BoxRec

Pretty simple I wanna know if people consider George Groves still in prime.

No , don't think he is , never been the same since the second Froch fight .

Would love to see him do a number on junior , but I can't see it happening .

No, I think he’s past prime. Still think he’ll beat Eubank though.

rd350lc wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:46 No , don't think he is , never been the same since the second Froch fight .

Would love to see him do a number on junior , but I can't see it happening .

Disagree.
I thought he was "Cobra'd" and would never be quite the same again. BUT gradually.., he's got over it.
Little by little he's recovered, improved... Very experienced, knows what he can and can't do - he's now the best he's ever been .

Boxerbeetle wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:49 No, I think he’s past prime. Still think he’ll beat Eubank though.

Do you see a stoppage ?

Is George Groves past his prime? Well, when was he in his prime. He has had a few good performances in his career but they have been spread out.

skanksta wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:52

rd350lc wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:46 No , don't think he is , never been the same since the second Froch fight .

Would love to see him do a number on junior , but I can't see it happening .

Disagree.
I thought he was "Cobra'd" and would never be quite the same again. BUT gradually.., he's got over it.
Little by little he's recovered, improved... Very experienced, knows what he can and can't do - he's now the best he's ever been .

How can you go into a fight against a well known puncher with confidence after taking such a heavy KO defeat previously ?

It must have an effect ?

brian13 wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:54 Is George Groves past his prime? Well, when was he in his prime. He has had a few good performances in his career but they have been spread out.

Is this the best version of him essentially.

rd350lc wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:53

Boxerbeetle wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:49 No, I think he’s past prime. Still think he’ll beat Eubank though.

Do you see a stoppage ?

Possibly a late stoppage, but probably points. Although I’m not at all sure, wouldn’t be surprised if Eubank won. Just think Groves has too much for him.

rd350lc wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:56

skanksta wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:52

rd350lc wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:46 No , don't think he is , never been the same since the second Froch fight .

Would love to see him do a number on junior , but I can't see it happening .

Disagree.
I thought he was "Cobra'd" and would never be quite the same again. BUT gradually.., he's got over it.
Little by little he's recovered, improved... Very experienced, knows what he can and can't do - he's now the best he's ever been .

How can you go into a fight against a well known puncher with confidence after taking such a heavy KO defeat previously ?

It must have an effect ?

Eubank is far from a puncher.

If prime is merely a physical thing, then no. But prime as a boxer, yes.
His experience is showing, he is a bit more defensive, and can really sit down on punches better. The Groves we see now would be a far harder fight against the Cobra back then.

Boxerbeetle wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:57

rd350lc wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:53

Boxerbeetle wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:49 No, I think he’s past prime. Still think he’ll beat Eubank though.

Do you see a stoppage ?

Possibly a late stoppage, but probably points. Although I’m not at all sure, wouldn’t be surprised if Eubank won. Just think Groves has too much for him.

I see it the other way and think junior has the better chin and even though his opponents are not on the same level as Groves , I have never seen him staggered .

Would love to see Groves do it tho !

rd350lc wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:56

skanksta wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:52

rd350lc wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:46 No , don't think he is , never been the same since the second Froch fight .

Would love to see him do a number on junior , but I can't see it happening .

Disagree.
I thought he was "Cobra'd" and would never be quite the same again. BUT gradually.., he's got over it.
Little by little he's recovered, improved... Very experienced, knows what he can and can't do - he's now the best he's ever been .

How can you go into a fight against a well known puncher with confidence after taking such a heavy KO defeat previously ?

It must have an effect ?

Of course it does, GG was shaky and gun-shy in his comeback with Rebrasse.
but, around the time he got of the deck vs Jack away from home, he got "ok" with who he was as a fighter again.
Like Wlad, Groves knows he hasn't got the best chin in the word, but it's acceptable. He's been KO'd and humiliated already and shown the mental side to come back from it. He compensates well with improved defence and experience. Under Shane I think he's got a bit more confidence in his stamina in the later rounds too.
All in all, I think he's at his peak now.

KiwiRider wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 18:01 If prime is merely a physical thing, then no. But prime as a boxer, yes.
His experience is showing, he is a bit more defensive, and can really sit down on punches better. The Groves we see now would be a far harder fight against the Cobra back then.

