BoxRec

As the angst over the decision subsides for GGG, my guess is that is that he's going to begin to feel lucky and quite fortunate that he was somehow able to avoid a career disaster in this fight. Sure, GGG made life changing money but if there was ever a boxer that cared more about his legacy than his bank account in the present day day of boxing, it's GGG. Abel Sanchez and GGG should thank their lucky stars that they walked out of that arena with a draw and legacy intact with the deck so heavily stacked against them. With just one more fraudulent stroke of the scoring pencil, GGG is 37-1...no more belts, no defense streak record to chase history with, no commercials, no more PPV. History would show GGG lost and history would not remember how badly he got jobbed by judges because bad decisions fade from memories for some reason. GGG and team would find them 20 steps backwards having to rebuild the brand back up at 36 years of age...not easy.

This is why I'm NEVER taking a rematch with Canelo and Golden Boy if i'm GGG and Abel Sanchez. You basically took a hit with 17 showing and pulled a 4 of diamonds to tie the dealer. Now take your chips and leave the blackjack table because you dodged a bullet. GGG last 3 fights have brought him in over $30 million not including promotional and advertising dollars. At this point in his career, he doesn't need to take these kinds of fights that have very low probability of fairness and even playing field. I don't care if they offer me 50 million. It's not worth rolling the dice again with his legacy if it's as important to him as he says. Anyway, the early signs from Canelo's camp is that they aren't excited about a rematch either so my guess is that we've seen Canelo and GGG in the ring for the last time. AND I'M OK WITH THAT.

Good post.

After mulling this situation over for a bit, it appears to me that 3G came out the big winner the other night, similar to what you have said. Prior to the fight, it was nearly unanimous that 3G would lose the decision if he did not completely dominate the fight, including at least one KD. While I scored the fight 117-111 3G, I fully expected the cards to come back an SD for GingerHead.

In retrospect, (like you said) a draw under the circumstances was like hitting the lottery for 3G. He keeps his belts. His brand has exploded. The vast majority believe that he won and that he was wronged.

Most importantly, 3G does not need GingerHead any more. 3G has graduated to A-side. Even against GingerHead, if they were to negotiate a rematch, 3G is in the power position.

GingerHead's brand is the one that has taken a hit, especially with Mexicans and Mexican Americans. 3G is the one they saw fighting like their boxing god, JCC, not GingerHead. Even casuals believe enmasse that 3G won, and that he comes to make the fight.

GingerHead needs 3G now more than 3G needs him. 3G can fight whoever he chooses and make good money now. He has enough belts and popularity to ignore mandatories and make the fights that make sense for him.

GingerHead needs the rematch for a number of reasons:

1. The vast majority of hardcore and casual boxing fans believe that he lost to 3G.

2. His fanbase has taken a hit, beginning when he pulled his obvious manipulations to get the MW belt, and then give it up without a fight, giving the appearance that he feared 3G. His fanbase has more boxing knowledge than most. They watched as he fought three essential stiffs, culminating in the draining of the god of Mexican boxing's son into a corpse. GingerHead's own fanbase necessitated that he man up and take the 3G challenge.

3. In order to win backs the many fans that he has lost to 3G, he needs to get back in the ring with him and win a legit "drama show."

Conclusion; 3G not only managed a draw against all odds, he stole the deck.

Tanzio wrote:3G has graduated to A-side. Even against GingerHead, if they were to negotiate a rematch, 3G is in the power position.

Maybe not quite, especially with Loefler as a promoter. I think he is already ready to get subdued and not organize a December fight for GGG.

boxing_rocks wrote:

Tanzio wrote:3G has graduated to A-side. Even against GingerHead, if they were to negotiate a rematch, 3G is in the power position.

Maybe not quite, especially with Loefler as a promoter. I think he is already ready to get subdued and not organize a December fight for GGG.

They hold all the cards, whether they realize it or not. They can negotiate from the power position. 3G has more options at the moment, and he may have surpassed GingerHead in popularity.

