BoxRec

Prime Frazier vs. prime Holyfield, 15 rounds. Who wins?

Amazing fight, unleashes my imagination.

Obviously (I'm the first one to post, so I can state it before anyone else does: it's a dirty job but somebody has to do it):
Holyfield has the reach-advantage and the greatest p4p physical assets in a boxer I can remember after Roy Jones Jr., but Frazier had more robust complexion, fighting at around 200lbs while Holyfield started at below-190...
So, it's as much as a close fight as any can be (and I'm sceptical about fantasy-fights when the class is so close):

Holyfield could box but Frazier hit harder; Frazier's hooks are dangerous to call it a euphemism, but Holyfield had quite a chin; Frazier was used to fight for 15 rounds, but Holyfield could suck it up (you made it to 30, make it to 31, as we say)... you pick other similar/peculiar features.

Bottom-line: I'd pick Holyfield on a slight decision.

Two fierce brawlers, who were just coming out there to fight. Holyfield could box rationally though, but probably this matchup would have been wrong case for being cautious, cause that style kinda allowed Frazier to establish an effective pressure. Ali and Ellis were mauled by Frazier. It's actually a pretty unique case, cause logically you gotta box against such swarming, hard-hitting monsters, trying to outfight them is a suicidal option, but as it was seen, Frazier had his worst moment, when someone fought him. Bonavena fight was troublesome, Foreman crushed Joe. Holyfield could fight Frazier back, he would have done exactly this most likely. And it's pretty hard to figure out, who would have won in such battle.

We had this match 2 years back....

evrenb wrote: ↑30 Dec 2018, 12:28 We had this match 2 years back....

Sorry, I wasn't there.

Didn't see earlier thread on this, so I appreciate the post. What a freakin' fight! I'm glad I'm not going first. Holyfield such a warrier, but he just wasn't powerful enough to keep Joe off of him, nor to really hurt Frazier. I'm going with Frazier on late TKO as in his prime, he was just too much of everything. Closest comparison I could figure is Holyfield v. Qawi I. And Frazier is levels above Qawi.

oogiebe wrote: ↑30 Dec 2018, 18:29 Didn't see earlier thread on this, so I appreciate the post. What a freakin' fight! I'm glad I'm not going first. Holyfield such a warrier, but he just wasn't powerful enough to keep Joe off of him, nor to really hurt Frazier. I'm going with Frazier on late TKO as in his prime, he was just too much of everything. Closest comparison I could figure is Holyfield v. Qawi I. And Frazier is levels above Qawi.

Actually good points. Frazier had a pretty good chin, in fact even after being dropped by Foreman for numerous amount of times, he was never out. Holyfield's punching power was good, but it wouldn't be enough to KO Joe. Evander's chin was excellent though, however, Frazier's power could be enough to KO Holyfield. And there were a lot of opportunities for Frazier to land his money punch through the whole distance.

DrDuke wrote: ↑30 Dec 2018, 21:37

oogiebe wrote: ↑30 Dec 2018, 18:29 Didn't see earlier thread on this, so I appreciate the post. What a freakin' fight! I'm glad I'm not going first. Holyfield such a warrier, but he just wasn't powerful enough to keep Joe off of him, nor to really hurt Frazier. I'm going with Frazier on late TKO as in his prime, he was just too much of everything. Closest comparison I could figure is Holyfield v. Qawi I. And Frazier is levels above Qawi.

Actually good points. Frazier had a pretty good chin, in fact even after being dropped by Foreman for numerous amount of times, he was never out. Holyfield's punching power was good, but it wouldn't be enough to KO Joe. Evander's chin was excellent though, however, Frazier's power could be enough to KO Holyfield. And there were a lot of opportunities for Frazier to land his money punch through the whole distance.

Really interesting matchup!

I think this has all the earmarks of the most brutal hypothetical of all.

Neither man wins, though one might end up with a decision of some sort, and neither fighter would do very well in their hypothetical future.

The crowd? Anyone who paid to see it? They would be the clear winners.

BoxBuzz wrote: ↑31 Dec 2018, 17:02 I think this has all the earmarks of the most brutal hypothetical of all.

Neither man wins, though one might end up with a decision of some sort, and neither fighter would do very well in their hypothetical future.

The crowd? Anyone who paid to see it? They would be the clear winners.

RIGHT!? Best "what if" fight I've seen here.

It would be an incredible fight. It's hard to back against Holyfield in a fight like this though given he has some physical advantages too. Neither guy would have to go looking for the other though so it would be brutal and closely fought the whole way.

None of the two would be questioned when it comes to heart, will and determination. In that department, both are top 3.

Evander Holyfield was the most complete boxer. Smokin'Joe was the better puncher. Each will had their moments. Lots of punches thrown. Compubox will have a busy night.

I can imagine Frazier's left hooks to Holyfield's chin. It would be very detrimental. By the end of the fight, Holyfield's family and friends won't recognize him. It would be a brutal affair. Frazier wins by late KO, around the 13th in one of boxing's greatest slugfests of all time!

