BoxRec

drunkenpiper36 wrote: ↑26 Sep 2018, 14:54 Let’s say Povetkin fought in place Holmes from 1978-1985, facing his exact list of opponents. How does he do ?

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑26 Sep 2018, 15:33

drunkenpiper36 wrote: ↑26 Sep 2018, 14:54 Let’s say Povetkin fought in place Holmes from 1978-1985, facing his exact list of opponents. How does he do ?

1978 Holmes fought Shavers & Norton... So off the bat Povetkin fails... 1979-1980 only Shavers poses a challenge... 1981-1983 only Cooney & Witherspoon pose a threat & considering Povetkin had trouble with much taller Klitschko, Joshua, and Price I'd argue Cooney takes Povetkin and 'Spoon was (and is) underrated... 1984-1986, nobody poses a threat to Povetkin & as much as I like Spinks he'd get splattered.

evrenb wrote: ↑26 Sep 2018, 17:38 I would pick the following over Povetkin

Shavers = One of my favorite fighters but not that durable of a chin. Povetkin wins by ko
Norton= The Norton who fought Holmes clearly beats Povetkin
Weaver= Good fighter far from great but too inconsistent. Povetkin wins a wide decision
Berbick= Again too inconsistent but more skill than Weaver it could go either way depending on which Weaver shows up
Snipes a pick.em= Povetkin wins late ko
Cooney= Cooney wins a decision
Witherspoon = Easy win for Witherspoon
James Smith= Povetkin wide decision
Carl Williams= The Williams who faced Holmes beats Povetkin by decision
Michael Spinks= Pick em

tiny_acres wrote: ↑26 Sep 2018, 23:20

evrenb wrote: ↑26 Sep 2018, 17:38 I would pick the following over Povetkin

Shavers = One of my favorite fighters but not that durable of a chin. Povetkin wins by ko
Norton= The Norton who fought Holmes clearly beats Povetkin
Weaver= Good fighter far from great but too inconsistent. Povetkin wins a wide decision
Berbick= Again too inconsistent but more skill than Weaver it could go either way depending on which Weaver shows up
Snipes a pick.em= Povetkin wins late ko
Cooney= Cooney wins a decision
Witherspoon = Easy win for Witherspoon
James Smith= Povetkin wide decision
Carl Williams= The Williams who faced Holmes beats Povetkin by decision
Michael Spinks= Pick em

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑01 Oct 2018, 13:44 Wow, never seen anyone cite Imamu Mayfield as a notable win, so this is a first.

Huffing & puffing Povetkin would have to lose the doughy physique to achieve anything like a similar record in the 70s and 80s. That crop were in the Don King monopoly, where they were all thrown in against each other (unless one had a WBC belt and the other a WBA belt, sadly) and often went 10, 12 and 15 at a romp. Povetkin meanwhile is a product of the modern era, with fragmented promoters protecting their cash cows, building their records, and only putting them in a 50/50 fight once or twice in their whole careers (in Pov's case, the two he lost). Pov's lack of top level opp is probably why at the age of 39 he still lacked the experience to take a knee or ride out rough patches when hurt. Perhaps he could pack his steroids before stepping into the time machine? Who I see beating him:

Shavers whacks him
Norton whacks him
Weaver way too much man for him, especially down the stretch
Shavers whacks him again
Berbick way too strong & sturdy & game for him
Snipes too fit, durable & game for him
Cooney hammers him
Witherspoon beats him easily--easily!--IQ, skill set, chin, power, all way too high for pov to handle
Bonecrusher I bet finds his chin at some point and Pov doesn't recover; Pov certainly isn't denting him
Williams outpoints him
Spinks utterly befuddles him, stops a tired dispirited Pov late as Pov isn't cut out for 15 rounders

evrenb wrote: ↑01 Oct 2018, 14:25

Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑01 Oct 2018, 13:44 Wow, never seen anyone cite Imamu Mayfield as a notable win, so this is a first.

