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Occasions when the world's top two in a division faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 12:56
by Cholo_cws
I've been wondering how often this has been the case. What fights can you name? Obviously subjectivity plays a part but was your pick was the consensus numbers one and two in the world at the time (or at least up for serious debate)? Avoid hindsight - a boxer may have gone on to do great things later in their career but this is about the time of the fight.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 13:07
by maverick23
Calzaghe vs Kessler is the one that springs to mind.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 13:08
by Ruthless-RKO
maverick23 wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 13:07
Calzaghe vs Kessler is the one that springs to mind.
That’s the exact one I was thinking off..
Very difficult to think..
We’ve have fights like AJ-Klit, Usyk-Bellew but non meet this criteria..
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 13:18
by Steveh583
i suppose you could make a case for haye vs enzo at the time.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 13:22
by jameswilson
Steveh583 wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 13:18
i suppose you could make a case for haye vs enzo at the time.
Yeah despite being against not the best opposition Enzo had multiple WT defences and Haye had beaten the lineal unified champ. Cunningham from memory won the IBF but I think it was something like he lost a split decision in a vacant title fight and then won the rematch.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 13:24
by margaret thatcher
cunn had beat huck, guillermo jones, and wlod by that time....pisses all over anything enzo did. even in defeat mormeck had done far more than enzo, and there were other solid guys around. though tbf im not sure what the consensus was at the time. maybe enzo was really overrated to the point of being #2, but he was never genuinely the 2nd best in the world
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 13:29
by Cholo_cws
Steveh583 wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 13:18
i suppose you could make a case for haye vs enzo at the time.
Certainly. It's difficult in the multi-belt era when there's few matchups between the top boxers to have clear cut rankings.
I can think of a fight involving a sadly recently deceased boxer who came to these shores some time ago.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 13:35
by Cholo_cws
margaret thatcher wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 13:24
cunn had beat huck, guillermo jones, and wlod by that time....pisses all over anything enzo did. even in defeat mormeck had done far more than enzo, and there were other solid guys around. though tbf im not sure what the consensus was at the time. maybe enzo was really overrated to the point of being #2, but he was never genuinely the 2nd best in the world
Agreed. Got a feeling The Ring saw Enzo at #4 or #5.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 13:37
by Coco
Cholo_cws wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 13:29
Steveh583 wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 13:18
i suppose you could make a case for haye vs enzo at the time.
Certainly. It's difficult in the multi-belt era when there's few matchups between the top boxers to have clear cut rankings.
I can think of a fight involving a sadly recently deceased boxer who came to these shores some time ago.
Enzo had beaten Big Truck
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 13:38
by Coco
JC v BHop, scrub that, not UK!
Maybe Taylor in fights coming up.
I guess JC v Left Hook
Hatton v KT
McGuigan v Pedroza
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 13:49
by knockout
Hard to figure out who the top fighters at super middle were in late 2000.
Calzaghe and Woodhall were certainly up there when they fought. ( despite woodhalls loss to Beyer who then lost himself) . Ottke obviously unbeaten so had a solid claim to number 1 .
Reid was pretty solid still when he fought Calzaghe too
A lot of inconsistent fighters on a merry go round making it hard to rank them .
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 14:09
by stujones
knockout wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 13:49
Hard to figure out who the top fighters at super middle were in late 2000.
Calzaghe and Woodhall were certainly up there when they fought. ( despite woodhalls loss to Beyer who then lost himself) . Ottke obviously unbeaten so had a solid claim to number 1 .
Reid was pretty solid still when he fought Calzaghe too
A lot of inconsistent fighters on a merry go round making it hard to rank them .
Nah you can't really have Woodhall and Reid at #2 as they had just lost (and pretty clearly). Ottke was #2 until he retired.
Definately Kessler, possibly Lacy though.
What about Froch - when did Ward move up? Could Froch vs Bute or Froch vs Kessler 2 be a case?
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 14:13
by stujones
Coco wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 13:38
JC v BHop, scrub that, not UK!
Maybe Taylor in fights coming up.
I guess JC v Left Hook
Hatton v KT
McGuigan v Pedroza
Taylor vs Prograis is a good shout.
Hatton vs KT - I would say Hatton was knocking on the door but wasn't clear #2
McGuigan vs Pedroza - Nelson would have to be there.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 15:21
by garethhop
Froch Vs Groves 2 couldnt be far off. The other two champs were Sakio Bika and Arthur Abraham.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 16:00
by 548273
If you are talking about the 2 best at the weight rather than the 2 best P4P, then I'd go for Minter vs Hagler
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 16:13
by coghaugen11
They’d have to hold all the belts between them.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 16:15
by coghaugen11
Coco wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 13:38
JC v BHop, scrub that, not UK!
Maybe Taylor in fights coming up.
I guess JC v Left Hook
Hatton v KT
McGuigan v Pedroza
You’re suggesting Hatton and McGuigan were above the other belt holders like Cotto, Mayweather and Azumah Nelson? Umm, how
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 17:25
by Cholo_cws
548273 wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 16:00
If you are talking about the 2 best at the weight rather than the 2 best P4P, then I'd go for Minter vs Hagler
Yes I meant the top two in the division. I've changed the thread title to make it clearer. Minter-Hagler was one I had in mind. earlier.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two in a division faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 17:35
by prewarboxing
Benny Lynch v Jackie Brown. 1935. Flyweight.
Miles Templeton
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 17:40
by kp13
garethhop wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 15:21
Froch Vs Groves 2 couldnt be far off. The other two champs were Sakio Bika and Arthur Abraham.
Andre Ward was still the WBA super champion at that time, and obviously still the best in the division. Froch/Groves was for the WBA regular belt.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two in a division faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 17:45
by prewarboxing
Lynch fought Brown in September 1935. Here are the Ring ratings for the month before :
Miles Templeton
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 17:45
by garethhop
kp13 wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 17:40
garethhop wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 15:21
Froch Vs Groves 2 couldnt be far off. The other two champs were Sakio Bika and Arthur Abraham.
Andre Ward was still the WBA super champion at that time, and obviously still the best in the division. Froch/Groves was for the WBA regular belt.
Ward was done at Super Middleweight at this point.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 17:48
by kp13
garethhop wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 17:45
kp13 wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 17:40
garethhop wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 15:21
Froch Vs Groves 2 couldnt be far off. The other two champs were Sakio Bika and Arthur Abraham.
Andre Ward was still the WBA super champion at that time, and obviously still the best in the division. Froch/Groves was for the WBA regular belt.
Ward was done at Super Middleweight at this point.
He still held the belt and was having promotional issues so couldn't fight, he was still a super-middleweight until he fought Paul Smith in 2015.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 18:03
by garethhop
kp13 wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 17:48
garethhop wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 17:45
kp13 wrote: ↑11 Aug 2021, 17:40
Andre Ward was still the WBA super champion at that time, and obviously still the best in the division. Froch/Groves was for the WBA regular belt.
Ward was done at Super Middleweight at this point.
He still held the belt and was having promotional issues so couldn't fight, he was still a super-middleweight until he fought Paul Smith in 2015.
At which point Paul Smith was a Super Heavyweight so my original point stands.
Re: Occasions when the world's top two in a division faced each other in the UK?
Posted: 11 Aug 2021, 18:05
by dr_devious
Hagler v Minter