BoxRec

Prime Braddock vs Prime Marciano.

Who would win this epic bout?

This would've been bad news for Braddock. He was a tough guy, but he almost always had hand injury issues. I suspect Braddock would've been able to hold his own with Marciano in the early going, but the tenacity and relentless attack of Marciano would break Braddock's resistance down. I figure Marciano would stop him around the 9th or 10th round. Not sure if he'd knock him out necessarily, but I figure there'd come a point when either Braddock wouldn't come out of his corner or the referee would stop it or something like that.

Difficult to say as I'm not sure who Braddock fought in style or worth was like Marciano. He was a tough man, sure, but maybe too tough for his own good. Especially against a guy like Marciano. I figure within 8 rounds Marciano would have worn him down to the point of dropping him and the end wouldn't have been too far off.

Braddock fought as a Light Heavyweight for most of his career so he'd be right up Marciano's ally... Rock fought little guys.

If the Braddock who fought Baer and Lasky showed up I figure it goes 15... Braddock had a very strong chin... He was a better boxer than Marciano... He was taller with a longer reach and could move about the ring better than Rock.

If his hands were as good as they were for Lasky, Baer, and Louis I give him a chance... He decked Louis with a fine shot.. That was the sleek young Brown Bomber JB fought... Not the slow, trudging, fat shell who Charles and Walcott fought.

I think Marciano's superior power would've been a big problem for Braddock.

Jmangho wrote: ↑02 Mar 2018, 02:49 I think Marciano's superior power would've been a big problem for Braddock.

Hmmm...possibly... But Braddock would not be impressed with Marciano's power or his awkward swings... Braddock wasn't the least bit intimidated by Baer's 210-pounds -- or Baer's reputation as a killer puncher... Marciano had never fought any prime fighter who was any good... A man like Braddock wouldn't see a real problem in kicking his butt.

And you can't buy into to the hype if you want to beat anybody... You see the fighter who's really there - not the myth.

Like Buster Douglas sizing up his chances against Mike Tyson - who had never lost... Buster was a 42 - 1 underdog and even his friends thought he'd get flattened... Douglas scoffed that... He knew he was bigger, taller, faster, stronger, more skilled, and could fight inside and outside better than Mike... He could defend himself better than Mikey could... "I'm going to beat Tyson something terrible.. I can't see it going the distance." .... A lot of people thought Buster was a Fruit Loop - but in fact, if you take a real close look at the best prime Heavyweights Mike fought to that point - it wasn't overwhelming.

Kalan, fact of business is this, Braddock never fought anyone quite like Marciano in terms of style or worth. Baer could have been great, but he wasn't 100% every time out, whereas Marciano always gave 100%. That's why Marciano is a top ten Heavyweight and Baer isn't.

And quite frankly Baer's style and Marciano's style are completely different, and Baer usually threw one big bomb at a time, whereas Marciano was unloading everything but the kitchen sink from start to finish. Conditioning and ferocity plays huge parts in these kinds of hypothetical matches, and seldom was anybody (regardless of division) as conditioned or as explosive as Marciano.

You're not going to sell me on the Marciano myth...

I watched Marciano fight live in the 1950's... I watched Marciano's poor effort against Light Heavyweight Archie Moore many times... I watched Floyd Patterson mop the floor with Moore when he was only 21 years old... Archie couldn't take it... Floyd didn't hit the deck... He didn't have any trouble with the old Light Heavyweight.

Feather hitting Light Heavyweight, Jimmy Slade, wiped the floor with Don Cockell... He knocked him kicking in only 4 rounds... Middleweight Randy Turpin also knocked Don Cockell out... How does a chinny Light Heavyweight hang in there with Marciano for 9 rounds when he's supposed to be outta there in a couple?

Myth? Tell that to Muhammad Ali.

I've explained that Moore-Patterson bullshit more than I care to remember. Moore focused solely on Marciano, whereas he considered Patterson to be nothing and fought nearly a dozen times that year prior to Patterson. That takes it's toll, especially against a young man who already was a top notch light heavyweight in his own right.

Besides, let's not forget all the ducking and dodging Patterson did as champion. He wanted no part of Eddie Machen for years. He avoided Liston for years. He instead fought hand picked deadmen. And if we're going to talk about the mob and shady dealings, Cus D'Amato was absolutely no saint with his manipulation of the IBC.

True... Cus D'Amato guided and matched Patterson almost as carefully as Marciano was matched... D'Amato didn't match his top boxers against guys they were likely to beat... He matched them with guys they were certain to beat...

