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HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 06 Aug 2018, 04:35
by Ruthless-RKO
A good article from Paul Magno..
Well. That wasn’t the best way to build towards a Kovalev-Bivol light heavyweight super-fight, was it?
Last week, I was torn to shreds after posting an article questioning HBO’s matchmaking acumen for showcasing their star light heavyweight properties, Sergey Kovalev and Dmitry Bivol, against stylistically unfavorable opposition. For pointing out that Eleider Alvarez and Isaac Chilemba were almost guaranteed to kill any buzz leading to HBO’s planned Kovalev-Bivol war, I was called everything from the polite “Debbie Downer” to the not-so-polite “pompous asshole.”
But I was right.
And I was right to a greater degree than I could’ve imagined. Not only would the Kovalev-Bivol buzz be diminished, but HBO’s inept matchmaking would downright kill it.
I’ll be honest—I didn’t see Alvarez knocking out Kovalev. I knew there was a slight chance that the Colombia-born Canadian resident could outbox the “Krusher,” but I (along with the rest of the boxing world) never imagined he could drop him three times en route to a TKO 7 win.
What I did know, however, was that Alvarez was a superb boxer and a born spoiler with the kinds of skills that could make a master of war like Kovalev look like a doubt-ridden second tier player. My take was that Alvarez would do enough to make the Russian look bad, but that Sergey would last the full twelve and win the judges over with his stabs at aggression.
But, yeah, being nullified and THEN knocked out was way worse for HBO’s plans to put together a legitimately salable all-Russia, champ vs. champ 175 lb. war.
As for HBO’s piss-poor matchmaking for Bivol, well, at least it wasn’t a total crash-your-plane-into-the-side-of-the-mountain disaster.
The 27-year-old Bivol ended up taking a unanimous decision over professional wet blanket, Chilemba, but not before being pulled off his pedestal, at least temporarily.
At the beginning of HBO’s telecast on Saturday night, fans were treated to Lamps and Kels doing their usual hard sell of HBO property, swooning at Bivol’s awesomeness and stopping just short of offering a reach-around. If you had closed your eyes, you’d have sworn that Bivol was administering a most brutal beating to Chilemba rather than merely winning early rounds with a measured and somewhat tentative aggression.
By the later rounds, however, it was hard to hide the fact that Chilemba was Chilembaing and Bivol was becoming devalued by the minute.
“Bivol isn’t putting on the kind of show compelling us to talk about the action in the ring,” Kellerman would say in the eleventh round, against a backdrop of random jeers and derisive whistles from the crowd at the Hard Rock in Atlantic City.
The less-than-explosive performance from Bivol brought out the “he needs to develop…he’s green” talk from Lamps and Kels, while unofficial scorer Harold Lederman closed out the show by giving the last three rounds to Chilemba.
But this shouldn’t have been a real shocker to anyone who knows a bit about matchmaking or style match-ups. Bivol looked “blah” against a guy who has built a career out of making opponents look “blah.”
The 31-year-old Malawi-born South African had lost three of four coming into this bout, but hadn’t taken any real punishment in almost two years and, as a long and large light heavyweight with a good chin and outstanding defensive instincts, he could be expected to hang around for a bit.
HBO clearly expected Chilemba to be at the starting point of a steep decline and likely to be overwhelmed by someone like Bivol. But HBO clearly doesn’t know what the hell they’re doing.
An argument could be made that Bivol will be a better fighter for having fought a spoiler like Chilemba and I wouldn’t disagree with that. But fighting this fight now, when the objective was to build up steam towards a battle with Kovalev, was stupid.
And that was my point all along.
Why the hell would the brain trust at HBO Boxing pick two spoilers as opponents for their big light heavyweight double-header showcase? Why pick opponents guaranteed to make Kovalev and Bivol look bad when the idea was to build towards a very compelling and fan-friendly Kovalev vs. Bivol war? Again, as I wrote last week, the answer probably has something to do with HBO Boxing’s general ineptitude.
The end result of this matchmaking mistake is that HBO (and the fans) will miss out on a very marketable and entertaining Kovalev-Bivol fight. Kovalev may be finished as a main stage fighter and Bivol leaves Atlantic City as LESS of a star than when he arrived.
