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Marvin Hart Interim Champion?
Posted: 30 Nov 2019, 04:10
by danundisputed
Hi,
through my research I discovered a confusing detail about Marvin Hart.
I found a trading card, which says on its backside -Marvin Hart-Interim Champ
its form 1956. The following text says:
When Jim Jeffries retired in 1905, he named Marvin Hart and Jack Root the leading contenders for his crown,
offering to referee the bout at Reno, July 3, 1905. Hart stopped Root in 12 rounds for title but his stay on top was short.
On Feb. 23, 1906, Tommy Burns, the Canadian who was walloping all corners, beat Hart in 20-round bout ar L.A. for the coveted Championship belt.
So the question is: What made Hart Interim Champ? He became champion against Root and lost the title to Burns.
How long was his reign as "Interim Champ". Please bring some light in this, any information and detail is welcome, thanks.
Re: Marvin Hart Interim Champion?
Posted: 30 Nov 2019, 06:05
by AntonioMartin
Back in those days, a lot of words like that were used pretty loosely. For example, sometimes people were named of a nationality that in reality they were not-in those cases usually out of evil racism. This may have been a case of a word being used like that.
To me Hart is a champion just like other Marvin's like Camel, Johnson and Hagler. .
Re: Marvin Hart Interim Champion?
Posted: 02 Dec 2019, 08:59
by BitPlayer
I don't think Hart's claim is any stronger than Maher's
Re: Marvin Hart Interim Champion?
Posted: 02 Dec 2019, 11:56
by Ambling Alp II
I would argue that Maher had a better claim.
Maher was "named" champion by Corbett, without winning a title fight.
Hardly anyone considered Maher the champion. Almost no one considered Fitzsimmons the champion right after beat Maher.
Corbett ultimately decided that he wasn't retired anyway.
Jeffries was really retired, so the title was vacant.
Hart-Root fight was considered by some people as for the title.
Burns was considered the champion after beat Hart.
Re: Marvin Hart Interim Champion?
Posted: 06 Dec 2019, 11:49
by mattdonnellon
Corbett was at the Maher-O'Donnell fight with the intention of awarding the crown to Steve, Maher ruined the show. Actually, quite a reasonable amount of people accepted Peter as champion, spurious as the claim was. Maher himself rejected it and Fitz, when he beat Maher, also dismissed his own claim, both wishing to fight Corbett. Jeff did referee the fight but always denied championing Hart the champion.
In light of the current Alpha bullshit, both claims have some merit. Fitz and Maher were the two top contenders, Corbett was retired, Hart and Root were arguably the top two as well.
Re: Marvin Hart Interim Champion?
Posted: 07 Dec 2019, 01:37
by AntonioMartin
For what it's worth, the World Almanac recognized Hart as a world champion as did Ring Magazine, and the Hart-Root fight as for the vacant title.
Re: Marvin Hart Interim Champion?
Posted: 07 Dec 2019, 07:30
by SteveO
AntonioMartin wrote: ↑07 Dec 2019, 01:37
For what it's worth, the World Almanac recognized Hart as a world champion as did Ring Magazine, and the Hart-Root fight as for the vacant title.

Re: Marvin Hart Interim Champion?
Posted: 07 Dec 2019, 07:38
by Tuan_Jim
Growing up Marvin Hart was always on the list of heavyweight champions in everything I read on the subject.
Re: Marvin Hart Interim Champion?
Posted: 07 Dec 2019, 09:20
by Onetimeonly
Tuan_Jim wrote: ↑07 Dec 2019, 07:38
Growing up Marvin Hart was always on the list of heavyweight champions in everything I read on the subject.
Yup, and derided. All in all he's probably a bit underrated.
Re: Marvin Hart Interim Champion?
Posted: 30 Dec 2019, 01:44
by HomicideHenry
This is where the term LINEAL champion really comes into play here. Many people did not accept Hart or Burns as the true champion, or for that matter Johnson. It wasn't until Jeffries lost to Johnson was he ever accepted as the real, true, legitimate, lineal champion.
This same logic was also used when Joe Louis retired. Charles was not accepted until he actually beat Louis, when the Brown Bomber made a comeback. Furthermore, during that timeframe, Great Britain appointed Lee Savold as being the world's champion, refusing to acknowledge Charles--- until Louis, fresh from his defeat at Charles' hands, kayoed Lee Savold.
That being said, Hart & Burns have been considered lineal champions at least for the passed 50-75 years. It's not technically correct, so the card denoting Hart as "interim" is factually correct since he never won the title from Jeffries, and until Jeffries was defeated, he was just a intermediary titleholder.
In a sense, there has been no true lineal champion since Gene Tunney, but the logic has always been you cannot really call yourself the man unless you beat the man--- unless "the man" is adamant that he's never coming back to compete and campaign as champion.
Then it comes down to either who has the most belts or who has had the longest reign or who had the better quality opposition overall in comparison to the other belt holders. Consider Larry Holmes. He never had the WBA title, but he was "the man" because he not only beat the shadow of Ali but because of 20 title defenses over seven years, even though he initially won the WBC title against a man (Norton) who was only champion by a political decision.
That same logic applies to both of the Klitschko brothers, at different times, even though they never really beat the man (Lennox Lewis) to become the man, nor did they fight eachother. However, Wladimir Klitschko by sheer volume of defenses and having been undefeated for ten years was without question the lineal champion after Lennox Lewis rather than his brother Vitali Klitschko.
Re: Marvin Hart Interim Champion?
Posted: 30 Dec 2019, 12:31
by Ambling Alp II
I remember as a kid we had an old encyclopedia that listed the heavyweight champions. I think it went from Corbett to Frazier. It listed every time the title changed hands.
I remember Hart not being listed. (Burns and the Burns-Hart fight was.) It surprised me because everywhere else that I had seen listed Hart.