BoxRec

Throw one out there myself.

We could include Ali. He lost 3 of his prime years when he refused the draft.


Throw up examples of fighters who could have be rated higher as a ATG if an early death, injury or poor training habits hurt there career..

Ruthless-RKO wrote:Throw one out there myself.

We could include Ali. He lost 3 of his prime years when he refused the draft.


Throw up examples of fighters who could have be rated higher as a ATG if an early death, injury or poor training habits hurt there career..

While Ali rightfully always comes up, Louis lost equal prime years in the military. He might have had 40 defenses without that.

Leon Spinks is the best example. You don't win Olympic Gold in 1976 without being very good.

His drug and alcohol intake was constant and caught up with him. I'm not talking about a celebration after the fight.

If the books I read were close to accurate, coke woke him up, beers with breakfast, and then he really got started.

Andre Ward. Could've had an even better career without that long layoff and if he had stuck around longer to at least successfully defend the light heavyweight title a few times.

Ike Ibeabuchi

Vitali Klitschko was out for a number of years because of injuries.

But to be honest.. The HW division was not good between 2004-2009

Prince Naseem - lack of discipline/motivation cut short a good career
Barry Mcguigan - moving up in weight coupled with a bitter management row seemed to sap his enthusiasm
Paul Williams - bad accident
Scott Harrison - bad attitude, couldn't stay out of trouble
Terry Marsh - mainly illness that kept him out although seemed to have a lot of other problems outside the ring

James Toney if he would've kept his weight under control
Vernon Forrest if he hadn't had his shoulder injury
Gerald McClellan if he hadn't gotten injured in the Benn fight

littlepug wrote:Prince Naseem - lack of discipline/motivation cut short a good career
Barry Mcguigan - moving up in weight coupled with a bitter management row seemed to sap his enthusiasm
Paul Williams - bad accident
Scott Harrison - bad attitude, couldn't stay out of trouble
Terry Marsh - mainly illness that kept him out although seemed to have a lot of other problems outside the ring

He was due to fight Canelo on PPV too

Ruthless-RKO wrote:

littlepug wrote:Prince Naseem - lack of discipline/motivation cut short a good career
Barry Mcguigan - moving up in weight coupled with a bitter management row seemed to sap his enthusiasm
Paul Williams - bad accident
Scott Harrison - bad attitude, couldn't stay out of trouble
Terry Marsh - mainly illness that kept him out although seemed to have a lot of other problems outside the ring

He was due to fight Canelo on PPV too

good match that, always like Williams attitude, would fight anyone at any weight

Tommy hearns he should of never lost to Barkley should of got the win Vs Leonard in the rematch and was beating Leonard on the first fight but couldn't hang on .

Was actually thinking of starting a similar "what if" thread recently after a discussion about Willie Pep and his plane crash.

His record,in terms of numbers alone is startling.
Imagine if he turned 2 or 3 of those very rare losses into wins.

Where would we be ranking him in ATG terms

If peep won 3 of 4 from saddler he'd deserve the lofty standing many give him now.

John Conteh - combination of bad decisions outside the ropes and bad hand issues which meant he was effectively one handed for the last four years of his career. Otherwise he could have been a dominant world champion in the era.

Colin McMillan - Shoulder tear in a fight, was never the same again.

Riddick Bowe - Installed a fridge in his bedroom after he won the title and never realised his potential

There's far too many who had discipline issues for various to name. Max Baer is an old one, I think JJ Corbett, and Tyson Fury.

Surprised no one has mentioned Langford either, though there's tons of black fighters that never got their shot

Some bareknuckle examples are James Belcher who lost an eye to a raquet ball accident, and Gentleman John Jackson who slipped and got a bad injury to his leg, and he generally seemed reluctant to fight. I think Tom Sayers also had a career ending injury against Heenan.

Tom Molineaux too, had there been more of an American boxing scene at the time and then (atleast by some accounts) being cheated out of the English title and was never the same after.

BitPlayer wrote:There's far too many who had discipline issues for various to name. Max Baer is an old one, I think JJ Corbett, and Tyson Fury.

Surprised no one has mentioned Langford either, though there's tons of black fighters that never got their shot

Winning a title wouldn't have made Sam's career better. I don't think discipline was baers problem, it was the deaths. He's a good answer.

Prince Naseem - lack of discipline/motivation cut short a good career
Barry Mcguigan - moving up in weight coupled with a bitter management row seemed to sap his enthusiasm
Paul Williams - bad accident
Scott Harrison - bad attitude, couldn't stay out of trouble
Terry Marsh - mainly illness that kept him out although seemed to have a lot of other problems outside the ring

Good choices and assessments

Harrison (Scott not Audley!) was the one that got away for my money. He was a big, skilled and very competent FW with a pretty impressive resume before he ended-up constantly finding himself on the wrong side of the Spanish Police and Law Courts.

I might add Ryan Rhodes to the mix who I still contend the Ingles rushed him too much....he had all the time in the world and should have been allowed to mature as a fighter and they got carried away by chasing all sorts of 'young fighter' records.

I also can't help thinking what Gary Mason would have done if he'd "lived the life" and not had all sorts of projects on the side or been outside the Lawless-Duff stable when Bruno was very much the main man and he was treading water. There were times when Mason looked very good indeed but sadly by the time he faced Lewis he really had not learnt enough

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

BitPlayer wrote:There's far too many who had discipline issues for various to name. Max Baer is an old one, I think JJ Corbett, and Tyson Fury.

Surprised no one has mentioned Langford either, though there's tons of black fighters that never got their shot

Winning a title wouldn't have made Sam's career better. I don't think discipline was baers problem, it was the deaths. He's a good answer.

I think Max was inconsistant long before he killed someone, I think it was one person that he killed, another is sometimes blamed on him, but it really doesn't make much sense. It's not just winning the title but getting to beat the champ that means their careers could have been better.

Whether it was Max or primo, I guarantee you he felt the same guilt.

I don't get what you mean that it doesn't make sense.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I don't get what you mean that it doesn't make sense.

I mean the claims that Max Baer was the cause of the one that died after fighting Primo.

BitPlayer wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I don't get what you mean that it doesn't make sense.

I mean the claims that Max Baer was the cause of the one that died after fighting Primo.

Why?

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

BitPlayer wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I don't get what you mean that it doesn't make sense.

I mean the claims that Max Baer was the cause of the one that died after fighting Primo.

Why?

Because he fought multiple opponents in between and had been ill before fighting Primo.

Yes, he was ill before fighting primo. He had been complaining about headaches since he fought Baer. So who do you think did the most damage? Unknown Winston?