It’s also no guarantee that the Al Haymon-advised Eleider Alvarez won’t take the WBO belt he won from Kovalev to PBC-friendly territory (where there are plenty of big fight options), leaving Bivol without anyone to fight and HBO without anyone to match against their usually entertaining offensive powerhouse.
All of this because of someone’s odd matchmaking decision at HBO Boxing. It was such a bad decision that you almost have to consider that it might be intentional self-sabotage.
But, really, why would anyone at HBO Boxing need to sink their own ship when its captains keep crashing into icebergs?
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 06 Aug 2018, 04:56
by DrDuke
Still Bivol-Alvarez sounds good, why not to make it now? I guess, the only real obstacle for that is the rematch clause of Kovalev-Alvarez.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 06 Aug 2018, 05:11
by Ruthless-RKO
DrDuke wrote: ↑06 Aug 2018, 04:56
Still Bivol-Alvarez sounds good, why not to make it now? I guess, the only real obstacle for that is the rematch clause of Kovalev-Alvarez.
Duva said there might not be an immediate rematch.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 06 Aug 2018, 05:59
by IRLangmaid25
I dont think it was sabotage or stupidity. Just someone who had been after a world title crack against Adonis Stevenson the WBC title holder, was made to step aside for over two years, who inevitably went sod it went down the WBO route and grabbed his opportunity.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 06 Aug 2018, 06:02
by Enlightened-One
HBO are struggling to effectively cover the sport of boxing and their lack of focus and investment is seemingly affecting their ratings.
I agree with the general sentiments conveyed by this article.
I also strongly suspect that Eleider Alvarez will take his belt back to the PBC/Showtime if Sergey Kovalev refrains from exercising his immediate rematch clause, which will result in Dmitry Bivol having an extremely limited roster of opponents to face on HBO.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 06 Aug 2018, 06:04
by lazboy
Very poor article! Who cares If they were matched with spoilers or tough opponents. Do we need more manufactured cherry picking. We got a good fight in Kovalev Alvarez with shocking drama - that’s how boxing should be, the best fighting the best not the best navigating and prolonging. Let’s see the fights now. Bivol also needed this kind of fight, he will improve rather than facing tomato can fodder. Let’s see more tough fights, more shocking loses, keep the sport alive in the present not a once a year mega fight that generally doesn’t happen or live up to the hype - let’s see what these fighters are made of!
You have two options in that poll, how about add WWE or Boxing ffs.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 06 Aug 2018, 06:16
by Enlightened-One
lazboy wrote: ↑06 Aug 2018, 06:04
Very poor article! Who cares If they were matched with spoilers or tough opponents. Do we need more manufactured cherry picking. We got a good fight in Kovalev Alvarez with shocking drama - that’s how boxing should be, the best fighting the best not the best navigating and prolonging. Let’s see the fights now. Bivol also needed this kind of fight, he will improve rather than facing tomato can fodder. Let’s see more tough fights, more shocking loses, keep the sport alive in the present not a once a year mega fight that generally doesn’t happen or live up to the hype - let’s see what these fighters are made of!
You have two options in that poll, how about add WWE or Boxing ffs.
Your argument is from a sporting perspective, which I can show a certain amount of empathy for, but the commercial reality is that mainstream casual fight fans must be entertained and become excited about watching bouts, which will draw ratings and improve advertising revenue for the TV networks.
If the sport of boxing is perceived as being a lucrative venture by the TV networks, then they’ll invest more money to make the biggest fights happen.
I believe the complaints about the poor matchmaking are reasonable and I am also disappointed about HBO’s lack of effort to market this fight card, because the media and the fight fans (especially this forum) weren’t discussing Sergey’s bout against Alvarez.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 06 Aug 2018, 06:16
by Mexi-Box
Article isn't all that great. Who the hell thought Alvarez could seriously outbox Kovalev? Do people still think Kovalev is some one-dimensional puncher? Kovalev outboxed Ward in the first fight.
That punch was the only way Alvarez could've won that fight. Also, why are people so hard on Bivol. Who the hell has looked good against Chilemba? The man arguably beat Alvarez ffs.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 06 Aug 2018, 06:22
by Ruthless-RKO
Mexi-Box wrote: ↑06 Aug 2018, 06:16
That punch was the only way Alvarez could've won that fight. Also, why are people so hard on Bivol. Who the hell has looked good against Chilemba? The man arguably beat Alvarez ffs.
