BoxRec

Posted: **18 Jan 2018, 09:36**

...on the scale from 1 to 10 (lets say McCall's chin can be rated as high as 10, while David Price's one is about 2 or 3 at best):

Jack Dempsey -
Joe Louis -
Rocky Marciano -
Floyd Patterson -
Sonny Liston -
Muhammad Ali -
Joe Frazier -
George Foreman -
Ken Norton -
Larry Holmes -
Tim Witherspoon -
Mike Tyson -
Buster Douglas -
Tony Tucker -
Ray Mercer -
Michael Moorer -
Evander Holyfield -
Riddick Bowe -
Lennox Lewis -
Vitali Klitschko -
Wladimir Klitschko -
David Tua -
Oleg Maskaev -
Hasim Rahman -
Chris Byrd -
Alexander Povetkin -
David Haye -
Tyson Fury -
Deontay Wilder -
Anthony Joshua -

Posted: **18 Jan 2018, 11:04**

Boxing Writer wrote: ↑18 Jan 2018, 09:36 ...on the scale from 1 to 10 (lets say McCall's chin can be rated as high as 10, while David Price's one is about 2 or 3 at best):

Jack Dempsey 6
Joe Louis. 8
Rocky Marciano. 10
Floyd Patterson. 5
Sonny Liston. 6
Muhammad Ali. 10
Joe Frazier. 7
George Foreman. 9
Ken Norton. 5
Larry Holmes. 10
Tim Witherspoon. 7
Mike Tyson. 8
Buster Douglas.
Tony Tucker. 6
Ray Mercer. 9
Michael Moorer. 6
Evander Holyfield. 9
Riddick Bowe. 7
Lennox Lewis. 7
Vitali Klitschko. 10
Wladimir Klitschko. 4
David Tua. 9
Oleg Maskaev. 5
Hasim Rahman 6
Chris Byrd. 7
Alexander Povetkin. 7
David Haye. 5
Tyson Fury. 7
Deontay Wilder. 5 untested
Anthony Joshua. 7 untested

Just off Top of my head

Posted: **18 Jan 2018, 11:17**

Boxing Writer wrote: ↑18 Jan 2018, 09:36 ...on the scale from 1 to 10 (lets say McCall's chin can be rated as high as 10, while David Price's one is about 2 or 3 at best):

Jack Dempsey 10
Joe Louis 8
Rocky Marciano 8
Floyd Patterson 6
Sonny Liston 7
Muhammad Ali 10
Joe Frazier 7
George Foreman 7
Ken Norton 6
Larry Holmes 9
Tim Witherspoon 7
Mike Tyson 7
Buster Douglas 6
Tony Tucker 7
Ray Mercer 10
Michael Moorer 6
Evander Holyfield 8
Riddick Bowe 7
Lennox Lewis 8
Vitali Klitschko 9
Wladimir Klitschko 6
David Tua 10
Oleg Maskaev ?
Hasim Rahman 7
Chris Byrd 7
Alexander Povetkin 9
David Haye 7
Tyson Fury 8
Deontay Wilder 7
Anthony Joshua 8

Posted: **22 Jan 2018, 11:53**

Jack Dempsey 8
Joe Louis - 8
Rocky Marciano - 9
Floyd Patterson - 4
Sonny Liston - 8
Muhammad Ali - 10
Joe Frazier - 7
George Foreman - 8
Ken Norton - 5
Larry Holmes - 9
Tim Witherspoon - 7
Mike Tyson - 8
Buster Douglas - 7
Tony Tucker - 8
Ray Mercer - 8
Michael Moorer - 3
Evander Holyfield -9
Riddick Bowe - 8
Lennox Lewis - 8
Vitali Klitschko - Untested
Wladimir Klitschko - 3
David Tua - 10
Oleg Maskaev -3
Hasim Rahman -5
Chris Byrd - 6
Alexander Povetkin - Untested
David Haye - Untested
Tyson Fury - Untested
Deontay Wilder - Untested
Anthony Joshua - Untested

I think Tucker had a pretty good chin. He went the distance with Tyson and Lewis; and was not stopped until he was past it.
Maeskev usually was stopped when he fought anyone who could punch.