DrDuke wrote: ↑30 Dec 2018, 21:37

oogiebe wrote: ↑30 Dec 2018, 18:29 Didn't see earlier thread on this, so I appreciate the post. What a freakin' fight! I'm glad I'm not going first. Holyfield such a warrier, but he just wasn't powerful enough to keep Joe off of him, nor to really hurt Frazier. I'm going with Frazier on late TKO as in his prime, he was just too much of everything. Closest comparison I could figure is Holyfield v. Qawi I. And Frazier is levels above Qawi.

Actually good points. Frazier had a pretty good chin, in fact even after being dropped by Foreman for numerous amount of times, he was never out. Holyfield's punching power was good, but it wouldn't be enough to KO Joe. Evander's chin was excellent though, however, Frazier's power could be enough to KO Holyfield. And there were a lot of opportunities for Frazier to land his money punch through the whole distance.

Evanders hook was tighter, he hurt everyone he fought. Holy field was always in punching position, amazing footwork. Gotta favor him, but Joe could wear him down to the body.

It also seems to me that as the fight progresses, The Real Deal looks like he's tiring. But, his heart, will and determination keeps him into the fight. I could see him winning the first three rounds because he was a fast starter.

As for Smokin'Joe, he was like a motor. He was a slow starter. As the fight progresses, the more relentless he became. And when he was in all cylinders, oh boy! He was hard to keep him off you. He just kept coming and coming. He was like a train. Holyfield wilts by round 13th because Smokin'Joe's pressure was too much.

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑04 Jan 2019, 04:06

DrDuke wrote: ↑30 Dec 2018, 21:37

oogiebe wrote: ↑30 Dec 2018, 18:29 Didn't see earlier thread on this, so I appreciate the post. What a freakin' fight! I'm glad I'm not going first. Holyfield such a warrier, but he just wasn't powerful enough to keep Joe off of him, nor to really hurt Frazier. I'm going with Frazier on late TKO as in his prime, he was just too much of everything. Closest comparison I could figure is Holyfield v. Qawi I. And Frazier is levels above Qawi.

Actually good points. Frazier had a pretty good chin, in fact even after being dropped by Foreman for numerous amount of times, he was never out. Holyfield's punching power was good, but it wouldn't be enough to KO Joe. Evander's chin was excellent though, however, Frazier's power could be enough to KO Holyfield. And there were a lot of opportunities for Frazier to land his money punch through the whole distance.

Evanders hook was tighter, he hurt everyone he fought. Holy field was always in punching position, amazing footwork. Gotta favor him, but Joe could wear him down to the body.

Tyson said that Holyfield didn't hit so hard... Evander was just hitting Mike fastidiously often: that's what led "Iron" Mike biting his ear, out of frustration, according to Tyson himself obviously: that interview was pretty much fun.

I believe that Holyfield's main asset, against Frazier, wouldn't be his punching power, but his fundamental boxing skills.

elmersalsa wrote: ↑04 Jan 2019, 05:26 As for Smokin'Joe, he was like a motor. He was a slow starter. As the fight progresses, the more relentless he became. And when he was in all cylinders, oh boy! He was hard to keep him off you. He just kept coming and coming. He was like a train. Holyfield wilts by round 13th because Smokin'Joe's pressure was too much.

Olympic heavyweight gold, nevertheless.

Jacopodb wrote: ↑04 Jan 2019, 09:49

elmersalsa wrote: ↑04 Jan 2019, 05:26 As for Smokin'Joe, he was like a motor. He was a slow starter. As the fight progresses, the more relentless he became. And when he was in all cylinders, oh boy! He was hard to keep him off you. He just kept coming and coming. He was like a train. Holyfield wilts by round 13th because Smokin'Joe's pressure was too much.

Olympic heavyweight gold, nevertheless.

Yes, indeed! Smokin' Joe accomplished a lot in boxing in such a little time. A top 10 all time heavyweight and a top 50 pound per pound all time great. A great, great fighter!

elmersalsa wrote: ↑05 Jan 2019, 11:26

Jacopodb wrote: ↑04 Jan 2019, 09:49

elmersalsa wrote: ↑04 Jan 2019, 05:26 As for Smokin'Joe, he was like a motor. He was a slow starter. As the fight progresses, the more relentless he became. And when he was in all cylinders, oh boy! He was hard to keep him off you. He just kept coming and coming. He was like a train. Holyfield wilts by round 13th because Smokin'Joe's pressure was too much.

Olympic heavyweight gold, nevertheless.

Yes, indeed! Smokin' Joe accomplished a lot in boxing in such a little time. A top 10 all time heavyweight and a top 50 pound per pound all time great. A great, great fighter!

All that, plus: fighting in a tougher era, for heavyweights, than today's: throw Wilder, Fury and Joshua in the bunch with the likes of: Frazier, Alí, Foreman, Norton and Larry Holmes... and try to figure!

Frazier and Holmes aren't from the same era. Frazier was done by the time Holmes emerged as a top contender.

Cojimar 1946 wrote: ↑06 Jan 2019, 15:38 Frazier and Holmes aren't from the same era. Frazier was done by the time Holmes emerged as a top contender.

Eh...Holmes was a name by late 1976-1977. Certainly no overlap of prime, but he did beat Shavers and Norton in 1978. Frazier was done in 1976, and probably 1975 after the "thrilla!"