And it's exactly how he won the fight too.
Enlightened-One wrote: ↑06 Aug 2018, 06:16
I believe the complaints about the poor matchmaking are reasonable and I am also disappointed about HBO’s lack of effort to market this fight card, because the media and the fight fans (especially this forum) weren’t discussing Sergey’s bout against Alvarez.
Since the 2nd Ward fight, the forum hardly discusses Kovalev altogether.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 06 Aug 2018, 06:29
by lazboy
Enlightened-One wrote: ↑06 Aug 2018, 06:16
lazboy wrote: ↑06 Aug 2018, 06:04
Very poor article! Who cares If they were matched with spoilers or tough opponents. Do we need more manufactured cherry picking. We got a good fight in Kovalev Alvarez with shocking drama - that’s how boxing should be, the best fighting the best not the best navigating and prolonging. Let’s see the fights now. Bivol also needed this kind of fight, he will improve rather than facing tomato can fodder. Let’s see more tough fights, more shocking loses, keep the sport alive in the present not a once a year mega fight that generally doesn’t happen or live up to the hype - let’s see what these fighters are made of!
You have two options in that poll, how about add WWE or Boxing ffs.
Your argument is from a sporting perspective, which I can show a certain amount of empathy for, but the commercial reality is that mainstream casual fight fans must be entertained and become excited about watching bouts, which will draw ratings and improve advertising revenue for the TV networks.
If the sport of boxing is perceived as being a lucrative venture by the TV networks, then they’ll invest more money to make the biggest fights happen.
I believe the complaints about the poor matchmaking are reasonable and I am also disappointed about HBO’s lack of effort to market this fight card, because the media and the fight fans (especially this forum) weren’t discussing Sergey’s bout against Alvarez.
Listen!! It was a good fun fight to watch you can’t deny that (Alvarez Kovalev). I’m not sure if you ever watched 90s heavyweights. Lots of turmoil which made it great viewing. We need more turmoil which will in turn make the fighters better.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 07 Aug 2018, 09:19
by caldo2025
It was definitely a sabotage and made no sense to make this fight. The main event this night should have been Kovalev and Bivol if HBO was smart. Can you imagine how brightly Bivol's star would be shining if he took out Kovalev like Alvarez did? So instead of showcasing 2 of their fighters, they passed the shine onto a Haymon boxer while losing Kovalev from any future earnings and Bivol's boring performance put a halt to any fan friendly progress he was having.
This was clearly a horrible night for HBO. I dont' think that there's any question about it. This author is right on.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 09 Aug 2018, 01:32
by Mexi-Box
caldo2025 wrote: ↑07 Aug 2018, 09:19
It was definitely a sabotage and made no sense to make this fight. The main event this night should have been Kovalev and Bivol if HBO was smart. Can you imagine how brightly Bivol's star would be shining if he took out Kovalev like Alvarez did? So instead of showcasing 2 of their fighters, they passed the shine onto a Haymon boxer while losing Kovalev from any future earnings and Bivol's boring performance put a halt to any fan friendly progress he was having.
This was clearly a horrible night for HBO. I dont' think that there's any question about it. This author is right on.
The author is a damn fool. What is with these retarded articles talking about sabotage? It's a retarded statement. Fighting best vs. best is now sabotage!? What utter garbage, and you should be ashamed for even remotely agreeing with this author.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 09 Aug 2018, 05:42
by caldo2025
Mexi-Box wrote: ↑09 Aug 2018, 01:32
caldo2025 wrote: ↑07 Aug 2018, 09:19
It was definitely a sabotage and made no sense to make this fight. The main event this night should have been Kovalev and Bivol if HBO was smart. Can you imagine how brightly Bivol's star would be shining if he took out Kovalev like Alvarez did? So instead of showcasing 2 of their fighters, they passed the shine onto a Haymon boxer while losing Kovalev from any future earnings and Bivol's boring performance put a halt to any fan friendly progress he was having.
This was clearly a horrible night for HBO. I dont' think that there's any question about it. This author is right on.
The author is a damn fool. What is with these retarded articles talking about sabotage? It's a retarded statement. Fighting best vs. best is now sabotage!? What utter garbage, and you should be ashamed for even remotely agreeing with this author.