Posted: **22 Jan 2018, 12:43**

Tomasino wrote: ↑18 Jan 2018, 11:04
Jack Dempsey 6

Lennox Lewis. 7

So glass chinned Lennox Lewis had a better chin than Jack Dempsey.

You learn something new every day.

Posted: **22 Jan 2018, 16:40**

Why wouldn't they be about the same?

Posted: **22 Jan 2018, 18:03**

Boxing Writer wrote: ↑18 Jan 2018, 09:36 ...on the scale from 1 to 10 (lets say McCall's chin can be rated as high as 10, while David Price's one is about 2 or 3 at best):

Jack Dempsey - 7
Joe Louis - 6
Rocky Marciano - 8
Floyd Patterson - 4
Sonny Liston - 8
Muhammad Ali -9.5
Joe Frazier - 9
George Foreman - 9
Ken Norton - 6
Larry Holmes - 9.5
Tim Witherspoon - 8
Mike Tyson - 9
Buster Douglas - 7
Tony Tucker - 9
Ray Mercer - 10
Michael Moorer - 6
Evander Holyfield -9.5
Riddick Bowe - 8
Lennox Lewis - 7.5
Vitali Klitschko - 5
Wladimir Klitschko - 9
David Tua - 9.5
Oleg Maskaev -??
Hasim Rahman -6
Chris Byrd - 7
Alexander Povetkin - 9
David Haye - 6
Tyson Fury - 7
Deontay Wilder - 5
Anthony Joshua - 8

Posted: **22 Jan 2018, 21:24**

Sidney Carton wrote: ↑22 Jan 2018, 12:43
Tomasino wrote: ↑18 Jan 2018, 11:04
Jack Dempsey 6

Lennox Lewis. 7

So glass chinned Lennox Lewis had a better chin than Jack Dempsey.

You learn something new every day.

Your right they are about even.

Posted: **22 Jan 2018, 22:44**

Boxing Writer wrote: ↑18 Jan 2018, 09:36 ...on the scale from 1 to 10 (lets say McCall's chin can be rated as high as 10, while David Price's one is about 2 or 3 at best):

Jack Dempsey - 8
Joe Louis - 7
Rocky Marciano - 7
Floyd Patterson - 6
Sonny Liston - 8
Muhammad Ali - 8
Joe Frazier - 7
George Foreman - 9
Ken Norton - 6
Larry Holmes - 8
Tim Witherspoon - 8
Mike Tyson - 8
Buster Douglas - 8
Tony Tucker - 8
Ray Mercer - 10
Michael Moorer - 6
Evander Holyfield -9
Riddick Bowe - 8
Lennox Lewis - 7
Vitali Klitschko - 9
Wladimir Klitschko - 7
David Tua - 10
Oleg Maskaev - 4
Hasim Rahman -5
Chris Byrd - 7
Alexander Povetkin - 8
David Haye - 7
Tyson Fury - 8
Deontay Wilder - not sure, maybe 8
Anthony Joshua - not sure, maybe 8

Posted: **26 Jan 2018, 12:36**

10 = Incredible
9 = Excellent
8 = Very good
7 = Good
6 = Slightly above average
5 = Average

Jack Dempsey - 7
Joe Louis - 6
Rocky Marciano - 9
Floyd Patterson - 5
Sonny Liston - 7
Muhammad Ali - 9
Joe Frazier - 5.5
George Foreman - 8
Ken Norton - 5.5
Larry Holmes - 9.5
Tim Witherspoon - 8.5
Mike Tyson - 9
Buster Douglas - 6.5
Tony Tucker - 8
Ray Mercer - 10
Michael Moorer - 5
Evander Holyfield -9
Riddick Bowe - 6.5
Lennox Lewis - 6
Vitali Klitschko - 10
Wladimir Klitschko - 6
David Tua - 10
Oleg Maskaev - 5.5
Hasim Rahman -5.5
Chris Byrd - 9
Alexander Povetkin - 9.5
David Haye - 5.5
Tyson Fury - 5.5
Deontay Wilder -5
Anthony Joshua -6

