £1.5 mil purse? Sorry I just don't buy what your implying.

Basically you've not bothered to do any research on the matter... and even if you had done so, you would completely disregard a story reported by all reputable media sources that were quoting the actual men involved in the contract negotiations.

Good for you kid! Believe what you want to believe in and pay no attention to anything inconvenient, like the objective truths of reality.

boxing_rocks wrote:

tonymaccaroni wrote: Im just saying that is all BJS's rhetoric as told by him and his team. You have chosen to believe it. I didn't.

You said it yourself. He refused first time round as the money wasn't good enough for him..... Even if what you are saying is literally what happened its meaningless. Whatever GGG decides to do after being messed around first time I dont blame him. Happens all the time in the real world, someone messes you around, so you mess them around....

I mean even if everything you state is factually correct and not just press release excuses are you actually saying that Golovkin 'dodged' BJS and his chance to unify the division? With an easy win? I mean if anything if everything you state is true he simply moved on to bigger and better things. My gut is he was pissed with the first refusal and thought this guy is a coward and does not deserve to be in the ring with me so I am gonna mess him around.

What does any of this even matter? You may think you are an expert of the scene and I know nothing, but you seem to think that BJS is on the same level as GGG, Canelo, Jacobs, Lemieux and anyone else who can punch and doesn't run out of steam after 7 rounds.

Thats just fantasy world mate.

Explain what BJS has done in his career to earn more then a £1.5 mil purse? Sorry I just don't buy what your implying.

fergusg/EO/vershitty believes everything he reads when it aligns with his agenda, but would call people (like Loefler) liars when it doesn't.

Even you knew about this story and have previously discussed it at length with me. You've even acknowledged facts that this guy refuses to believe.

Are you now pretending that this situation didn't happen?

Are you saying that K2 and Queensberry hadn't agreed all the contractual stipulations of the GGG-Saunders fight, with Golovkin ultimately refusing to sign the contract?

If this is now what you're claiming, aren't you contradicting yourself?

I'll give you some free advice, whilst you may always feel compelled to support anyone that argues against me, be aware of what you're supporting, as you may be aligning yourself with a total lunatic that is actually contradicting things that you yourself have previously acknowledged to be true... and that's not an ideal situation, is it?

verlichte wrote:

tonymaccaroni wrote:

verlichte wrote: Are you saying that K2 and Queensberry Promotions had not agreed the financial terms, the venue and the fight date contractual stipulations to orchestrate a bout between Golovkin and Jacobs?

Are you saying that Billy Joe hadn't signed the aforementioned contract?

Are you claiming that Gennady Golovkin, despite making multiple promises to fight on the 10th June, over several months, declined to sign the contract to fight Billy Joe Saunders?

Are you saying that Tom Loeffler hadn't told the media multiple times that Gennady wanted to fight Billy Joe Saunders on the 10th June?

Are you claiming that Billy Joe Saunders didn't publish the text messages received from Tom Loeffler apologising for the late delivery of Golovkin's signed contract?

Please explain to everyone what you believe the facts to be in relation to this matter, because your lack of knowledge suggests that you've only just been following the sport.

Im just saying that is all BJS's rhetoric as told by him and his team. You have chosen to believe it. I don't.

You said it yourself. He refused first time round as the money wasn't good enough for him..... Even if what you are saying is literally what happened its meaningless. Whatever GGG decides to do after being messed around first time I dont blame him. Happens all the time in the real world, someone messes you around, so you mess them around....

I mean even if everything you state is factually correct and not just press release excuses are you actually saying that Golovkin 'dodged' BJS and his chance to unify the division? With an easy win? I mean if anything if everything you state is true he simply moved on to bigger and better things. My gut is he was pissed with the first refusal and thought this guy is a coward and does not deserve to be in the ring with me so I am gonna mess him around.

What does any of this even matter? You may think you are an expert of the scene and I know nothing, but you seem to think that BJS is on the same level as GGG, Canelo, Jacobs, Lemieux and anyone else who can punch and doesn't run out of steam after 7 rounds.

Thats just fantasy world mate.

Explain what BJS has done in his career to earn more then a £1.5 mil purse? Sorry I just don't buy what your implying.

Basically you've not bothered to do any research on the matter... and even if you had done so, you would completely disregard a story reported by all reputable media sources that were quoting the actual men involved in the contract negotiations.

Good for you kid! Believe what you want to believe in and pay no attention to anything inconvenient, like the objective truths of reality.

Ok show us this objective truth then? Link me an unbiased factual report that is from a neutral camp or media outlet that describes GGG dodging BJS.

As stated many times in earlier post its irrelevant what his reasons are. He was a world champion who had the chance of megafight's with GGG and Canelo and didn't fight either. Whatever his reasons or excuses are, some people just value actions over words. That's why the majority of opinion on this forum in regards to BJS seems to be closer to mine than yours.

Ok this is really poor discussion now as you refuse to move away from the 'lost his pen' incident. Lets clear this up in a style you will understand so we can move on.

1) We agree that BJS refuses first fight over purse, correct?

2) We agree BJS wanted second fight, but this time GGG refused for whatever reason (totally irrelevant, but that he went for a bigger draw opponent at its most basic level or if you are delusional that he 'dodged' BJS)

So now we are agreed n your 'inconvenient' truths can we move on?

When has BJS earned anywhere near £1.5 mil guaranteed purse? How does he justify being worth more then this? Why didn't he fight Canelo when they wanted him instead of Chavez Jnr? Why is he so inactive since becoming a world champion?

Also, just so you know, the word objective in the context you used it in means unbiased. If you are repeating one sides version of events, that is not objective.

You call me unknowledgeable and regurgitate your facts. Do you remember this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJuwAz-ekoQ

BJS literally admitting that GGG would beat him. Straight from your favorite source. Even he disagrees with you mate

tonymaccaroni wrote:You call me unknowledgeable and regurgitate your facts. Do you remember this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJuwAz-ekoQ

BJS literally admitting that GGG would beat him. Straight from your favorite source. Even he disagrees with you mate

This video has nothing whatsoever to do with our discussion. The video itself is more than two years old. Golovkin’s withdrawal from the Billy Joe Saunders fight occurred last month.

Only an intellectually-challenged person would submit a video that does not support their argument in anyway, whilst also being totally irrelevant to the subject matter being discussed.

You can employ diversionary tactics if you wish, but it only serves to undermine your credibility.

It's clear to me that you’re arguing about a subject matter that you know very little about… and the only reason why you refuse to abandon the debate, is due to your argumentative nature, instead of possessing a genuine desire to learn from others.

To be honest, I’m not even sure if you’re a genuine fan of the sport, because the information that I’ve conveyed is common-knowledge and easily accessible/verifiable, yet you sincerely refuse to believe that it's true.