First off, no one says "retarded" anymore. Only completely ignorant people do and you used it twice so congrats? You think Kovalev vs. Alvarez was the best fighting the best? The whole reasoning behind this charade was to build Bivol into another GGG type of star and HBO blew it. That's not even up for debate, it's a fact. They should have made the Kov/Bivol fight but they tried one more fight to build more storm for it and both of HBO's fighters took steps backwards in fans eyes. It's a matter of dollars and cents bro and if you can't understand that then read some books.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 09 Aug 2018, 12:24
by Mexi-Box
caldo2025 wrote: ↑09 Aug 2018, 05:42
Mexi-Box wrote: ↑09 Aug 2018, 01:32
caldo2025 wrote: ↑07 Aug 2018, 09:19
It was definitely a sabotage and made no sense to make this fight. The main event this night should have been Kovalev and Bivol if HBO was smart. Can you imagine how brightly Bivol's star would be shining if he took out Kovalev like Alvarez did? So instead of showcasing 2 of their fighters, they passed the shine onto a Haymon boxer while losing Kovalev from any future earnings and Bivol's boring performance put a halt to any fan friendly progress he was having.
This was clearly a horrible night for HBO. I dont' think that there's any question about it. This author is right on.
The author is a damn fool. What is with these retarded articles talking about sabotage? It's a retarded statement. Fighting best vs. best is now sabotage!? What utter garbage, and you should be ashamed for even remotely agreeing with this author.
First off, no one says "retarded" anymore. Only completely ignorant people do and you used it twice so congrats? You think Kovalev vs. Alvarez was the best fighting the best? The whole reasoning behind this charade was to build Bivol into another GGG type of star and HBO blew it. That's not even up for debate, it's a fact. They should have made the Kov/Bivol fight but they tried one more fight to build more storm for it and both of HBO's fighters took steps backwards in fans eyes. It's a matter of dollars and cents bro and if you can't understand that then read some books.
Stopped reading here. You are one of the worst posters on this site.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 09 Aug 2018, 13:43
by gilgamesh
I don't see is as a case of Self Sabotage. It was just an upset. It happens. In a sport where 2 guys are punching each other trying to knock each other out. The best laid plans don't always work out.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 09 Aug 2018, 16:00
by KiwiRider
According to Alverez's team, the game plan was to wait until Kov gassed out and land the big overhand. They had been practcing that punch over and over in the gym. The only surprise from their viewpoint was how early Kov slowed down.
Now if a guy has a plan, sticks to it and causes an upset, who has the right to claim anything other than "well done"?
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 11 Aug 2018, 03:46
by Thomastearns
Boxing has always been full of difficult to beat journeymen with awkward, un-fan friendly styles, (no not just Floyd Mayweather).
I doubt Chilemba v Alvarez would be a instant sellout.
However it's a part of sport that you still have to defeat these so-called spoilers. HBO, like most of us reckoned these were low profile but safe prelim fights carrying little risk. Perhaps they should have kept a closer eye on Kovalev if they were really concerned about their future investment plans. Anyone can be wise after the event.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 12 Aug 2018, 09:33
by caldo2025
Mexi-Box wrote: ↑09 Aug 2018, 12:24
caldo2025 wrote: ↑09 Aug 2018, 05:42
Mexi-Box wrote: ↑09 Aug 2018, 01:32
The author is a damn fool. What is with these retarded articles talking about sabotage? It's a retarded statement. Fighting best vs. best is now sabotage!? What utter garbage, and you should be ashamed for even remotely agreeing with this author.
First off, no one says "retarded" anymore. Only completely ignorant people do and you used it twice so congrats? You think Kovalev vs. Alvarez was the best fighting the best? The whole reasoning behind this charade was to build Bivol into another GGG type of star and HBO blew it. That's not even up for debate, it's a fact. They should have made the Kov/Bivol fight but they tried one more fight to build more storm for it and both of HBO's fighters took steps backwards in fans eyes. It's a matter of dollars and cents bro and if you can't understand that then read some books.
Stopped reading here. You are one of the worst posters on this site.
Lol. Like I care what a dipshiit like u thinks. Stop reading my brilliance then. Can’t help yourself ha? That means that I’m a great poster. U hate me but still have do read my stuff.