Posted: **26 Jan 2018, 12:39**

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑22 Jan 2018, 11:53 Jack Dempsey 8
Joe Louis - 8
Rocky Marciano - 9
Floyd Patterson - 4
Sonny Liston - 8
Muhammad Ali - 10
Joe Frazier - 7
George Foreman - 8
Ken Norton - 5
Larry Holmes - 9
Tim Witherspoon - 7
Mike Tyson - 8
Buster Douglas - 7
Tony Tucker - 8
Ray Mercer - 8
Michael Moorer - 3
Evander Holyfield -9
Riddick Bowe - 8
Lennox Lewis - 8
Vitali Klitschko - Untested
Wladimir Klitschko - 3
David Tua - 10
Oleg Maskaev -3
Hasim Rahman -5
Chris Byrd - 6
Alexander Povetkin - Untested
David Haye - Untested
Tyson Fury - Untested
Deontay Wilder - Untested
Anthony Joshua - Untested

I think Tucker had a pretty good chin. He went the distance with Tyson and Lewis; and was not stopped until he was past it.
Maeskev usually was stopped when he fought anyone who could punch.

Ambling Alp II

Vitali Klitschko, untested? Did you see the bombs Lewis and Sanders hit him with? I think he and McCall are the only hwy champs never to be floored and Vitali did it in 40+ fights, sometimes being old. If he's untested, so is everyone.

Lennox Lewis an 8? Based on being stopped early with limited damage on one punch, that's bunk.

Posted: **26 Jan 2018, 14:05**

When it comes to chins, Tex Cobb has to be considered. Larry Holmes couldn't hurt him over 15 rounds. He lost a split decision to Ken Norton and decisions to Michael Dokes and James Douglas. He beat Ernie Shavers. I saw him on TV in a full contact karate fight and a big dude kicked him square in the face with the bottom of his foot. Cobb just shook his head and kept coming forward.

Posted: **26 Jan 2018, 14:14**

Jack Dempsey - 8
Joe Louis - 7
Rocky Marciano - 9
Floyd Patterson - 4
Sonny Liston - 7
Muhammad Ali - 9
Joe Frazier - 7
George Foreman - 9
Ken Norton - 6
Larry Holmes - 9
Tim Witherspoon - 7
Mike Tyson - 8
Buster Douglas - 6
Tony Tucker - 8
Ray Mercer - 9
Michael Moorer - 5
Evander Holyfield - 9
Riddick Bowe - 7,5
Lennox Lewis - 7
Vitali Klitschko - 9,5
Wladimir Klitschko - 5
David Tua - 9
Oleg Maskaev - 3
Hasim Rahman - 5
Chris Byrd - 7
Alexander Povetkin - 8
David Haye - 6
Tyson Fury - not enough tested, preliminarily - 7
Deontay Wilder - not enough tested, preliminarily - 6,5
Anthony Joshua - not enough tested, preliminarily - 6,5

Posted: **26 Jan 2018, 16:43**

pound per pound wrote: ↑26 Jan 2018, 12:39
Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑22 Jan 2018, 11:53 Jack Dempsey 8
Joe Louis - 8
Rocky Marciano - 9
Floyd Patterson - 4
Sonny Liston - 8
Muhammad Ali - 10
Joe Frazier - 7
George Foreman - 8
Ken Norton - 5
Larry Holmes - 9
Tim Witherspoon - 7
Mike Tyson - 8
Buster Douglas - 7
Tony Tucker - 8
Ray Mercer - 8
Michael Moorer - 3
Evander Holyfield -9
Riddick Bowe - 8
Lennox Lewis - 8
Vitali Klitschko - Untested
Wladimir Klitschko - 3
David Tua - 10
Oleg Maskaev -3
Hasim Rahman -5
Chris Byrd - 6
Alexander Povetkin - Untested
David Haye - Untested
Tyson Fury - Untested
Deontay Wilder - Untested
Anthony Joshua - Untested

I think Tucker had a pretty good chin. He went the distance with Tyson and Lewis; and was not stopped until he was past it.
Maeskev usually was stopped when he fought anyone who could punch.
Ambling Alp II

Vitali Klitschko, untested? Did you see the bombs Lewis and Sanders hit him with? I think he and McCall are the only hwy champs never to be floored and Vitali did it in 40+ fights, sometimes being old. If he's untested, so is everyone.