Exactly.

not sure if still prime but its been massively exaggerated when it comes to ppl saying hes shopworn etc. hes on a career best run and clearly boxes smarter imo. ppl talk about his shaky stamina etc but hes been very busy late in several fights, including vs jack where he threw like a 1000 punches. also strong late vs rebrasse, murray, and gutnecth, though admittedly these were more of 'punching bag' fights.

getting worn down an elite fighter froch with seriously excellent stamina doesnt mean you have bad stamina. also i dont think hes fragile in the chin either. at worst hes average. jack wouldve stopped him otherwise if he was really as fragile as ppl say but it was a close fight.

also remember that froch was in reality a massive step up. hed fought degale but degale was a pro novice who barely got past some euro level pole his next fight and he clearly hadnt reached his peak. groves after froch developed his pro experience more and imo it shows with him boxing tighter now, even though he does have some sloppy tear up spots.

No, his prime as a boxer is past and despite showing some promise again as soon as he mentioned he was considering retirement, then in my mind he's already past it and it's only a matter of time before he gets caught and falls into bad habits again.

Since the Froch fight's he fell into a habit of chasing a knockout and thankfully he's come out of that little by little but in his next fight against Eubanks Jr. who may be able to outbox him and over power him it could just be a matter of time before he reacts the wrong way and returns to chasing big punches that leave him open.
Then there's the matter of Eubanks Sr. , who unlike Jr, is very outspoken (I'm being as nice as I can about how eccentric and over the top he is) and will play every trick he can to aggravate or belittle Groves before the fight to rattle him and give Jr. the edge he could need to win.

I guess we’re going to find out soon. He’s been looking good recently but a lot of people favour Eubank in this fight, although I don’t.

I'd say he is somewhere near his peak but probably just starting on the downward side of the curve. I don't think he will get any better from now on but he hasn't really noticeably dipped either.

As for Eubank jr test, I think he has the edge on experience and nothing much between them skill wise. I have a feeling the Eubank might outwork him to sneak it on points.

He’s a better fighter now than he ever was. His chin has never been bullet proof, and his stamina has never been great - so neither of these have declined, and there’s no reason he can’t improve his stamina - especially with the massive big fight experience he now has, which allows him to pace himself so much better, pick his punches and not rush in and try to finish things too early, like he used to.

He’s still a hugely concussive puncher, his title winning effort was very impressive - taking out the seemingly rock hard Russian like that.

I would say yes, Groves is a man in his prime.

Eubank will be a tough fight - but I’d give GG the edge.

Noxy wrote: ↑07 Jan 2018, 03:30 I guess we’re going to find out soon. He’s been looking good recently but a lot of people favour Eubank in this fight, although I don’t.

Winning or losing doesn't equate to if he's in his prime.

skanksta wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:52

rd350lc wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018, 17:46 No , don't think he is , never been the same since the second Froch fight .

Would love to see him do a number on junior , but I can't see it happening .

Disagree.
I thought he was "Cobra'd" and would never be quite the same again. BUT gradually.., he's got over it.
Little by little he's recovered, improved... Very experienced, knows what he can and can't do - he's now the best he's ever been .

This.

Good question and one I'm not sure of the answer! He still panics under pressure and gets caught far too often but offensively he's pretty impressive still. We've not seen him as good as he was in the first half of the first Froch fight. He was punch perfect more or less for 6/7 rounds until Froch dragged him in to deep water and started catching him. Had the chance to put it right and was starched.

The next fight will answer a lot of questions. I'm expecting a really good scrap and I think Eubank stops Groves late but I'm not very confident in that prediction.

For me he peaked in the 2 Froch fights and hasn't quite been the same force despite only the one loss since,personally i can see him being ahead in the Eubank fight and then getting stopped on his feet,completely knackered somewhere around the 10th or 11th round.

It’s a tricky one isn’t it.
When people talk about a boxers prime, they generally mean when we’re they physically at their peak.
In Groves case I suspect his physical peak has been and gone, however if that was the deciding factor in the Groves v Eubank contest I don’t think Groves would ever have been the superior man.
I’d say Groves is not at his peak, but is in the best position of his career to beat CEJ.
A different proposition entirely, but I don’t think a prime Ali would have beat George Foreman, certainly not the decisive way in which the post prime Ali did.

lot of ppl just lazily go with the cobra'd angle just because froch said it, but its wrong. froch didnt ruin him. there were plenty of wild and sloppy showings before. his boxings as good as ever fight to fight and his stamina issues are widely overblown.he threw like 1000 punches vs jack in a very competetive fight and was still busy late. closed strong vs murray, gutnechkt, rebrsse6.

do ppl think he was some perfect boxer? do they not remember why he was such a big underdog for degale and froch?

i find the 3 years ongoing 'groves is finished/badly faded' narrative totally bizarre and just one of those things the masses start parroting w/o much actual evidence or hard thought. cej beats him though