Huffing & puffing Povetkin would have to lose the doughy physique to achieve anything like a similar record in the 70s and 80s. That crop were in the Don King monopoly, where they were all thrown in against each other (unless one had a WBC belt and the other a WBA belt, sadly) and often went 10, 12 and 15 at a romp. Povetkin meanwhile is a product of the modern era, with fragmented promoters protecting their cash cows, building their records, and only putting them in a 50/50 fight once or twice in their whole careers (in Pov's case, the two he lost). Pov's lack of top level opp is probably why at the age of 39 he still lacked the experience to take a knee or ride out rough patches when hurt. Perhaps he could pack his steroids before stepping into the time machine? Who I see beating him:

Shavers whacks him
Norton whacks him
Weaver way too much man for him, especially down the stretch
Shavers whacks him again
Berbick way too strong & sturdy & game for him
Snipes too fit, durable & game for him
Cooney hammers him
Witherspoon beats him easily--easily!--IQ, skill set, chin, power, all way too high for pov to handle
Bonecrusher I bet finds his chin at some point and Pov doesn't recover; Pov certainly isn't denting him
Williams outpoints him
Spinks utterly befuddles him, stops a tired dispirited Pov late as Pov isn't cut out for 15 rounders

I think we match 100%

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑01 Oct 2018, 16:08 Be "considerably larger" is not an advantage at all in heavyweight fights. In the real world anyway.

Everyone remembers Marvis Frazier for his two bad losses. Really, you can look at some of his other fights, it's not hard at all to think that he would have beaten Povetkin.

TuanJim- I pretty much agree with the guys that you mentioned. Can't believe that people think Michael Spinks might lose to him.

BroughtonRulesRefuge wrote: ↑01 Oct 2018, 12:13 - This thread deserves better, so here ‘tis.

First, two more disparate fighters cannot be imagined. Povetkin was a highly credentialed Olympic Gold superheavy gold medalist turning pro to great expectations. One year in he KOed a former champ Imamu Mayfield, and then two years in he beat consecutively, Larry Donald, Chris Byrd, and Eddie Chambers, who combined for a record of 112-7-4.

It took Lar 3 years to fight his first fringe contender after washing out of the Olympic trials courtesy of a KO by Dwayn Bobick. It was five years before he could beat his first former contender, Shavers, that led to his Ken Norton WBC one point split decision challenge that many think he lost.

In the meantime, Povetkin seemed to suffer a crisis of confidence with Wlad being the dominant champ. He was still winning, but from 2009-2011 imported loonytunes Teddy Atlas who brow beat Mike Tyson’s style into him. That project being an abject failure, saw him ditch Atlas and his promoter Saureland to go with Russian Rabinsky, and fortified with new trainers and belief in himself, he started on a tear, beating the former champ for his first title 6 years after turning pro. It’s fair to say pretitle Povetkin mullers every one of Lar’s pretitle comp as his comp also does.

However, by now it should be noted the Povetkin that passed through the Atlas 2.0 version is now at his current 3.0 version. Against Norton on his last legs, I’d have to favor Povetkin who was starting a late fight by fight improvement program, but it’s really a 50/50 fight, especially if we go 15 rds that would favor Norton. Assuming the win though, he could easily walk through the next 11 Lar “contenders,” go look em up. Don’t want to call grown men weaklings, but Lar never fought the top WBA guys for a reason. So Cooney becomes the first obstacle. I’d like to favor Cooney, but facts are as talented as he was, mentally he was in the same Povetkin 2.0 phase with not a lot of belief in himself. He never got to 3.0.

Povetkin then beats the next two, but then runs into Witherspoon, only 15-0, a baby, but a really tough highly skilled baby. Spoon could possibly beat Povetkin like he did Lar only to lose on the cards. It’s pretty clear by now that Lar ain’t all there anymore, but Povetkin could whoop his next five until he gets to Michael Spinks, and that is the most likely guy to beat Povetkin, an highly educated boxer/puncher with an awkward style.

After Spinks, Povetkin gets blasted out by Young Tyson, but not as bad as Lar was. After that, all becomes a farce of sorts, but I doubt Povetkin stays around long enough to call out Butterbean only to suffer such a humiliating knockdown as Lar. I also figure the title version of Povetkin whoops the title Lar 2 of 3. And of course the pretitle Povetkin whoops the pretitle Lar most every time, but we can't factually know until Valhalla, so until then...the end.