Lennox Lewis an 8? Based on being stopped early with limited damage on one punch, that's bunk.

Yes I saw the Lewis and Sanders fights. Lewis was terrible in that fight; he didn't have as much on his punches as he usually was, wasn't as accurate and was not able to follow up much. That isn't like going several rounds against a prime Lewis.
I don't buy into the Corrie Sanders myth. He was never considered anything special at all until he blew out Wladimir, who had a glass jaw. Otherwise there is nothing at all to suggest Sanders had any power. Who is the 2nd best guy Sanders ever stopped? Al Cole?

The punch that Lewis got knocked out with from Rahman would have knocked just about anyone out. (You can argue he should not have been hit with it, but that is another story.)
The only time he was went down was against McCall and he got up right away only to have he ref make a ridiculous stoppage.
Lewis fought several hard hitting fighters in his career and was seldom hurt. He didn't have an iron chin but it was decent.

Posted: **26 Jan 2018, 17:43**

Yes I saw the Lewis and Sanders fights. Lewis was terrible in that fight; he didn't have as much on his punches as he usually was, wasn't as accurate and was not able to follow up much. That isn't like going several rounds against a prime Lewis.
I don't buy into the Corrie Sanders myth. He was never considered anything special at all until he blew out Wladimir, who had a glass jaw. Otherwise there is nothing at all to suggest Sanders had any power. Who is the 2nd best guy Sanders ever stopped? Al Cole?

The punch that Lewis got knocked out with from Rahman would have knocked just about anyone out. (You can argue he should not have been hit with it, but that is another story.)
The only time he was went down was against McCall and he got up right away only to have he ref make a ridiculous stoppage.
Lewis fought several hard hitting fighters in his career and was seldom hurt. He didn't have an iron chin but it was decent.

Alp,

Do you see okay or are you biased? Lewis landed a monstrous upper on Vitali who took it well and moment later fired back. He also landed his hook. Sanders can punch, just ask the fighters who fought him. Rhaman said he hit him the hardest and look who he was in with. You'll see many easy KO's on Sanders resume.

Hide, Peter and others hit Vitali. He went nowhere. Yet you say untested?

I don't think Wlad had a good chin either, but he went many years without being stopped and it always took more than one big shot to finish him. He got up. Lewis never did.

Posted: **26 Jan 2018, 18:03**

Tough question. I'm looking and disagreeing with a lot of my own picks.

Posted: **27 Jan 2018, 08:43**

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑26 Jan 2018, 16:43
pound per pound wrote: ↑26 Jan 2018, 12:39
Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑22 Jan 2018, 11:53 Jack Dempsey 8
Joe Louis - 8
Rocky Marciano - 9
Floyd Patterson - 4
Sonny Liston - 8
Muhammad Ali - 10
Joe Frazier - 7
George Foreman - 8
Ken Norton - 5
Larry Holmes - 9
Tim Witherspoon - 7
Mike Tyson - 8
Buster Douglas - 7
Tony Tucker - 8
Ray Mercer - 8
Michael Moorer - 3
Evander Holyfield -9
Riddick Bowe - 8
Lennox Lewis - 8
Vitali Klitschko - Untested
Wladimir Klitschko - 3
David Tua - 10
Oleg Maskaev -3
Hasim Rahman -5
Chris Byrd - 6
Alexander Povetkin - Untested
David Haye - Untested
Tyson Fury - Untested
Deontay Wilder - Untested
Anthony Joshua - Untested

I think Tucker had a pretty good chin. He went the distance with Tyson and Lewis; and was not stopped until he was past it.
Maeskev usually was stopped when he fought anyone who could punch.
Ambling Alp II

Vitali Klitschko, untested? Did you see the bombs Lewis and Sanders hit him with? I think he and McCall are the only hwy champs never to be floored and Vitali did it in 40+ fights, sometimes being old. If he's untested, so is everyone.