If Team GingerHead plays hardball, Team 3G can go to the UK and make bank v The Romany Pig in a stadium fight. Or, he can step up and go after an SMW belt v Ramirez in a surefire drama show. Or, he can rematch Jacobs in Vegas.

GingerHead needs 3G more than vice versa now.

We don't know what exactly their rematch close says and if it allows Golden Boy to make decisions about a date, venue, allowing Golovkin to have an interim fight, etc. It is quite possible that GB still holds all cards.

boxing_rocks wrote:We don't know what exactly their rematch close says and if it allows Golden Boy to make decisions about a date, venue, allowing Golovkin to have an interim fight, etc. It is quite possible that GB still holds all cards.

We do not know if there is a rematch clause in effect at all, given it was a draw. 3G holds the belts, the public sympathy, the worldwide popularity, and he is just far more likable than GingerHead.

3G holds the cards. GingerHead must come to the table or continue his carnival act. Where does GingerHead go now? He has played The Corpse of JCC Jr card. He has played the Khan con. He has beaten up on a second rate UK fighter.

GingerHead is a MW now, and the sharks are circling. He needs 3G.

Tanzio wrote:Where does GingerHead go now?

- Cotto
- BJS
- Lemieux
- Murata/N'Dam winner
- Centreno Jr
...

Lot's of possibilities to avoid GGG, Jacobs and Charlo.

Tanzio wrote:In retrospect, (like you said) a draw under the circumstances was like hitting the lottery for 3G. He keeps his belts. His brand has exploded. The vast majority believe that he won and that he was wronged.

Most importantly, 3G does not need GingerHead any more ... Conclusion; 3G not only managed a draw against all odds, he stole the deck.

That's turning it up-side-down... Golovkin was screwed in the biggest fight of his life... Don Trella was really the canny thief in this event... He gave the 7th round to Canelo.. That round was so one-sided that even Adalaide Byrd gave it to GGG... Dave Moretti tried to give the fight to Canelo but he came up with the only believable score.. He didn’t want to cause a big stickeroo.. There was obviously no coordination between the judges if you look at their cards.

I sometimes see 2 judges glancing directly at the 3rd judge right after each round – and he’s touching his forehead.. casually touching his nose.. touching his mouth or whatever – as if he’s thinking, but it’s a signal.. Sure enough, when you look at their cards they line up well.

You don't need that to commit robbery, but it helps if the scores correlate well. It’s more believable. These judges wanted Canelo to win and Byrd went over the top – which she has done on many previous occasions and still retains her job. When there’s a mass protest from the fans they “suspend” a judge for a few months. It’s like a paid vacation. They almost never lose their cush jobs because they’re just working with the other crooks and got a bit out of step. But Don Trella needs to be called on the carpet to explain his 7th round score for Canelo. I know that won't happen. If the whole thing is crooked why would it???

boxing_rocks wrote:

Tanzio wrote:Where does GingerHead go now?

- Cotto
- BJS
- Lemieux
- Murata/N'Dam winner
- Centreno Jr
...

Lot's of possibilities to avoid GGG, Jacobs and Charlo.

True. He can resume the bum show he was producing prior to 3G. But his fanbase will continue to shrink and he will fade into relative obscurity.

His Mexican fanbase is demanding. They are the only reason that he fought 3G this year. His reputation was suffering.

He needs to rematch 3G. He needs to defeat the Russian JCC or go out on his shield trying.

His star has faded considerably.

Kalan wrote:

Tanzio wrote:In retrospect, (like you said) a draw under the circumstances was like hitting the lottery for 3G. He keeps his belts. His brand has exploded. The vast majority believe that he won and that he was wronged.

Most importantly, 3G does not need GingerHead any more ... Conclusion; 3G not only managed a draw against all odds, he stole the deck.

That's turning it up-side-down... Golovkin was screwed in the biggest fight of his life... Don Trella was really the canny thief in this event... He gave the 7th round to Canelo.. That round was so one-sided that even Adalaide Byrd gave it to GGG... Dave Moretti tried to give the fight to Canelo but he came up with the only believable score.. He didn’t want to cause a big stickeroo.. There was obviously no coordination between the judges if you look at their cards.

