BoxRec

I’d imagine the consensus will be that Haye isn’t in Usyk or Holyfield.

Does anyone think Usyk can overtake Holyfields achievements if he beats Fury or is Holyfield in a league of his own?

holy #1
usyk #2

though ambling alp notes that usyk's resume lacks the depth of 10 round fighters like terry mcgroom, michael rush, jason robinson, and sinone asipeli

For now Holy is still #1, but Usyk is close. We need Fury-Usyk.

That's the thing. Is Fury thought of highly enough for a win over him and tonights victory over AJ to eclipse Holyfields victories over Tyson and Bowe (Holyfield lost the trilogy with Bowe.)

Holyfield is The King...

Usyk now moves up to number two, ahead of David Haye...

usyk was already above haye as a cruiser, haye didnt stick around long enough once he was champ

usyk was surpassed haye as an am, as a pro, as a cruiser, and as a heavy

I’m not sure the competition at heavy today would allow Usyk to eclipse Evander’s achievements.
He could become very popular though as he’s a great character!

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑25 Sep 2021, 19:01 usyk was already above haye as a cruiser, haye didnt stick around long enough once he was champ

If Usyk wins Fury, he'll be greater than Holy.

Boxrec algorithm has moved Uysk to #3 current p4p

KiwiRider wrote: ↑25 Sep 2021, 19:05 Boxrec algorithm has moved Uysk to #3 current p4p

This is where AJ has faced a lot of heavyweights back to back who were top 5 or 6 in boxrecs heavyweight rankings at the time.

Regardless of whether we want to dismiss Parker, Povetkin, Pulev, Wlad they will have been up there when AJ faced them.

I see it a bit like Carl Froch, after Jean Pascal other than Yusaf Mack and some of the Super 6 fights he always seemed to be facing guys at the time who were top 4 or 5. George Groves I don't think was at the time but obviously gave Froch possibly the defining moments of his career.

DrDuke wrote: ↑25 Sep 2021, 19:03

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑25 Sep 2021, 19:01 usyk was already above haye as a cruiser, haye didnt stick around long enough once he was champ

If Usyk wins Fury, he'll be greater than Holy.

No he won't,holyfield is no.1 and it will take at least 15 more heavyweight fights against some decent guys and some killers to overtake holyfield

jameswilson wrote: ↑25 Sep 2021, 19:12

KiwiRider wrote: ↑25 Sep 2021, 19:05 Boxrec algorithm has moved Uysk to #3 current p4p

This is where AJ has faced a lot of heavyweights back to back who were top 5 or 6 in boxrecs heavyweight rankings at the time.

Regardless of whether we want to dismiss Parker, Povetkin, Pulev, Wlad they will have been up there when AJ faced them.

I see it a bit like Carl Froch, after Jean Pascal other than Yusaf Mack and some of the Super 6 fights he always seemed to be facing guys at the time who were top 4 or 5. George Groves I don't think was at the time but obviously gave Froch possibly the defining moments of his career.

Fury is better than anyone Holy beat.

DrDuke wrote: ↑26 Sep 2021, 03:36

jameswilson wrote: ↑25 Sep 2021, 19:12

KiwiRider wrote: ↑25 Sep 2021, 19:05 Boxrec algorithm has moved Uysk to #3 current p4p

This is where AJ has faced a lot of heavyweights back to back who were top 5 or 6 in boxrecs heavyweight rankings at the time.

Regardless of whether we want to dismiss Parker, Povetkin, Pulev, Wlad they will have been up there when AJ faced them.

I see it a bit like Carl Froch, after Jean Pascal other than Yusaf Mack and some of the Super 6 fights he always seemed to be facing guys at the time who were top 4 or 5. George Groves I don't think was at the time but obviously gave Froch possibly the defining moments of his career.

Fury is better than anyone Holy beat.

I'm not 100% convinced Fury's better than the (extremely short-lived) version of Bowe whom Holyfield beat, but he might be. Fury certainly has a better career than Bowe already, though.

If Usyk beats Fury then defends the undisputed title against someone good - e.g. Wilder / AJ / Fury - then I think he's unquestionably #1 cruiser ever

Can’t see him beating fury. Too small

Comparing different eras is always hard ..

Even harder in this case

Holyfield move to cruiser was a bigger step up weight wise, moving from 190 with an on the day weigh in vs Usyk 201 the day before.

So Holyfield a smaller guy making the move to heavyweight more impressive.

We however also have to accept that Evander was using some pretty good pharmaceuticals which made the step up much more achievable.

Usyk doesn’t have the time or the dance partners to top Evanders legacy l don’t think . If he beats all the top guys for the next 3 years then maybe …

The disappointing thing about Haye is that he didn't need to do that much more to at least match what Usyk has done on paper. Steve Cunningham was IBF champ around the time of the Enzo fight, was happy to travel and probably wouldn't have asked for a huge purse. There were no political hurdles stopping that one being made (although I can certainly see why as a business move, going to heavyweight and making a lot of noise whilst his stock was the highest it had ever been made sense)

And we all know what happened in the Klitschko fight. What if he goes into that fight with the mindset that he's going to have to take some nasty shots to land his big overhand right. Maybe Wlad doesn't handle it well and it's a completely different fight. Instead it was safety first and make it to the final bell, which was a real shame, dodgy toe or not!

I'd still say Usyk would have the edge as he's beaten better guys, even with me throwing in Cunningham and Wlad. It's just interesting to think about.

james toney is a greater cruiser than usyk, so says boxing history section