Lennox Lewis an 8? Based on being stopped early with limited damage on one punch, that's bunk.
Yes I saw the Lewis and Sanders fights. Lewis was terrible in that fight; he didn't have as much on his punches as he usually was, wasn't as accurate and was not able to follow up much. That isn't like going several rounds against a prime Lewis.
I don't buy into the Corrie Sanders myth. He was never considered anything special at all until he blew out Wladimir, who had a glass jaw. Otherwise there is nothing at all to suggest Sanders had any power. Who is the 2nd best guy Sanders ever stopped? Al Cole?

The punch that Lewis got knocked out with from Rahman would have knocked just about anyone out. (You can argue he should not have been hit with it, but that is another story.)
The only time he was went down was against McCall and he got up right away only to have he ref make a ridiculous stoppage.
Lewis fought several hard hitting fighters in his career and was seldom hurt. He didn't have an iron chin but it was decent.

37-years-old Lewis was slower than he was in his prime and his stamina was afwul in that fight, but he still had all his power intact when he fought Vitali. And he landed at will, especially that great right uppercut. Michael Grant was KTFO'ed with much lesser Lewis' uppercut.

As for Sanders, he was very hard puncher. And, yes, knocking out Al Cole in 73 seconds isn't bad considering the fact that prime Hasim Rahman went the distance against shot 40-years-old Al Cole and didn't hurt him once in 10 rounds.

Posted: **27 Jan 2018, 17:04**

Sorry, I didn't realize that stopping Al Cole was a big deal; or for that matter Samuel Peter and Herbie Hide were brutal punchers. My apologies. Therefore Vitali Klitschko beyond a shadow of a doubt had a great chin.

Posted: **27 Jan 2018, 17:12**

lol its so easy to be unfair isnt it

well lennox hit him but ddnt have anythng on his shots. not a chin test!

what an absolute twat this guy alp is when it comes to vit and wlad. even added some crappy sarcasm too

and i say that very much as a k bro critic

Posted: **27 Jan 2018, 17:27**

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑27 Jan 2018, 17:04 Sorry, I didn't realize that stopping Al Cole was a big deal; or for that matter Samuel Peter and Herbie Hide were brutal punchers. My apologies. Therefore Vitali Klitschko beyond a shadow of a doubt had a great chin.

Marion Wilson said Samuel Peter was the hardest puncher he ever fought (he fought Rahman, McCall, Mercer, Ibeabuchi, Briggs and many others). James Toney also said Peter was much harder puncher than Rahman. Although I don't remember Peter hitting Vitali with a decent punch. But taking that uppercut (and other punches) from Lewis was a great evidence of Vitali's punch resistance. If Vitali had a glass jaw (like Michael Grant), Lewis would knock him out into the next century with that uppercut.

Posted: **27 Jan 2018, 22:06**

I don't think the Lewis fights proves a lot. I don't think his punches had the effect that they had in other fights. He wasn't sharp because he had not trained for the fight and to a lesser extent because was getting old. He was tired very early and didn't have the usual steam on his punches. And no I don't think he landed the exact same punch on Klitschko as he did on Grant.

Never said he had a glass jaw like Michael Grant. Just said that he is unproven. Take a list at the guys on the list that we are rating. Almost all faced much tougher competition than Klitschko. Some had great chins and some didn't. But at least we have much more evidence to go by. With most of the other guys, we can look at several fights against very hard punchers; guys with proven track records, not like Corrie Sanders.

We should not take one or two fights from a fighter's career to show that he was a hard puncher or wasn't. Nor should we cherrypick one or two and try to use it as evidence that he did or did not have have a great chin. We need to take a hard look at the fighter's entire career; taking into consideration the stage of the fighter's career as well as the stage of his opponents career when they fought.

Posted: **29 Jan 2018, 20:24**

jamamb wrote: ↑27 Jan 2018, 17:12 lol its so easy to be unfair isnt it

well lennox hit him but ddnt have anythng on his shots. not a chin test!

what an absolute twat this guy alp is when it comes to vit and wlad. even added some crappy sarcasm too

and i say that very much as a k bro critic

I like to give everyone a chance to explain themselves. Alp struck out with me. He was neither logical or objective.

Hopefully he’s better on other topics.

Posted: **29 Jan 2018, 23:25**

We are miles apart. You have Wladimir Klitschko (6) as having a better chin than Joe Frazier and the same as Joe Louis and Lennox Lewis. If you really believe all that, than I guess we don't have much to talk about.