I sometimes see 2 judges glancing directly at the 3rd judge right after each round – and he’s touching his forehead.. casually touching his nose.. touching his mouth or whatever – as if he’s thinking, but it’s a signal.. Sure enough, when you look at their cards they line up well.

You don't need that to commit robbery, but it helps if the scores correlate well. It’s more believable. These judges wanted Canelo to win and Byrd went over the top – which she has done on many previous occasions and still retains her job. When there’s a mass protest from the fans they “suspend” a judge for a few months. It’s like a paid vacation. They almost never lose their cush jobs because they’re just working with the other crooks and got a bit out of step. But Don Trella needs to be called on the carpet to explain his 7th round score for Canelo. I know that won't happen. If the whole thing is crooked why would it???

Read your own post, Kalip. It does not make sense.

I'm not interested in a rematch.

caldo2025 wrote:As the angst over the decision subsides for GGG, my guess is that is that he's going to begin to feel lucky and quite fortunate that he was somehow able to avoid a career disaster in this fight. Sure, GGG made life changing money but if there was ever a boxer that cared more about his legacy than his bank account in the present day day of boxing, it's GGG. Abel Sanchez and GGG should thank their lucky stars that they walked out of that arena with a draw and legacy intact with the deck so heavily stacked against them. With just one more fraudulent stroke of the scoring pencil, GGG is 37-1...no more belts, no defense streak record to chase history with, no commercials, no more PPV. History would show GGG lost and history would not remember how badly he got jobbed by judges because bad decisions fade from memories for some reason. GGG and team would find them 20 steps backwards having to rebuild the brand back up at 36 years of age...not easy.

This is why I'm NEVER taking a rematch with Canelo and Golden Boy if i'm GGG and Abel Sanchez. You basically took a hit with 17 showing and pulled a 4 of diamonds to tie the dealer. Now take your chips and leave the blackjack table because you dodged a bullet. GGG last 3 fights have brought him in over $30 million not including promotional and advertising dollars. At this point in his career, he doesn't need to take these kinds of fights that have very low probability of fairness and even playing field. I don't care if they offer me 50 million. It's not worth rolling the dice again with his legacy if it's as important to him as he says. Anyway, the early signs from Canelo's camp is that they aren't excited about a rematch either so my guess is that we've seen Canelo and GGG in the ring for the last time. AND I'M OK WITH THAT.

An excelent post ! Bravo !

caldo2025 wrote:If I Were GGG-No Rematch, But Thanks Anyway

So you want GGG to breach a contract and miss out on the opportunity to receive an eight figure payday? Seriously? FFS!

Enlightened-One wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:If I Were GGG-No Rematch, But Thanks Anyway

So you want GGG to breach a contract and miss out on the opportunity to receive an eight figure payday? Seriously? FFS!

GGG earned much more money than "the average person" can spend. I can not see the difference between 30 mill. and 50 mill.
I do not think GGG (or anyone else) can bring his money in his grave.

ValMar wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote:

caldo2025 wrote:If I Were GGG-No Rematch, But Thanks Anyway

So you want GGG to breach a contract and miss out on the opportunity to receive an eight figure payday? Seriously? FFS!

GGG earned much more money than "the average person" can spend. I can not see the difference between 30 mill. and 50 mill.
I do not think GGG (or anyone else) can bring his money in his grave.

There's a big difference, ValMar. There is a lot that can be accomplished with an extra $20,000,000.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I'm not interested in a rematch.

Same, I don't wanna see it either.

Tanzio wrote:

ValMar wrote:

Enlightened-One wrote: So you want GGG to breach a contract and miss out on the opportunity to receive an eight figure payday? Seriously? FFS!

GGG earned much more money than "the average person" can spend. I can not see the difference between 30 mill. and 50 mill.
I do not think GGG (or anyone else) can bring his money in his grave.

There's a big difference, ValMar. There is a lot that can be accomplished with an extra $20,000,000.[/quote

Yes, he would have more "the friends" and the cousins ( "cousins")....And grandchildren would eagerly wait him to die.