D'Amato made no bones about wanting a Marciano fight for Patterson... He knew his youngster was too fast and too skilled for Rocky... Cus knew their would be a ton of punches in Marciano's face and Patterson would chop the man down... Rocky needed rounds and rounds to get weak opponents like Don Cockell and old Archie Moore out of there.

Remember Mike Tyson? ... Mike didn't fight many Light Heavyweights like Rocky did... But he fought one named Michael Spinks, the greatest Light Heavyweight of all time -- who beat Larry Holmes twice and happened to be undefeated... MS was Lineal Heavyweight Champion of the World when Tyson fought him in a Unification Fight... Spinks lasted 90 seconds...

That's what an ATG Heavyweight Champion who also has ATG punching power does to the Light Heavyweight Champ.

He gets rid of him PRONTO!!! It's over before it starts... He need not whale away like his life is at stake on a guy who's been knocked out 17 times -- getting knocked down and punched around by a little Light Heavyweight.

Difference between Spinks and Moore is the fact that Archie defeated many credible heavyweights and was still reigning as the 175 pound champion for years after Marciano and Patterson. Spinks knew he was only good against certain guys at certain times, which is why he avoided Tucker like the plague. One can make the argument Spinks didn't really beat Holmes the first time, let alone the second time. The only thing that stands out for him was his win over an inactive, full blown drug addict version of Gerry Cooney. Fact of business Spinks only went after Tyson because the money was insane (for the time) and nothing else. He had bad knees and a bad back and was scared shitless of Mike before the bell even rang. He didn't even try. Archie Moore, on the other hand, even when he was well passed it was the kind of man who dug deep and you had to blast him brutally for him to be stopped. That's a key difference between him and Spinks.

Moore used every trick and fought as hard, if not harder than ever in his life, against Marciano. He campaigned so long for it and defeated many top contenders, and trained very hard. Still, from the fourth-fifth round onwards it was obvious that he was outgunned. It was nothing but heart that kept him standing against the brutal onslaught of Marciano.

As for your insistence that Cus D'Amato wanted a Marciano fight, I disagree. He blocked Marciano from facing Ingemar Johansson, and he sure wasn't interested in Rocky fighting Floyd. The Rock commented several times in interviews that he was interested in fighting either man if the money was right. But D'Amato and his influence over the IBC stopped the comeback dead in it's tracks.

Besides, Marciano, when Floyd was still a light heavyweight offered to fight Patterson on the Gillette Cavalcade of Sports in an exhibition fight. This was immediately after Archie Moore. The fight ultimately was scrapped because investors were only interested if Marciano defended the title, and at the time Patterson was NOT a ranked heavyweight. So Marciano waited for deals with Bob Baker and Nino Valdes, but they put on such a horrible performance against one another they were both suspended by the commission. So Marciano waited to close a deal with Canada's Earl Walls, but that too fell through. So Marciano ultimately said that he was done with boxing because nobody was around who could generate the money worthwhile.

By THAT time Patterson did become a top ranked heavyweight and Marciano acknowledged he was probably the man to beat because he had beaten Marciano's chief sparring partner Tommy Jackson. But nobody was quite sold on the soft spoken former light heavyweight, which is why odds were highly in Moore's favor because he had only a handful of bouts at heavyweight.

It wouldn't really be until Patterson fought and lost to Johansson, then won the rematch, did he become respected and become a moneymaker, and Marciano became interested in fighting either man though he hoped it'd be Johansson because the style suited Marciano better.

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑03 Mar 2018, 03:03 It was nothing but heart that kept him [Archie Moore] standing against the brutal onslaught of Marciano.

As for your insistence that Cus D'Amato wanted a Marciano fight, I disagree. He blocked Marciano from facing Ingemar Johansson, and he sure wasn't interested in Rocky fighting Floyd.

Nothing but Moore's heart kept him standing??? ... How about Rocky's weak, overrated power keeping him standing??? Moore had been knocked out in the 1st round before... and prime Charles knocked Moore out... Most big Heavyweights with big power hit a Light Heavyweight and they go SPLAT!!! like Patterson did with Liston and Spinks did with Tyson...

Modern Heavyweight Champions of 2018 don't even fight Light Heavyweights -- because they're too big and strong.

You're lying about Rocky wanting to fight Patterson or Johansson... He wanted no part of them because he wasn't motivated... Watch from 4:00 to 5:10 or this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kL1Z9KmYJIg Rocky's own words.

Not exactly an expert on either, but I'm honest surprised ayone doesn't think if Marciano as way more skilled than Baer.

Kalan wrote: ↑05 Mar 2018, 20:00

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑03 Mar 2018, 03:03 It was nothing but heart that kept him [Archie Moore] standing against the brutal onslaught of Marciano.

