BoxRec

Shot.

keithmoonhangover wrote: ↑02 Sep 2019, 09:54 Shot.

Significantly worse than before, esp in terms of chin and reflexes

someone who is past his prime or just a punch

The first thing that comes into my head is - the ability to take a punch is either diminished or not what it was compared to before

Shot means past prime for good and all, being beyond a decent level of a competition.

Btw, losing an ability to take punch is different.

For me a shot fighter is someone significantly past their best, usually down to age or too many wars.

To me it means your well past your best, Kevin Johnson for example.

Shot for me means they have lost a lot of their former abilities, reflexes, fitness, speed, desire, motivation and ability to take a decent punch. Basically cannon fodder and unable to compete at the level they used to. Ali was shot against Holmes as an example.

gregregegg wrote: ↑02 Sep 2019, 12:03 To me it means your well past your best, Kevin Johnson for example.

I wouldn't call him shot because of his ability to get through fights unscathed and still has a decent chin.

Of course I would say he is well past his best, but then as well that has a lot to do with his lack of ambition

Attributes in unison, anyone who's less than two-thirds as good as they were in their prime.

Post-'12 Haye's a classic, in that everything about him was a bit worse, but collectively that was enough to make him — by his own peak standards — shot. Froch, on the other hand, was never shot. He declined and his reflexes were dulling, but he retired at maybe 80%. I'd put Groves right on the borderline against Smith.

You have to be pretty handy in the first place and a shadow of your former self to qualify as - shot - Errol Christie would be an example.

I think of Pinklon Thomas v Tommy Morrison as the perfect example. Thomas was shot to pieces by the time Morrison knocked seven bells out of him.

Being well past your best, with a corresponding and significant drop in what level you are able to win and be competitive at.

Someone like Kovalev is past his best but not shot, as he's still getting it done at a high level around what he was before, just with more blips.

Whereas David Haye getting battered by Bellew and outclassed in every way in the rematch is clearly a shot fighter.

THEBUTCH wrote: ↑02 Sep 2019, 13:11 I think of Pinklon Thomas v Tommy Morrison as the perfect example. Thomas was shot to pieces by the time Morrison knocked seven bells out of him.

perfect example

I like to categorize the terms.

A lot of the time you see people call someone "Shot" when what they should say is "Faded"

Povetkin right now for instance is faded, but I wouldn't quite call him shot (though I saw some people referring to him as such). If he were shot he wouldn't have beaten Hughie.

Shot fighters aren't able to beat ANYONE with any slight name value. Shot fighters may struggle to even beat guys with mediocre journeyman records even though they used to be Champions.

To me a Shot fighter is a guy that's not even half of what he used to be, and probably isn't even Top 40 anymore.

He has name recognition, and nothing more.

Beyond repair.

A "shot" fighter is one who shouldn't be fighting anymore for their own benefit. They have minimal punch resistance and are an embarrassment in the ring as compared to their former prowess. Ali vs Holmes.

beyond the point of no return

A switch’s is flicked, they unconsciously decide they don’t want to do it anymore, and continue for the money. It starts with the lack of desire....

From there they don’t train as hard as they once did, and when you do that, you lose your ring fitness, which does for your durability, as when you are absolutely blowing out your arse through lack of fitness, AND don’t want to be there, the easy way out is the route you take. Reflexes go with fitness.


It’s more mental I reckon.




Can we name a shot fighter who turned the clock back?

Past it.

Just isnt capable of competing at the level they fought at or even a slightly lower level.

Danny Williams for example is a great example. He is a prime candidate of what a shot fighter looks like and fights like.

SAPFO wrote: ↑02 Sep 2019, 16:38 A switch’s is flicked, they unconsciously decide they don’t want to do it anymore, and continue for the money. It starts with the lack of desire....

From there they don’t train as hard as they once did, and when you do that, you lose your ring fitness, which does for your durability, as when you are absolutely blowing out your arse through lack of fitness, AND don’t want to be there, the easy way out is the route you take. Reflexes go with fitness.


It’s more mental I reckon.




Can we name a shot fighter who turned the clock back?

No, because there’s never been one, it’s an impossibility - Because the term shot to me means the chin and legs have gone, there’s been a short circuit. The man can no longer hold a shot.
As opposed to a fighter who has just stopped training, or lost his desire, because that you can regain. That’s not shot in the true sense.

A shot fighter would be a beast like John Mugabi, who can go toe to toe with a man like Marvin Hagler, but then a few years later can no longer hold a punch and has stiff legs that collapse after just a few shots.

Eubank was past his best by Collins in '95, but managed a great performance against Thompson in '98. It's one of the rare examples of moving up in weight doing a fighter good.

Thompson versus Rothmann and Haye?

gilgamesh wrote: ↑02 Sep 2019, 15:52To me a Shot fighter is a guy that's not even half of what he used to be, and probably isn't even Top 40 anymore.

He has name recognition, and nothing more.

Let's go, champ!

Cleveland williams

How about Dean Francis, in that he was shot in comparison to his pre-injury days when he had a decent run?

Grilling Machine wrote: ↑02 Sep 2019, 18:27 Eubank was past his best by Collins in '95, but managed a great performance against Thompson in '98. It's one of the rare examples of moving up in weight doing a fighter good.

Thompson versus Rothmann and Haye?

gilgamesh wrote: ↑02 Sep 2019, 15:52To me a Shot fighter is a guy that's not even half of what he used to be, and probably isn't even Top 40 anymore.

He has name recognition, and nothing more.

Let's go, champ!

Yeah, he hid it better than most by scraping the bottom of the barrel, and always at least LOOKING formidable, but yeah people didn't need to see it again after Vitali nearly killed him.