ValMar wrote:

Tanzio wrote:

ValMar wrote:
GGG earned much more money than "the average person" can spend. I can not see the difference between 30 mill. and 50 mill.
I do not think GGG (or anyone else) can bring his money in his grave.

There's a big difference, ValMar. There is a lot that can be accomplished with an extra $20,000,000.[/quote

Yes, he would have more "the friends" and the cousins ( "cousins")....And grandchildren would eagerly wait him to die.

The word is business, ValMar. He could build a bit of an empire and provide good jobs for people. Anything wrong with that?

Tanzio wrote:

ValMar wrote:

Tanzio wrote:

There's a big difference, ValMar. There is a lot that can be accomplished with an extra $20,000,000.[/quote

Yes, he would have more "the friends" and the cousins ( "cousins")....And grandchildren would eagerly wait him to die.

The word is business, ValMar. He could build a bit of an empire and provide good jobs for people. Anything wrong with that?

My point of view is quite differnt, but I do not claim that you are wrong !
I wish you lot of money, Tanzio !

$$$$$$$$$

Tanzio wrote:Good post.

After mulling this situation over for a bit, it appears to me that 3G came out the big winner the other night, similar to what you have said. Prior to the fight, it was nearly unanimous that 3G would lose the decision if he did not completely dominate the fight, including at least one KD. While I scored the fight 117-111 3G, I fully expected the cards to come back an SD for GingerHead.

In retrospect, (like you said) a draw under the circumstances was like hitting the lottery for 3G. He keeps his belts. His brand has exploded. The vast majority believe that he won and that he was wronged.

Most importantly, 3G does not need GingerHead any more. 3G has graduated to A-side. Even against GingerHead, if they were to negotiate a rematch, 3G is in the power position.

GingerHead's brand is the one that has taken a hit, especially with Mexicans and Mexican Americans. 3G is the one they saw fighting like their boxing god, JCC, not GingerHead. Even casuals believe enmasse that 3G won, and that he comes to make the fight.

GingerHead needs 3G now more than 3G needs him. 3G can fight whoever he chooses and make good money now. He has enough belts and popularity to ignore mandatories and make the fights that make sense for him.

GingerHead needs the rematch for a number of reasons:

1. The vast majority of hardcore and casual boxing fans believe that he lost to 3G.

2. His fanbase has taken a hit, beginning when he pulled his obvious manipulations to get the MW belt, and then give it up without a fight, giving the appearance that he feared 3G. His fanbase has more boxing knowledge than most. They watched as he fought three essential stiffs, culminating in the draining of the god of Mexican boxing's son into a corpse. GingerHead's own fanbase necessitated that he man up and take the 3G challenge.

3. In order to win backs the many fans that he has lost to 3G, he needs to get back in the ring with him and win a legit "drama show."

Conclusion; 3G not only managed a draw against all odds, he stole the deck.

Those are even better points honestly.

You've got me thinking a little differently after reading that. Now that you mention it, that was the first time i've ever heard Canelo boo'd in Vegas. Not much has changed since the old Roman Empire days and The Colosseum gladiators. Winning over the crowd is just as important as it ever was. I didn't really think about how this ridiculous decision affected Canelo's following. But you're right. Even though Canelo did almost as well as anyone did against GGG (Jacobs did much better) he did vacate belts to avoid fighting GGG and then gets gifted a draw with an unfair score of which he's been getting accustomed to way too often at this point.

Maybe this fight convinces Vegas powers that be (the ones fixing the scorecards) that Canelo is NOT really the answer for Floyd and they direct their attention to another boxer. One thing is for sure, Vegas needs their Floyd...that one boxer that packs the strip twice a year and they will build one from scratch if they have to. Hmmm. It will be interesting to see how this shakes out and could this be the beginning of the downfall for Canelo?

But whatever side GGG is on the negotiating table, i'm never taking another fight with Canelo in Vegas. It's just way too risky. You don't rob the same bank twice.