BoxRec

Heretic wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 04:53 Having few guys stand well above the others make it seem that way.

If the division was really that weak we would see cruisers flocking into HW and doing well there.

Also there being lack of American heavyweights will make the division look like weak one for the yanks

ajwesty13 wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 03:37 Put aside quickly how close the boxers seem level wise..... Is the heavyweight division currently the weakest its ever been In living memory?

Heretic wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 04:53 Having few guys stand well above the others make it seem that way.

ajwesty13 wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 03:37 Put aside quickly how close the boxers seem level wise..... Is the heavyweight division currently the weakest its ever been In living memory?

punchoutsb wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 11:46 It's dreadful, though I couldn't confidently say it's the weakest. It's definitely much weaker than the preceding few eras though.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 11:54

punchoutsb wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 11:46 It's dreadful, though I couldn't confidently say it's the weakest. It's definitely much weaker than the preceding few eras though.

Depends on what you want to call "An era" I suppose.

The Heavyweight division has been pretty weak the entire time I've been a Boxing fan honestly. There's never been more than a handful of particularly good Heavyweights active at the same time, and usually NOT EVEN a handful.

punchoutsb wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 12:03

gilgamesh wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 11:54

punchoutsb wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 11:46 It's dreadful, though I couldn't confidently say it's the weakest. It's definitely much weaker than the preceding few eras though.

Depends on what you want to call "An era" I suppose.

The Heavyweight division has been pretty weak the entire time I've been a Boxing fan honestly. There's never been more than a handful of particularly good Heavyweights active at the same time, and usually NOT EVEN a handful.

A handful of good heavyweights is pretty close to a golden era. A handful of decent heavyweights is likely above average. A single great heavy ups an era considerably, but the real strength comes from the contenders IMO, and that is where this current generation falls flat. The top is thin as cheap toilet paper and the contenders are hot garbage.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 12:06

punchoutsb wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 12:03

gilgamesh wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 11:54

Depends on what you want to call "An era" I suppose.

The Heavyweight division has been pretty weak the entire time I've been a Boxing fan honestly. There's never been more than a handful of particularly good Heavyweights active at the same time, and usually NOT EVEN a handful.

A handful of good heavyweights is pretty close to a golden era. A handful of decent heavyweights is likely above average. A single great heavy ups an era considerably, but the real strength comes from the contenders IMO, and that is where this current generation falls flat. The top is thin as cheap toilet paper and the contenders are hot garbage.

No argument there. The Contenders in this era are definitely crap, and there's no discernible difference between the guy ranked 8 and the guy ranked 20 honestly. Feels like an era where any of "The Other guys" could beat each other, but worse, most of them won't even fight each other.

We're finally getting some contender vs contender matches sorta with Whyte vs Browne recently and now Jarrell Miller vs Duhaupas, but these guys should be fighting each other with regularity.

ValMar wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 12:03 The Holmes' era (between Ali and Tyson) has been much weaker. Holmes, in his prime, would have less than 5% chance to beat recent Wilder, Joshua and Fury.
The Wlad's era has been a bit weaker. I don't want to diminish Wlad's achievement, but in his mature phase he fought only two serious opponents - Peter and Haye.
Tyson/Lewis/Holyfield era has been much better, There is not any dilemma.

Boxing Writer wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 14:44

ValMar wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 12:03 The Holmes' era (between Ali and Tyson) has been much weaker. Holmes, in his prime, would have less than 5% chance to beat recent Wilder, Joshua and Fury.
The Wlad's era has been a bit weaker. I don't want to diminish Wlad's achievement, but in his mature phase he fought only two serious opponents - Peter and Haye.
Tyson/Lewis/Holyfield era has been much better, There is not any dilemma.

Povetkin and Ibragimov were good opponents too. Pulev and Chagaev weren't bad also.

Also, I strongly disagree about Larry Holmes. At 42 he easily beat 30 y.o. Ray Mercer, who gave a hell to prime Lennox Lewis 4 or 5 years later. At 45 Holmes lost by the closest margin to Oliver McCall, who stopped Lewis in 2 rounds in his previous fight.

Tyson/Lewis/Holyfield era was much better, but the level of division wasn't the same for all 15 or 17 years while it lasted. It reached its peak in 1995-1996, when Holyfield, Tyson and Bowe were slightly past their primes but still very good, Lennox Lewis was entering his own prime, and a buch of young talented guys emerged on the horizont - Ibeabuchi, Tua, Byrd, Klitschko brothers. Also there were a lot of good fighters like Moorer, Mercer, Old Foreman. In the periods from 1986 to 1990 or 1999 to 2003 HW division wasn't as strong as in mid 90s.

ajwesty13 wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 03:37 Put aside quickly how close the boxers seem level wise..... Is the heavyweight division currently the weakest its ever been In living memory?

Rob3_142 wrote: ↑06 Apr 2018, 09:07 I think Klitschko losing to Fury, and subsequently retiring was the end of the last era. That means the new era is really only 12-18 months old, with many of the 30-somethings (Povetkin, Ortiz, Haye etc.) Being replaced with the Joshua's, Parker's, Fury's of the world.

We won't know how good this era is until the new crop come through, which will be the best part of 5 years.

Thomastearns wrote: ↑06 Apr 2018, 15:37 The lack of strength in depth in the current HW division is largely down down to the lack of elite American fighters since Tyson. The US virtually owned the division for decades up til then. Even Johansson was seen as no more than the nearest of blips. There is no strength of depth in current US (HW) boxing.

If you can argue that a peak Wladimir Klitschko would mop the floor with both Wilder and Joshua then you have to either accept that standards have fallen, or that Klitschko was an all time peak. I'd go for the former.

In recent decades the US have won nothing in the larger weight divisions at the Olympics since 1988 (Mercer), Wilder himself only won bronze in 2008. Just look at some of the names of the gold medallists since - Solis, Usyk (HW) and Lewis, W Klitschko, Povetkin, Joshua (SHW).

If Wilder could beat Joshua he might be able to stage a revival in US boxing health. He has the charisma and personality, but its going to take a lot to get kids in America to leave the temptations of gang culture to endure the rigours of the gym.

The balance of power has shifted but the vacuum left by America's decline will take some filling.

johnswan1 wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 03:43 No, it was weaker during Wlad's reign.

Heretic wrote: ↑05 Apr 2018, 04:53 Having few guys stand well above the others make it seem that way.

If the division was really that weak we would see cruisers flocking into HW and doing well there.

Also there being lack of American heavyweights will make the division look like weak one for the yanks