As for your insistence that Cus D'Amato wanted a Marciano fight, I disagree. He blocked Marciano from facing Ingemar Johansson, and he sure wasn't interested in Rocky fighting Floyd.

Nothing but Moore's heart kept him standing??? ... How about Rocky's weak, overrated power keeping him standing??? Moore had been knocked out in the 1st round before... and prime Charles knocked Moore out... Most big Heavyweights with big power hit a Light Heavyweight and they go SPLAT!!! like Patterson did with Liston and Spinks did with Tyson...

Modern Heavyweight Champions of 2018 don't even fight Light Heavyweights -- because they're too big and strong.

You're lying about Rocky wanting to fight Patterson or Johansson... He wanted no part of them because he wasn't motivated... Watch from 4:00 to 5:10 or this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kL1Z9KmYJIg Rocky's own words.

Tell it to Lou Duva and many others around at the time. Marciano was in training camp, was working on contracts for the winner of Patterson-Johansson, but D'Amato blocked him.

You gotta understand something, there was four different Marciano's. The one that the public saw, the one his family saw, the one his trainers saw, and then himself when nobody was looking. All four was Marciano, but to different degrees. He said everywhere that Louis was his hero, etc. but among friends? "No N-WORD is ever going to beat me." What he said in public about Patterson, especially on television, was far different than what he truly felt.

As for his underrated power, tell it to Moore as to who hit him the hardest. Tell it to Louis who said hit him the hardest. Etc etc etc. They all say Marciano. The only difference between his punches and others was his didn't always have that finesse, that snap, etc. but his punches were so good that people's arms went dead on them trying to block. It's also a matter of physics, it took some time for him to get inside and be effective. So of course it'd take some rounds to do the job because he only had a 68" reach ffs.

Bullshitt all the way.... Louis said Baer hit the hardest and Braddock hit the 2nd hardest... Patterson definitely hit Moore harder than Marciano did... Charles wouldn't say that because Walcott flattened him with one shot.

Marciano couldn't generate much power with those little short arms (his reach was 67" NOT 68") and that little body... That's why it took so long for him to KO little tiny guys... Tyson crushed guys who had never been knocked out before in 90 seconds... Liston smashed Patterson out with thunderous punches within a round twice.... Rocky took all night to get Don Cockell out and feather hitting Light Heavyweight, Jimmy Slade, (17% KO ratio) smashed Cockell out in a couple of rounds.

I also don't think Rocky used the N-word... I think he was a man of good character... And you heard the video... Rocky said he took a vacation and went away to train - and just wasn't up to it anymore... I don't think he would lie.

Cripes....I've got to stop believing my own eyes. Cuz it shur luks like Rawky could pummel perdy gud.

Or was that shot of Walcotts face being distorted out of all perporshion the first phodoshoppt picture?

I'll bet it wus da furst FAK NOOZ!!! Way before Trump arrived.

Sorry fer my spelling....but it appears that everything we know is wrong. So I dun figured maybe the way I'm spelling in this kontrabushion is actually the RIYT way to spell.

Hey Kayland....whuds yer apinion on dat?

I dink you dun hit dat nale riyt on da hayead

Marciano was a freak of nature, as was Tyson. To doubt the Rock's power is either the dumbest thing (almost) I've heard, or the greatest contrarian call in history.

BoxBuzz wrote: ↑09 Mar 2018, 17:09 Cripes....I've got to stop believing my own eyes. Cuz it shur luks like Rawky could pummel perdy gud.

Or was that shot of Walcotts face being distorted out of all perporshion the first phodoshoppt picture?

I'll bet it wus da furst FAK NOOZ!!! Way before Trump arrived.

Sorry fer my spelling....but it appears that everything we know is wrong. So I dun figured maybe the way I'm spelling in this kontrabushion is actually the RIYT way to spell.

Hey Kayland....whuds yer apinion on dat?

BuzzBox... That's a good name for you BTW, cuz you only amuse yourself... People with lame vision, slow mental gears, and who drown in 50's nostalgia are going to believe what they want to believe... It took Rocky 13 rounds to deck the ancient and well hammered (He'd been knocked out 5 X in previously fights) Walcott... Rocky knocked him to a knee with a right and then knocked him over with a left hook... In contrast, prime Ingemar Johansson had NEVER been knocked out previous to his rematch with Patterson... One (1) shot in an early round knocked Ingo a lot colder than Walcott was finished.

And seeing how Patterson also took out Archie Moore a lot faster than Rocky did (without getting floored), I judge his punching power to be quite a bit greater than the Rock's -- possibly the reason why Rocky wasn't anxious to fight him.