Re: HBO: Self-Sabotage or Stupidity Sinks Kovalev-Bivol Ship
Posted: 13 Aug 2018, 07:23
by Enlightened-One
"Dougie’s Monday mailbag (HBO’s woes)" (Doug Fischer: The RING):
"THE SLOW DEATH OF HBO BOXING"
I think the word I used in that previous mailbag post was “rebuilding,” but it doesn’t seem like the network has built anything lasting in the past year, so it doesn’t look good for HBO’s boxing program.
The network’s sports budget was limited during AT&T’s merger with Time Warner, which hurt its boxing programming and turned away hardcore fans, and with AT&T’s zeal to compete with Netflix it wouldn’t surprise many in the industry if HBO was forced to get out of the boxing business within the next year or two.
I used to take these rumors with a grain of salt because I’d heard them for almost 10 years, but things are different now. There have been radical changes in recent months, including HBO being acquired by AT&T, Top Rank’s move to ESPN (and the recent seven-year extension of their partnership), the launch of ESPN+, and the emergence of DAZN in the U.S. market. The corporate pressure/budget limitations and network/streaming competition might be too much to overcome. Personally, I felt that HBO needed to land Anthony Joshua to turn things around, but it doesn’t look like that’s going to happen now.
HBO has two major attractions with Canelo and GGG, as you noted, but all the other boxers that move the needle seem to be tied up with network rivals or other promotional/media ventures. These middleweight stars need other dance partners.
But despite the gloomy forecast, I still think there’s time for HBO to right the ship. They should start with the 160-pound division and do business with Fɍȁnk Wȁɍɍȅn for Billy Joe Saunders’ services. If the unbeaten WBO titleholder beats Demetrius Andrade (not an easy task), he can be made into a marketable B-side to the Canelo-GGG2 winner. HBO viewers witnessed him take David Lemieux to school in December, so they know he’s for real. Plus, Billy Joe’s got the gift of gab. He can help promote any major showdown.
I think the network should work closely with Zanfer, too, and showcase Jaime Munguia (who looks set to appear on the Canelo-GGG2 PPV undercard) as much as possible. At some point — probably sooner rather than later – the young Tijuana badass is going to move to middleweight where a showdown with the redhead would be one of the biggest all-Mexican prize fights in recent memory. If the Canelo-Golovkin winner seeks to fulfill the WBC mandatory defense against Jermall Charlo, I think it would behoove the network to help his promoter win the purse bid so they could broadcast that very attractive matchup.
Other potential mandatory title bouts HBO should try to snag include the Sor Rungvisai-Juan Estrada rematch (natch!), Dmitry Bivol vs. Badou Jack, Eleider Alvarez vs. Anthony Yarde, Golovkin vs. Ryoto Murata (if GGG beats Canelo next month), Berchelt vs. Mickey Roman, and Isaac Dogboe vs. Diego De La Hoya.
Wȁɍɍȅn also promotes (or reps) Tyson Fury, Carl Frampton, Josh Warrington, and Yarde, all of whom are could help make for significant fights on HBO. (Sign me up for Frampy or Warrington vs. Joseph Diaz Jr.)
Zanfer also promotes Berchelt, who can make for some excellent scraps at 130 and 135 pounds. Berchelt vs. Roman, Francisco Vargas (rematch) or even up at lightweight vs. Jorge Linares are all good fights.
I think Bivol is a keeper for the network. Bivol vs. Jack, Yarde, and Joe Smith Jr. are all scorchers.
And down at “SuperFly,” I think along with the SSR-JFE rematch, getting the winners of McWilliams Arroyo-Kazuto Ioka and Donnie Nietes-Aston Palicte to fight should be imperative, along with getting the return of Chocolatito Gonzalez and some new 115-pound blood (such as former WBC flyweight titleholder Daigo Higa and Australian standout Andrew Moloney) to join the franchise.
Oh, and Alexsandr Usyk, who fought twice on HBO prior to entering the WBSS tournament, is out there.
Beyond the established fighters, there are a dozen young, prospects with real potential that are available (half of whom fight for Golden Boy, such as Ryan Garcia, Vergil Ortiz, Lamont Roach Jr. and Alexis Rocha) and could use HBO’s help in their pro development and exposure (once they prove themselves ready and worthy on other platforms).
I have no idea if any of these suggestions are feasible but I do know that time is running out for HBO.