BoxRec

paddy chavez wrote: ↑11 Nov 2017, 04:11 Lewis is a hard fighter to rate I find he looked amazing at times and beat everyone he thought yet was KOd twice by fighters that shouldn't of won a Rd against him has any other ATG been KOd twice by average fighters ?

Kalan wrote: ↑11 Nov 2017, 13:51

paddy chavez wrote: ↑11 Nov 2017, 04:11 Lewis is a hard fighter to rate I find he looked amazing at times and beat everyone he thought yet was KOd twice by fighters that shouldn't of won a Rd against him has any other ATG been KOd twice by average fighters ?

Rahman and McCall were far from average.. Rahman had decent skills, but landed a lottery shot.. McCall didn't get lucky – he was actually very good, but McCall had mental health issues like Tyson Fury.. McCall had some the best talent seen in the history of Heavyweight boxing.. A big, powerful man. A chin that was impregnable and possibly the ATGreatest ever -- and a punch that could put anyone out.. He knocked Lewis out with a nifty left hook, right hand combo.. It wasn't a lucky loaded shot like Rahman.. It was easily the greatest victory of McCall’s career.

Steward was something else as a boxing coach.. He had McCall exploding with confidence.. Manny kept telling Ollie he would dominate and confuse Lewis, showing him all kinds angles, looks, and styles and bewildering him.. McCall easily won the first round on all cards. The 2nd round barely started when Ollie ripped Lewis with a quick right that floored him hard.. Lewis had a pretty good chin.. He was a really big man and not a bad absorber, but he was hurt bad.. He made it to his feet, but wobbled around and leaned on the ref for support.. The ref waved the fight off.

McCall was on top of the world and who wouldn’t be??? He just won the Heavyweight Championship of the World doing everything his ATG trainer told him to do. He had the world on string, sitting on a rainbow – but it quickly went up in smoke as Emmanuel Steward left him.

Steward deserted McCall to train Lewis.. That would make anyone crazy.. It was a milestone for Lewis.. He became an ATG Heavyweight Champ.

Kalan wrote: ↑11 Nov 2017, 15:46 Not even close... More like Joe Louis getting knocked out by Max Schmeling -- and then getting knocked out by Lou Nova.

Or Mike Tyson getting knocked out by James Smith -- than getting knocked out by Buster Douglas.

paddy chavez wrote: ↑11 Nov 2017, 15:52

Kalan wrote: ↑11 Nov 2017, 15:46 Not even close... More like Joe Louis getting knocked out by Max Schmeling -- and then getting knocked out by Lou Nova.

Or Mike Tyson getting knocked out by James Smith -- than getting knocked out by Buster Douglas.

Absolute rubbish McCall and Rahman were low top ten not champions

GreenShadow wrote: ↑17 Nov 2017, 12:19 the fight fans i've encountered from england get all bent out of shape and start frothing at the mouth if anyone says lewis is anything less than a boxing god. i'm sure england has some fans capable of being unbiased but they seem to be far and few between when it comes to Lewis and Bruno.......i'm not attacking english fight fans, i KNOW there are a lot of very knowledgeable ones. i'd just like to run into some of them sometimes rather than just fan boys with inferiority complexes.

Lewis couldn't carry Holmes' jockstrap. now they want to make Maccall and rahman better than they were so lennox doesn't look so bad.

no one in america has an axe to grind against lewis, if holmes fought out of england and lewis was from america's heartland, holmes would still be considered better.
from the few posts i've read here i would bet goldenoldie thinks henry cooper was better than Ali..to be fair i did read he thinks a young Ali MIGHT be better than Lewis.........how generous of him. so maybe a good question would be was Ali better that Maccall or rahman? he must have cried himself to sleep those two nights blaming the judges for letting Lewis get KO'd on their scorecards

i hope i didn't set anyone's pants on fire with this post, i'm just poking a little fun with some of you upright downright forthright blokes with your close shaved chins up and out begging for a jab.

lewis had some natural attributes, but he didn't have the heart of a fighter. not saying he wasn't brave, i just get the feeling his heart wasn't truly into it.

and all kidding aside, i'm new here so i want to make it clear i really do respect english fight fans knowledge and judgement of the game. it's just when it comes to Lewis there seems to be a general disconnect from reality.

