BoxRec

Where for example a c level boxer got dominated by a a level boxer and out of nowhere the c l knocks out the a l boxer.

Marquez/pacquiao, pac was leading on points, is overallthe better boxer and juan kod him. But lets not forget, marquez is a atg top 50 himself, it wasnt realy a lucky punch.

Tarver/jones comes to my mind. Jones was drained and becoming older. Tarver was youmg fresh and by no means a c level boxer, prime tarver was a dangerous light heavyweight.

Not quite the scenario you describe but I seem to recall Derry Matthews finding a big punch whilst being out scored by Coyle

Its a matter of perspective. It depends what you mean by lucky. One can argue the no punch is lucky or that every punch is lucky. For me a lucky punch is the one that was a result of your opponents stark mistake, a mistake that he normally would not make. You got lucky because he let you hit him essentially.

The only way that a punch could be classed as a lucky punch is if the thrower didn't intend it to land. Even if you throw a massive haymaker, it's intended to land. Tyson Fury and Greg Page both landed punches on their own face, so they could be classed as lucky or unlucky.

I don't believe there is such a thing as the point of boxing is to hit the other guy in the head or body.

Seems to be a lot of people who think boxing is somehow exempt from luck and randomness, which is nonsensical.

Oh, but he meant to throw that punch! Okay, and the guy who won the lottery meant to fill in his numbers so he could win the lottery. Of course some punches are lucky...

Shallow men believe in luck or in circumstance. Strong men believe in cause and effect.”
― Ralph Waldo Emerson


“I'm a greater believer in luck, and I find the harder I work the more I have of it”
― Thomas Jefferson

Luck is part of cause and effect, and of course hard work is still important.

crusader wrote:Seems to be a lot of people who think boxing is somehow exempt from luck and randomness, which is nonsensical.

Oh, but he meant to throw that punch! Okay, and the guy who won the lottery meant to fill in his numbers so he could win the lottery. Of course some punches are lucky...

Name me one punch in a fight that wasn't fixed, where the guy throwing the punch didn't intend it to land.

It's like a snooker player playing a really hard pot. He's still aiming for that pocket.

Intention is a stupid basis for determining whether a shot was lucky or not. People intend to win money when they go pull the slots in Vegas and fill in their lottery numbers...

crusader wrote:Intention is a stupid basis for determining whether a shot was lucky or not. People intend to win money when they go pull the slots in Vegas and fill in their lottery numbers...

Of course they hope to win but they haven't in most cases practiced for many many years with the intention of winning,surely training to hit someone for ten.twenty,thirty years or more isn't luck ?

crusader wrote:Intention is a stupid basis for determining whether a shot was lucky or not. People intend to win money when they go pull the slots in Vegas and fill in their lottery numbers...

That's a crazy comparison. Landing a punch ain't lucky. Put a rank novice in with Joshua and he won't land a punch because of luck, it has nowt to do with luck, it's about skill.

keithmoonhangover wrote:

crusader wrote:Intention is a stupid basis for determining whether a shot was lucky or not. People intend to win money when they go pull the slots in Vegas and fill in their lottery numbers...

That's a crazy comparison. Landing a punch ain't lucky. Put a rank novice in with Joshua and he won't land a punch because of luck, it has nowt to do with luck, it's about skill.

Exactly,sense at last

1. Skill and talent in no way preclude luck

2. What if someone hasn't trained at all, but manages to KO a skilled boxer? Let's say the non-boxer had been getting their ass kicked, but circumstances came together perfectly, such that they threw a haymaker at the exact moment that the boxer made an uncharacteristic mistake, resulting in the punch catching the boxer right at the end of the chin and putting them down for the count. They rematch 99 times and the boxer wins all of them without ever being hurt.

Bizarre argument. A novice being unable to hit AJ in no way means that luck isn't a factor in boxing...

If you thinks it's just down to intention, the lottery/slots example holds up just fine.

crusader wrote:Bizarre argument. A novice being unable to hit AJ in no way means that luck isn't a factor in boxing...

But there isn't some mystical force called luck, it's a word from when people believed in magic.

Still waiting for you to name a punch landed by 'luck'.

Chance and randomness are very real things.

crusader wrote:Chance and randomness are very real things.

There's nothing random about punching someone on the nose.

Landing punches is not simply a matter what you do, but what your opponent does, and that alone means it's not completely in your hands. Two people can throw the exact same punch, but different opponents will react to it in different ways, and the same opponent could make an uncharacteristic error that leads to them being hit by a shot they'd avoided 20 times out of 20.

I still at the whole 'you meant to hit them, therefore it's not lucky' logic

..being lucky/unlucky, having luck is the part of everyday life...why would sport be any different?

greg wrote:..being lucky/unlucky, having luck is the part of everyday life...why would sport be any different?

It's not any different, though I suppose it can be romantic to think of boxing as exempt from chance.

crusader wrote:Landing punches is not simply a matter what you do, but what your opponent does, and that alone means it's not completely in your hands. Two people can throw the exact same punch, but different opponents will react to it in different ways, and the same opponent could make an uncharacteristic error that leads to them being hit by a shot they'd avoided 20 times out of 20.

I still at the whole 'you meant to hit them, therefore it's not lucky' logic

That is complete bollocks. Yes the other guy needs to be in the right place, but you make no mention of all the 'unlucky' punches that missed, despite the best efforts of the thrower.

Still waiting for some examples of these lucky punches. You can name some unlucky ones while you're there. You know plenty about boxing, so you should have thousands of examples.

No mention of Wilder windmilling yet?

..I wonder if hitting in the balls can be construed as a lucky punch

Yes...I'll try and find the fight...

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Serichai Nonpitayakom vs Kiyohei Endo