BoxRec

Considering only the fights at CW (190 / 200 limits, both) Holyfild is #1, undoubtedly, Haye could be #2, and current Usyk is #3, in my opinion.
What do you think about ?
Please, do not discuss about RJJ or any other fighter who competed at CW, but were in their prime at LHW or HW.

He didn't look that great in his last fight and his record isn't that good.

So, I'm going to say no.

Fu=;.*×$€k records. Skills win fights. Usyk is the cw with the best skills ever. He is the best cw ever.

Jip wrote:Fu=;.*×$€k records. Skills win fights. Usyk is the cw with the best skills ever. He is the best cw ever.

I also said that he didn't look very good in his last fight.

He fails the record test and the eye test so far.

He doesn't deserve to be rated very highly at all in ATG considerations.

Horse wrote:

Jip wrote:Fu=;.*×$€k records. Skills win fights. Usyk is the cw with the best skills ever. He is the best cw ever.

I also said that he didn't look very good in his last fight.

He fails the record test and the eye test so far.

He doesn't deserve to be rated very highly at all in ATG considerations.

Last fight he fought a young strong opponent. No shame on having some difficulties. When usyk is on his a game nobody beats him. Glowacki was considered #1 cw after impressivly stopping huck. Afterwards he couldnt do sh;&t against usyk except for swinging wilds hooks to kand a lucky punch.

You don't think questions like that more than a little premature ?

I like him very much and he shows every sign that he is on track to be described in such terms ... one day.

Haye was the best 200 pounder for now... Usyk 2nd... Toney 3rd... Holyfield 4th... The division limit was 190 when Holy was there and I never thought Qawi was that good a Cruiser -- better at Light Heavy... It's early for Usyk and I think he'll overtake Haye with more fights... I don't think he'll be beaten real soon..

Toney was one of the best Middleweights ever and probably had the best ability, but he was a small Cruiserweight.. Too small to handle Usyk or Haye.. He would have beaten Holyfield at any time at any weight.. He found a home on his rib-cage and Evander had no answer for him.. The Holyfield-Toney fight is an excellent study on how to rip the body apart while keeping the other guy's forehead out of your face by shifting your stance and using inside leverage.

candyslim wrote:You don't think questions like that more than a little premature ?

I like him very much and he shows every sign that he is on track to be described in such terms ... one day.

No, I think he is already ready to become #2 CW ATG (if he is capable to defeat Briedis, and I am sure he is).

Horse wrote:

Jip wrote:Fu=;.*×$€k records. Skills win fights. Usyk is the cw with the best skills ever. He is the best cw ever.

I also said that he didn't look very good in his last fight.

He fails the record test and the eye test so far.

He doesn't deserve to be rated very highly at all in ATG considerations.

He didn't look very good in dominating a tricky former Olympian?

Horse wrote:

Jip wrote:Fu=;.*×$€k records. Skills win fights. Usyk is the cw with the best skills ever. He is the best cw ever.

I also said that he didn't look very good in his last fight.

He fails the record test and the eye test so far.

He doesn't deserve to be rated very highly at all in ATG considerations.

You're blind then. Usyk lost maybe 2-3 rounds against Hunter. It wasn't close.

Mexi-Box wrote:He didn't look very good in dominating a tricky former Olympian?

No, he didn't.

Mexi-Box wrote:You're blind then. Usyk lost maybe 2-3 rounds against Hunter. It wasn't close.

Usyk certainly didn't look like an ATG against Hunter and that's what we are talking about here.

If you're going to be talked up like that without having the quality wins to back it up then you'd better look exceptional against the lesser opponents that you fave.

Usyk didn't look anything special against Hunter. Lot's of people say the same.

Horse wrote:

Mexi-Box wrote:You're blind then. Usyk lost maybe 2-3 rounds against Hunter. It wasn't close.

Usyk certainly didn't look like an ATG against Hunter and that's what we are talking about here.

If you're going to be talked up like that without having the quality wins to back it up then you'd better look exceptional against the lesser opponents that you fave.

Usyk didn't look anything special against Hunter. Lot's of people say the same.

I agree that Usyk did not look special against Hunter, but it was obvious that he was two levels above Hunter.
It is very difficult for me to imagine Usyk defeated at CW. It could be different at HW, but it would be another story.

ValMar wrote:

candyslim wrote:You don't think questions like that more than a little premature ?

I like him very much and he shows every sign that he is on track to be described in such terms ... one day.

No, I think he is already ready to become #2 CW ATG (if he is capable to defeat Briedis, and I am sure he is).

I guess it depends on definitions. It's complicated by the change in weight limit in the cruiserweight division and compounded by the fact that a lot of great heavyweights of the past were well inside the cruiserweight limit.

Maybe the truth is I'm too lazy to think deeply about it

Horse wrote:

Mexi-Box wrote:You're blind then. Usyk lost maybe 2-3 rounds against Hunter. It wasn't close.