I'm sure he would have beat bowe just as he did as an amateur and Bowe ducked him because he knew it too.

Lewis and Klitschko are both hard to rate because neither were truly tested. maybe it was in him to be great but it was never brought out by any of his foes and those two KOs are hard to brush aside.

elmersalsa wrote: ↑17 Nov 2017, 13:32

GreenShadow wrote: ↑17 Nov 2017, 12:19 the fight fans i've encountered from england get all bent out of shape and start frothing at the mouth if anyone says lewis is anything less than a boxing god. i'm sure england has some fans capable of being unbiased but they seem to be far and few between when it comes to Lewis and Bruno.......i'm not attacking english fight fans, i KNOW there are a lot of very knowledgeable ones. i'd just like to run into some of them sometimes rather than just fan boys with inferiority complexes.

Lewis couldn't carry Holmes' jockstrap. now they want to make Maccall and rahman better than they were so lennox doesn't look so bad.

no one in america has an axe to grind against lewis, if holmes fought out of england and lewis was from america's heartland, holmes would still be considered better.
from the few posts i've read here i would bet goldenoldie thinks henry cooper was better than Ali..to be fair i did read he thinks a young Ali MIGHT be better than Lewis.........how generous of him. so maybe a good question would be was Ali better that Maccall or rahman? he must have cried himself to sleep those two nights blaming the judges for letting Lewis get KO'd on their scorecards

i hope i didn't set anyone's pants on fire with this post, i'm just poking a little fun with some of you upright downright forthright blokes with your close shaved chins up and out begging for a jab.

lewis had some natural attributes, but he didn't have the heart of a fighter. not saying he wasn't brave, i just get the feeling his heart wasn't truly into it.

and all kidding aside, i'm new here so i want to make it clear i really do respect english fight fans knowledge and judgement of the game. it's just when it comes to Lewis there seems to be a general disconnect from reality.

I'm sure he would have beat bowe just as he did as an amateur and Bowe ducked him because he knew it too.

Lewis and Klitschko are both hard to rate because neither were truly tested. maybe it was in him to be great but it was never brought out by any of his foes and those two KOs are hard to brush aside.

I think that this is a great post. It could be national pride in a sense from the British. Because I can't picture a man that got flattened by KO by TWO BUMS be at the same class of the great Larry Holmes. Can you imagine Holmes losing to two guys like that? And by knockout?

elmersalsa wrote: ↑17 Nov 2017, 13:32 Can you imagine Holmes losing to two guys like that?

Sidney Carton wrote: ↑17 Nov 2017, 14:27 I didn't know Larry Holmes was "great."

I saw his struggles with Reynaldo Snipes, Tim Witherspoon, Carl Williams, and the pathetic Michael Spinks.

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑17 Nov 2017, 23:09 Lewis was in Holmes class. However Holmes was slightly better and would have had a better than 50% of winning head to head.
Many about Lewis about Lewis are wrong. He often gets credit for a great jab which wasn't great at all; usually he just flicked with it. On the other hand he had a much better chin that he is given credit for.

He was a great fighter, just not quite as good as Holmes.

GreenShadow wrote: ↑17 Nov 2017, 15:01

Sidney Carton wrote: ↑17 Nov 2017, 14:27 I didn't know Larry Holmes was "great."

I saw his struggles with Reynaldo Snipes, Tim Witherspoon, Carl Williams, and the pathetic Michael Spinks.

and yet he beat all of those guys. and they were all better quality fighters than Maccall and Rahman with the exception of spinks.

yes, he beat spinks twice.

and an over 40, out of shape and overweight Holmes just about beat Maccall.

i don't know why it has to burn some brits asses that lewis isn't regarded with awe by people who actually view the sport impartially.

golden oldie wrote: ↑18 Nov 2017, 08:28

...........someone who talks non stop for 15 minutes, and says absolutely NOTHING.

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑18 Nov 2017, 01:16 What about important factors such Lewis winning at "all levels" such as the British title? The Olympic Gold Medal? Being a beast?
The great Larry Holmes was unable to do these things.