BoxRec

Who wins if they fight in 1943 at middleweight

I'd lean towards Robinson, and I say that as a diehard Archie Moore fanatic.

At middleweight, SRR decisions Moore, but at light heavyweight, Moore most likely to decision SRR.

I'd go with Robinson just, he was schooling Maxim before succumbing to the heat, Moore had 3 dominant wins over Maxim himself but i'd say Robinson was doing a better job

Robinson weighed an average of 145 or less pounds during his fights in 1943.

Moore weighed an average of 159 1/2 during his fights in 1943.


Robinson didn't win the welterweight title (147 pounds) until 1946..

During his fights in that same year 1946, Moore weighed an average of 172 plus a fraction pounds.

That info is important to accurately assess the chances of these two fighters.


Hopefully the future responses will reflect a decided change in the opinion pool regarding this specific question.

Unless the weight drain would be too much to imagine Archie being effective at MW.

As great a fighter as he was, Robinson had trouble with fighters who were physically unusually strong (and good fighters also):

Middleweights as strong as a 200 pounder--Gene Fullmer, Jake La Motta, Tiger Jones, Randy Turpin (who was extremely strong).

Robinson had two fights with an extremely strong welterweight, Marty Servo, and according to some who saw those fights there was nothing to choose between them (Robinson got the decision both times).

Robinson made a bad mistake when he took the leap to fight a championship level 175 pounder, Joey Maxim.

Maxim fought Jersey Joe Walcott three times without getting knocked out, lost a fifteen round decision to heavyweight champion Ezzard Charles for the heavyweight title.

Fighting 157 pound Robinson would be a joke to him.

Robinson found out as early as the second round that he had no knockout punch against a top level light heavyweigtht like Maxim,

Heavyweights like Curtis Sheppard said that Maxim was so strong that if he wanted to tie you up, there was nothing you could do about it.

Robinson also obviously assumed that it would take groups of punches to hurt a fighter like Maxim.
The result was that he overworked himself and punched himself out long before the fight was over.

Meanwhile every time he was hit by Maxim he was getting hit by a full grown 175 pounder.

Notice that Robinson learned his lesson, and never fought another light heavyweight.

Archie Moore said of Maxim:
https://www.boxingoverbroadway.com/a-fe ... hie-moore/

"Joey Maxim was a difficult boxer to fight because he knew so much about defense. Joe was 99% defense. And Joe was very durable and tough. "

I think at one point there were plans to match the 2 up around the time Moore had defeated Joey Maxim. for the title
in 1954-55.

scorpio83 wrote: ↑12 Sep 2018, 04:38 At middleweight, SRR decisions Moore, but at light heavyweight, Moore most likely to decision SRR.

I'd agree

gilgamesh wrote: ↑13 Sep 2018, 17:52

scorpio83 wrote: ↑12 Sep 2018, 04:38 At middleweight, SRR decisions Moore, but at light heavyweight, Moore most likely to decision SRR.

I'd agree

Thanks my man.

theres two ways to hit a guys kidney with a right hand.

when you twist your hips to shoulder roll, you bring your shoulder in front of your jaw. but when you twist your hips to shoulder roll, you have to turn your back too, exposing your kidney to right hands.



and when you bend your waist to roll and weave under punches, your head may move, but your back wont, and so can be hit by right hands thrown downwardly.



archie moore was hard to hit.



but maybe not so hard to hit by a ray robsinsion speciality. the candy cane.

Sugar Ray Robinson pubicly challeged Archie Moore at least twice.
Right after Ray Robisnon defeated Bobo Olson for the second time in May 1956
and a few months afterr he defeated Carmen Basilo the second time in 1958
and wanted to fight Archie Moore for the LH title in 1959 rather then a rubber match with Basilio.
Archie Moore priced himself out of it I think.
check out this article from 2005.
concerning a early type of "pay-per-view".
https://www.tss.ib.tv/articles-of-2005/ ... r-happened

Cojimar 1946 wrote: ↑12 Sep 2018, 02:04 Who wins if they fight in 1943 at middleweight

Ray in a close fight. Big if.

Moore would win. Too much weight for Robinson to give up to such a skilled fighter.

I would pick Robinson. Moore was not a great middleweight. He was better at light heavy. He lost to Arron Wade and Jack Chase that year. It probably would have been a close fight, but Robinson speed would probably make the difference.