Usyk certainly didn't look like an ATG against Hunter and that's what we are talking about here.

If you're going to be talked up like that without having the quality wins to back it up then you'd better look exceptional against the lesser opponents that you fave.

Usyk didn't look anything special against Hunter. Lot's of people say the same.

Prime muhammad ali also didnt look special in every single he has been. Does that mean prime ali isnt amongs the best. Every atg has not so impressiv nights.

Jip wrote:Prime muhammad ali also didnt look special in every single he has been. Does that mean prime ali isnt amongs the best. Every atg has not so impressiv nights.

But Ali did have the wins to back up his claim to be an ATG.

Usyk doesn't have a very good record and he hasn't looked that impressive in the ring either.

He doesn't deserve this sort of respect.

Horse wrote:

Jip wrote:Prime muhammad ali also didnt look special in every single he has been. Does that mean prime ali isnt amongs the best. Every atg has not so impressiv nights.

But Ali did have the wins to back up his claim to be an ATG.

Usyk doesn't have a very good record and he hasn't looked that impressive in the ring either.

He doesn't deserve this sort of respect.

You are so dumb haha. He has looked very impresiv in the ring.

Compare both records of ali and usyk. Who had better opponents in the first 10 fights?

You f*cking people can't wait to start talking about people's standing in the all time rankings. Let them have a career in their own time first for f*cks sake. Usyk's barely even started. His all time ranking doesn't mean d*ck at the moment, he still needs to establish how good he is or isn't in the here and now.

Horse wrote:

Jip wrote:Prime muhammad ali also didnt look special in every single he has been. Does that mean prime ali isnt amongs the best. Every atg has not so impressiv nights.

But Ali did have the wins to back up his claim to be an ATG.

Usyk doesn't have a very good record and he hasn't looked that impressive in the ring either.

He doesn't deserve this sort of respect.

Horse, I can not imagine any current CW boxer able to outpoint Usyk. He has an excellent chin, so chance to be defeated by KO/TKO is very slim.

Jip wrote:

Horse wrote:

Jip wrote:Prime muhammad ali also didnt look special in every single he has been. Does that mean prime ali isnt amongs the best. Every atg has not so impressiv nights.

But Ali did have the wins to back up his claim to be an ATG.

Usyk doesn't have a very good record and he hasn't looked that impressive in the ring either.

He doesn't deserve this sort of respect.

You are so dumb haha. He has looked very impresiv in the ring.

Compare both records of ali and usyk. Who had better opponents in the first 10 fights?

That's just it though. After 10 fights nobody was saying Ali was one of the 5 best Heavyweights ever. Because most people have just a tiny bit of patience, and actually wait for a guy to accomplish something before they say things like that.

ValMar wrote:

Horse wrote:

Jip wrote:Prime muhammad ali also didnt look special in every single he has been. Does that mean prime ali isnt amongs the best. Every atg has not so impressiv nights.

But Ali did have the wins to back up his claim to be an ATG.

Usyk doesn't have a very good record and he hasn't looked that impressive in the ring either.

He doesn't deserve this sort of respect.

Horse, I can not imagine any current CW boxer able to outpoint Usyk. He has an excellent chin, so chance to be defeated by KO/TKO is very slim.

I can easily imagine it. Usyk is a good fighter, he's not invincible.

gilgamesh wrote:

ValMar wrote:

Horse wrote:But Ali did have the wins to back up his claim to be an ATG.

Usyk doesn't have a very good record and he hasn't looked that impressive in the ring either.

He doesn't deserve this sort of respect.

Horse, I can not imagine any current CW boxer able to outpoint Usyk. He has an excellent chin, so chance to be defeated by KO/TKO is very slim.

I can easily imagine it. Usyk is a good fighter, he's not invincible.

The invincible boxer does not exist. May I know your opinion ? Which recent CW boxer is capable to outpoint Usyk ? How ?

ValMar wrote:

gilgamesh wrote:

ValMar wrote:
Horse, I can not imagine any current CW boxer able to outpoint Usyk. He has an excellent chin, so chance to be defeated by KO/TKO is very slim.

I can easily imagine it. Usyk is a good fighter, he's not invincible.

The invincible boxer does not exist. May I know your opinion ? Which recent CW boxer is capable to outpoint Usyk ? How ?

I didn't say anybody WOULD beat Usyk, but I think Mairis Breidis or Murat Gassiev could possibly be a handful for him. They're very solid fighters in their own right.

Don't get me wrong, I'd pick Usyk to win those fights if they were scheduled next for him, I'm just saying it's not out of the question that he could lose to those guys.

Usyk gets over cooked on this forum. He's good for sure, and cruiser isn't a division blessed with a lot of greats imo, so I wouldn't like to say where he is in the all time standings.

The best cruiserweight have moved up.
Hopefully we get to see usyk to this in the future