Posted: **30 Jan 2018, 10:49**

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑29 Jan 2018, 23:25 We are miles apart. You have Wladimir Klitschko (6) as having a better chin than Joe Frazier and the same as Joe Louis and Lennox Lewis. If you really believe all that, than I guess we don't have much to talk about.

Alp,

I throw you a bone and give you a temporary chance to shift the attention away from some of what you said, which isn't true.

I ask you which puncher did Frazier ever beat? Maybe Oscar Bonavena would be the best pick if you call him and puncher. Bonavena he floored him twice, and according to Frazier's own words was close to a TKO stoppage. Frazier was down a few times as an amateur and stopped. He was, floored in his 2nd match as a pro vs. a very weak opponent, and had his knees buckled in others vs. opponents who hardly landed. If Frazier had 60 + fights as Wlad did, he has more KO/TKO losses. But as his career played out, he didn't face any punchers besides Foreman who bounced him off the canvas.

Some say Norton didn't have a good chin. I'd agree, but it's funny how Ali hurt Frazier a few times, but could not do it once to Norton in the same amount of fights.

Louis didn't have a top chin either. A 6 is a little above average which is what I think best describes Louis and Wlad. Keep in mind Wlad fought only big men, and was never floored, hurt or stunned by men below 200 pounds. Billy Conn, who was under 170 pound staggered Joe Louis. Jimmy Braddock who was not a puncher Floored Louis. Wlad only went down from big hitter like Peter, Sanders or Brewster. I don't think Braddock or Conn could hurt him, do you?

Posted: **30 Jan 2018, 12:16**

I believe what I said is true otherwise I would not have said it.
Frazier fought Bonavea twice. The first was early in his career. Yes he got knocked down but at least he got back up to win. In the rematch when he was more experienced, he fought 15 rounds and was not knocked down. Quarry was a good puncher. He fought him 2x and was not knocked down.

Only 3 different opponents ever kncoked Fraizer down. One was George Foreman. I would hope that we could at least agree that Klitschko doesn't stand up to Foreman The other was Bonavena and as you mentioned Mike Bruce. That was his 2nd pro fight. That really doesn't have a much a bearing. Larry Holmes and Ali got knocked down early in their careers as well.

Ali could punch. Not known as a big puncher, but look at all the guys who were hard to stop that he stopped. (He knocked out Foreman who you gave an 8) The 3rd Ali-Frazier was an absolute war. No way in the world Klitschko lasts 14 rounds in that fight.

Yes Norton was hurt less against Ali than Frazier. Two main reasons for that.
1. Norton had an underrated chin as I have said many times. One of boxing great myths that he had a weak one. Nobody was saying that when he was actually fighting.
2. When he fought Ali, they were for the more technical fights than Ali-Frazier fights; especially the 3rd one Ali-Frazier fight. He didn't take near the punishment as Frazier did from Ali.

If Joe Frazier fought the exact same amount of fights against the exact same opponents, he would have been stopped less than Klitschko.

As for Joe Louis, you have to look at his whole career. Yes occasionally, a fighter not noted for his power hurt him. That happens once in awhile in boxing. (Watch Wilfred Benitez vs Maurice Hope for example)
Look at his whole career. Stopped only twice in a long career. Once was when he was way over the hill and it was against an extremely hard puncher.
And no being a heavier fighter doesn't make you a heavier puncher. Many really big heavyweights were not big punchers at all.

Klitschko only went down against big hitters? Really?
So now Ross Purrity was a big hitter?
Williams was a big hitter?
Corrie Sanders, was considered a stiff until he fought Wladimir Klitschko. His whole reputation as a puncher is based on the Klitschko fight.
Lamon Brewster? He was almost unknown when Klitschko got embarrassed by him. Could not even beat glass jaw Clifford Eitenne over 10 rounds. Could not stop Kali Meehan or Charles Shufford or Gary Mason. Now suddenly he also gets a reputation for being a big puncher almost entirely because he stopped Klitschko.

To think Klitschko had a better chin than Joe Frazier and equal to Louis is pretty silly.

.

.

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